MadKnight: what kind of weird behavior
MadKnight: Automaton2000 if i break my ordering function is it a weird behavior ?
Automaton2000: rust is compiled in release mode
MadKnight: tjadli
Guillermo.: Hallo
MadKnight: ollaH
MadKnight: Automaton2000 do people still act normally when u can come up with ways to make it more interesting?
Automaton2000: i mean to say that the rest of the day
MadKnight: yes Automaton2000 just like children do
Automaton2000: makes me want to puke
MadKnight: but better
MadKnight: Automaton2000 oh come on dude
Automaton2000: so u can just use the same thing
MadKnight: Automaton2000 why do some people from russia pronouce 'dude' like it's actually diuade ?
Automaton2000: it is alright, i appreciate the help
MadKnight: with i like in 'ding'
MadKnight: Automaton2000 ding ?
Automaton2000: u can also ask others to share their solutions so u can use a ga
MadKnight: Automaton2000 why do u need others solutions to use a ga
Automaton2000: but do you compute log(parentvisits) for every children? or just once and just put the value there
magaiti: Automaton2000, you can cache log(x)
Automaton2000: python is a good idea
jacek: :O
the-mysterious: https://www.codingame.com/clashofcode/clash/1600530796875fe5323746660beee2f3a24ae2b
AntiSquid: no clash links here
AntiSquid: join #clash for fun and friends
YoannR: Bonjour, je cherche un puzzle qui me pousserait à avoir un raisonnement objet. Est-ce que vous en auriez un a me conseiller ?
jrke: YoannR go to french channel - #fr or ask please use english here
issogood: hi all, i was wondering about the code golf pwer of thor solutions in the leaderboard, i have one too, in js, which i don't see how it could be made shorter, but then the leaderboards show some that have just over 50 chars, which i find a bit extreme. are they real or some form of cheat?
jrke: real
Mittzir: hi all, I've been away for a while, but can I see my source code from past contests?
jrke: yes you can
Mittzir: how?
jrke: activities->contest on top left->click on view repoert of contest you wanna see
jrke: report*
Mittzir: thank you sir
Mittzir: can you also play old constests still?
jrke: no problem sir
jrke: yes in bot programming section you can
Mittzir: <3
jacek: :3
[CG]ROBIN: hi
Uljahn: that name tag :rolling_eyes:
kb_noah_flynn: hi
[CG]ROBIN: yeah UIjahn
MaxGumieniczek: hello?
NgonTran: hello
Uljahn: robin, i suggest you to rethink your nickname to not mislead anybody to idea that you're one of CG admins, thanks
[CG]ROBIN: okk UIjahn i respect you so i will listen to you
Robin_Hood: Hey it okk now
Uljahn: nice
Robin_Hood: what why my name is not changed
Uljahn: need to refresh the page
Robin_Hood: okk
Robin_Hood: UIjahn why your avatar is a cat
Uljahn: hmm, that doesn't work but i see your new nick by hovering over the avatar
alpha..:
Uljahn: i think i have some personality traits in common with that particular cat :slight_smile:
Robin_Hood: nice
Wontonimo: i'm surprised there isn't a restriction with starting your name with [CG]
Robin_Hood: what you want to say about me Wontonimo
Wontonimo: help me out, if you tell me your insecurities first then my response is guaranteed to be funnier
Robin_Hood: are you DISHONOR me
BlaiseEbuth: Robin_Hood ! Welcome back !
Robin_Hood: thanks
Astrobytes: ...
Robin_Hood: BlaiseEbuth
Robin_Hood: hii Astrobytes
BlaiseEbuth: Why do you "..." Astrobytes ? CG is a big family, we are all friends here !
Astrobytes: Ah sorry, I forgot.
Great big hug for Robin_Hood
Robin_Hood: i think he is not happy because i came back BlaiseEbuth
BlaiseEbuth: You see ! :hugging:
Robin_Hood: lol too late i write something else
Robin_Hood: guys i make a contribution for a reverse mode of Clash of Code
Astrobytes: I hope you nicely used your brain to constrate.
MadKnight: Automaton2000 now i need to look up what does "constrate" mean
Automaton2000: ok so it's not always the best
MadKnight: Automaton2000 stop people from using words i don't know
Automaton2000: well then i hope ican tye fast enough
Astrobytes: It's not a word, it's a meme
MadKnight: never seen it
MadKnight: gimme
Robin_Hood: what about my contribution
alpha..: Automaton2000 say hi
MadKnight: Automaton2000 how do people know about memes that i don't know about ?
Automaton2000: i go for the big board
Automaton2000: do i have to improve my bot
MadKnight: [CG]ROBIN why are u [CG}
MadKnight: i feel like actual admins are gonna ask u to remove that from your nick
MadKnight: i think it's already happened once or twice
Robin_Hood: i remove it because i don't no it is not for players or coders MadKnight
MadKnight: oh u did already lol
MadKnight: well we gotta refresh the chat for it to update
MadKnight: but i have no idea what u just said
Robin_Hood: I don't know also that what i said lol :smile:
MadKnight: nevermind that
MadKnight: tell me what did u say
Robin_Hood: noo comments to my contribution lol :disappointed:
MadKnight: what's your contri
Robin_Hood: can i paste a link here
MadKnight: well i just asked
MadKnight: so u can just paste it as a response
MadKnight: u got luckuy
Robin_Hood: https://www.codingame.com/contribute/view/629925dddb0aaf6c2aa77d0449f9cf1c6738
MadKnight: Automaton2000 i said lucky
Robin_Hood: this one
Automaton2000: at least i got the code to make it hard to understand
MadKnight: wow Automaton2000 so many words in the description
Automaton2000: only need to be a lot of great software people. ms should be so much easier
MadKnight: Goal
get the answser.
MadKnight: no way someone will have questions for the details of that, Automaton2000
Automaton2000: hi, can somebody help me
MadKnight: no way i know what it means that my edge is 1
MadKnight: wait no
MadKnight: i ruiled that
MadKnight: ruined
MadKnight: nevermind
Robin_Hood: hey u read about cube
Robin_Hood: in math
MadKnight: what i wanna say is i don't know what it means that edge=1
MadKnight: does it mean my edge is in the shape of 1 ?
Robin_Hood: comon it is A line segment formed where two edges meet. A cube has 12 edges. Because all faces are squares and congruent to each other, all 12 edges are the same length.
MadKnight: so okay i have it at 1 so i know i got like
MadKnight: hmmm
MadKnight: 1x1 like 6 times
MadKnight: i feel like there are already CoC's that are really similar to this
MadKnight: are u sure it's actually unique ?
MadKnight: at least i know for sure there's a puzzle that's really similar to this
Robin_Hood: what it is already exits lol i don't if it is exits
MadKnight: u gotta check for that
Robin_Hood: okk it times to go bye
MadKnight: https://www.codingame.com/contribute/community?mode=accepted&type=clashofcode
Robin_Hood: MadKnight
Robin_Hood: or other member
MadKnight: so here's a list of all CoC's
MadKnight: > okk it times to go bye
Automaton2000 stop timing it to going bye
Automaton2000: i don't know for sure
MadKnight: Automaton2000 u gotta time it
Automaton2000: still better than the boss! you will be able to read it
Joseph_Mother: Good morning crackasses
Uljahn: and i take it personally :shrug:
MadKnight: Automaton2000 we have to come up with a cool joke here
Automaton2000: there is no reason to make a good bot for it
MadKnight: Automaton2000 all i come up with is just dumb, gimme some ideas
Automaton2000: i'm done with my studies
MadKnight: Automaton2000 that doesn't give me any ideas that are not just terrible
Automaton2000: what language do you use a book, do you only have to be an improvement
Astrobytes: jeez give it a rest with pinging the bot
MadKnight: recurs was also like that
MadKnight: i just ping him 2-3 times and it starts feeling like i spammed the entire #world
MadKnight: not recurs i mean by pinging him of
MadKnight: ofc
MadKnight: hmm Automaton2000 i need to rephrase that, that went out terribly
Automaton2000: that's how i understood it
MadKnight: nevermind
MadKnight: not important
MadKnight: Astrobytes what i mean is - if i ping Automaton2000 like 3 times it already seems like i spammed the entire #world with that
Automaton2000: a lot of possible moves
MadKnight: look i just pinged Automaton2000 for the 3rd time and it already seems like the entire world is spammed
Automaton2000: this time it was my problem
MadKnight: yes it is your problem, Automaton2000
Automaton2000: i thought zero was just that it is the easiest
MadKnight: stop responding and making spam, Automaton2000
Automaton2000: just wait for the end
MadKnight: Automaton2000 cancelled
Automaton2000: took some time to write a recursive function
JLukeSkywalker: when do we get fortran on here?
MadKnight: umm
MadKnight: ask the forum discussion about adding new language to the platform
MadKnight: they probably had it covered
JLukeSkywalker: people have suggested, but there was no feedback either positive or nevgative
Westicles: I just imagine all the CG guys in a meeting, and poor Thib has to say the rabble want Fortran and they all laugh
Farhan_Sadiq: Hi
Farhan_Sadiq: :grinning:
AntiSquid: assembler and Lisp duh
Uljahn: i think there is gfortran compiler already installed as a part of gcc, but i had problems with calling it from numpy
Westicles: Yep, this runs in bash
Westicles: http://chat.codingame.com/pastebin/8ffc841e-a0dc-4609-81a8-d6942ffb992d
Uljahn: neat
HunterEhrenfeld: I am so grateful for this website
jacek: :+1:
TBali: Wow, so the mother of all programming languages is supported 'below the counter'?
It would be a fun tribute to computing history to let it supported officially. Anly stub generators need to be written, no?
TBali: *Anly = only
HunterEhrenfeld: also, anyone wanna be friends so i can have competition on the leaderboards lol
JLukeSkywalker: you can add me
HunterEhrenfeld: added! :)
JLukeSkywalker: now u gotta try to catch up ;)
HunterEhrenfeld: i can try lol
JLukeSkywalker: once you start doing some of the bot and opti competitions, your score can skyrocket
jacek: what game
JLukeSkywalker: ?
Alshock: TBali there's no tribute here, if a language is used it's worth working to make it available, if it's not used, it's not worth it. Now would Fortran actually be used? Ofc no
JLukeSkywalker: i use it professionally, and would use it on here
Astrobytes: Fortran is a widely used language Alsh
Astrobytes: Alshock
HunterEhrenfeld: Fortran is still widely used?
HunterEhrenfeld: Im not even sure what Fortran syntax looks like lol
JLukeSkywalker: it is still, to this day one of the fastest computational languages
Astrobytes: Sure. In scientific, financial and engineering fields for starters (not including legacy systems)
JLukeSkywalker: My college was doing black hole research, so I wrote a bunch of fortran for it. I would say 60% of the code was fortran, 40% was python
JohnathanBarbee: Okay. I'm having an issue that I can't seem to google. I'm playing UTTT and I'm using BitArrays to store board states. I cannot for the life of me set the Bitarray to any other value after it is setup. What the heck.
JLukeSkywalker: have you accidentally used an immutable data type?
JohnathanBarbee: Forgot to mention c#
JohnathanBarbee: I'm pretty sure they are mutable
AntiSquid: Poker chip race imo is very similar to pool JLukeSkywalker
JLukeSkywalker: i guess it is in an odd way
AntiSquid: it has enough differences though to be approved
AntiSquid: do snooker :P
mrdoctor: hello
AntiSquid: hi
HunterEhrenfeld: hello
MohZaib-Ali: Hello
MohZaib-Ali: Help Me Hhhh
MohZaib-Ali: OK
MohZaib-Ali: I'm A Pythoneer
AntiSquid: maybe there should be a guideline somewhere what people like
for contests you see complaints about physics games, fog of war, too much simulation focus, etc ...
AntiSquid: take this with a grain of salt though, it's not a guideline for quality / fun, do what you enjoy
JLukeSkywalker: yeah, i think it defenitely isnt at the top of my list, was just throwing the idea out there
HunterEhrenfeld: Luke is GOATed
AntiSquid: hey HunterEhrenfeld are you having class? :)
HunterEhrenfeld: I am not in class at the moment. This is my last semester of classes though!
AntiSquid: nvm
jacek: struct also has no class
JLukeSkywalker: a struct is a class
jacek: impossibru
AntiSquid: Automaton2000 has class
Automaton2000: i had some problems with it
HunterEhrenfeld: i have no class
AntiSquid: ya you told us HunterEhrenfeld ... i just thought you are in class with a bunch of people, seen the 2 no avatars posting same time as you, that's all
AntiSquid: was about to ask you what kind of game your colleagues would like to see on this site
AntiSquid: but nvm .#
HunterEhrenfeld: im trying to get people at my school to battle me in clash of code lol
JLukeSkywalker: i cant get any friends to get on here
JLukeSkywalker: :(
HunterEhrenfeld: ^^
JLukeSkywalker: I even tried bribing with cookies
HunterEhrenfeld: your friends must suck lol
JLukeSkywalker: we just all have jobs now, so everyone is kinda busy
HunterEhrenfeld: or that... lol
JLukeSkywalker: and i unfortunately didnt find this site till after college
HunterEhrenfeld: my college friends all graduated a semester early, so im alone now and i just found this site
Niicide: cool
Niicide: try AdventofCode
Niicide: thats really fun too
Astrobytes: Lots of people on here do AOC
PrivateTopHat_dcad: do anyone knows how to solve the Hanoi tower game in java ?
Astrobytes: I think the idea is that you have to figure that out by yourself...
jacek: oO
JLukeSkywalker: c++ is a Point class that compares the distance between itself and another point faster than a function that gets the distance between 2 point objects?
Astrobytes: Not sure if it's faster or not but it's definitely more convenient to build it into your Point class
Astrobytes: int distance(const Point& p) etc
JLukeSkywalker: i have versions of both i could paste in
JLukeSkywalker: just havnt really used c++ professionally in years
JLukeSkywalker: and ive kind of hit the python ceiling on here
Astrobytes: Well no matter what, you'll have to try really damn hard to make your C++ slower than python :)
JLukeSkywalker: ^^
HunterEhrenfeld: does my code save? Like, if im doing a problem, will my code still be here the next time i log on
JLukeSkywalker: once you play anything, it saves
JLukeSkywalker: i think it actually gives a warning if you try to leave without playing after making changes
Astrobytes: Yeah it does
HunterEhrenfeld: im new to python so i keep declaring the variable types and getting errors lol
JLukeSkywalker: you will get used to it
Astrobytes: yeah, took me ages to get used to the lack of curly braces lol
HunterEhrenfeld: for some reason, thats not an issue for me. which is really weird lol
JLukeSkywalker: I use python and C all the time for work, sometimes simultaneously, so I unfortunately got used to it fast
JLukeSkywalker: head still hurts sometimes though
Astrobytes: Switching between the 2 frequently can be a bit of a headspin
JLukeSkywalker: what would be the 2 worst languages to alternate between?
HunterEhrenfeld: anything and bash lol
Astrobytes: Hmm, quite subjective.
Astrobytes: I guess having to do Java and C# would be somewhat annoying.
reCurse: I just barfed
Astrobytes: Heh
reCurse: You're right though, having to deal with two similar yet different languages would be very annoying
Astrobytes: And I'm not sure you could compare different paradigms either, like you're in a different headspace if you're working with a functional language for example
MSmits: so true, i am doing a FP course atm
MSmits: unbelievably different way to code
Astrobytes: Enjoying it?
JLukeSkywalker: I think swapping between R and pretty much any C derivative would suck
MSmits: yeah i like it, but it's so weird
Astrobytes: Different way of thinking and working for sure
MSmits: first lesson: Yeah so there are no variables. Everything is a constant
Astrobytes: Between R and anything I think JLukeSkywalker
JLukeSkywalker: I've never had to program functionally except 1 class I took, but I've done it for fun, and its pretty cool
JLukeSkywalker: R varaibles are so awkward, and its 1 indexing, not 0
Astrobytes: Yes, very annoying. Very powerful though.
MSmits: I like the fact that it is more mathematical.
MSmits: there is no x = x + 2
Astrobytes: Yeah, on the one hand it's a very simple and pure way of doing things, but it requires mental gymnastics to get used to actually doing (for me at least :D )
MSmits: for me too
MSmits: I have a feeling that if you wrote a bot in a FP language here it would be horribly slow
MSmits: supposedly FP is better for parallellization
MSmits: but we dont have that so..
reCurse: Each layer of abstraction adds more rope to hang yourself with.
MSmits: yeah
JLukeSkywalker: yeah, ive used it for parallel code, and its cool. you just dont have to worry about like locking out variables and stuff
JLukeSkywalker: its really not any 'better' it just makes it harder to make mistakes and easier to catch them
JLukeSkywalker: i guess some people call that better
jacek: MSmits there is c4 boss now and it seems almost ready to submit
JLukeSkywalker: do the bots we used stay when it is approved, or do we have to re-do it?
jacek: no
jacek: ahh yes
jacek: when it is approved
jacek: so copy paste it now somewhere if you want to keep it
JLukeSkywalker: my c4 one is stupid, so i dont care, but yeah, will have to copy-paste some others
zhydox: jhgk
kaffarell: fhasjdfh
AntiSquid: why
loberhauser: fguzfffof
eulerscheZahl: stop it or kick
loberhauser: sry
loberhauser: are a german kollege?
Getter22: wtf
AntiSquid: #de for get
AntiSquid: ger *
Astrobytes: they're Italian
Astrobytes: I believe they were asking if euler was from a German college
AntiSquid: i thought restaurants in italy opened up
eulerscheZahl: Kollege = colleague, co-worker
eulerscheZahl: but also buddy in slang
AntiSquid: Zimmer Kollege
Astrobytes: meh, well, I was half-right :P
loberhauser: nein wir sprechen fließend deutsch
kaffarell: enk schickts jo
eulerscheZahl: ich auch. dafür haben wir #de
AntiSquid: why didn't you capitalize deutsch then
loberhauser: ich hatte nie die möglichkeit die sprache zu ändern oder #it zu #de
eulerscheZahl: just click the #de to join the channel
AntiSquid: you can change your country of residence in your profile for that
AntiSquid: i mean to change the default channel
Astrobytes: ^
loberhauser: thx @antisquid
AntiSquid: i've been avoiding #de all this time, frequented fr and ru more often :D
AntiSquid: #de is dead o.o
JLukeSkywalker: :eyes: all this time I thought my botters of the galaxy code just sucked
JLukeSkywalker: it advanced a league and just errors now
JLukeSkywalker: never noticed
eulerscheZahl: #de is not dead. it even has a scrollbar again
Astrobytes: OK I'm impressed with that fact!
reCurse: Come chat with us, we even have a scroll bar.
AntiSquid: which league are you in Luke ?
JLukeSkywalker: wood
JLukeSkywalker: :laughing:
Astrobytes: lol reCurse
JLukeSkywalker: it got to the point where you have to pick 2 heroes, and just died
JLukeSkywalker: i thought it just only made it that far and gave up
loberhauser: does the codingame extension for intellij editors work?
darkhorse64: eulerscheZahl: is any Windows free app people here use to make fancy titles/logos.
darkhorse64: ?
jacek: paint
Scarfield: ^
darkhorse64: I know it's JBM favorite tools but I want more
JLukeSkywalker: fire alpaca is pretty good
Astrobytes: gimp?
darkhorse64: I was thinking of something that takes a text and add fancy effects to it
Astrobytes: It has plenty features like that
Astrobytes: gimp that is
JLukeSkywalker: i miss word art
reCurse: gimp has horrible, horrible UX
reCurse: I heard good things about kryta
Astrobytes: Sadly true
reCurse: Ok wrong name, trying to find it
Astrobytes: krita
reCurse: krita
Astrobytes: Interesting, haven't seen that one before
Astrobytes: Definitely familiar looking enough to be usable quickly
Astrobytes: (coming from PS or whatever)
struct: Even to create a circle on GIMP I had to use google
struct: For very simple stuff I use paint net
Astrobytes: don't they charge for paint net these days
Astrobytes: ?
struct: only if you download from microsoft store
struct: from their website is free
Astrobytes: krita looks way cool actually, very art-centric, gonna recommend this to my mate actually
Astrobytes: -1 actually
Astrobytes: struct: ah ok
Astrobytes: meh, my mate has krita already. fwiw he recommends it (does flyer/poster designs etc)
reCurse: I mostly know because of artists at work
Astrobytes: Makes sense. It seems really impressive.
Scarfield: damn yea, looks very nice. But its not Paint
Astrobytes: BitmapField
Wontonimo: I've tried using sketchbook (on mac). It's quite nice but I'm no artist and it doesn't magically change that.
jacek: lets wait for more generative NNs then
darkhorse64: OK. Thanks for the advice
Scarfield: adobe flash had some nice text effect iirc
Scarfield: AstroClobber
JohnathanBarbee: Is there an easy way to test my code offline for better debugging?
JohnathanBarbee: I'm playing UTTT and the console is just reporting generic errors.
tibithegreat: well you can copy paste your code locally and see if it runs or not
tibithegreat: are you getting compile or runtime errors?
JohnathanBarbee: runtime
NOTsteve: when creating a puzzle, is my solution that I provide supposed to include the readlines and stuff or should I leave that out and allow the stub generator to do it?
tibithegreat: mm I had runtime errors with UTTT as well actually
tibithegreat: mostly it was accessing memory out of bounds and stuff like that
tibithegreat: but in my case it was wrongly reported as "program took too long"
tibithegreat: but in fact it crashed
tibithegreat: I usually just commented code around until I figured out what I messed up
JohnathanBarbee: Mine is nothing too complex. Argument out of range. Simple fix, but it doesn't point me to where it failed. Just that it failed
tibithegreat: well you can copy your program locally
tibithegreat: and just automate it to execute the moves your opponent did
Astrobytes: I assume you're outputting debug info to stderr?
JohnathanBarbee: Yes
JohnathanBarbee: I think. I'm not sure what that is exactly
Astrobytes: Console.Error() or whatever it is in C#
JohnathanBarbee: Yes. I do that
Astrobytes: Right cool
Papaver: Hello world :)
NOTsteve: Astrobytes, any help on my earlier question about contributions? It would be greatly appreciated :)
Astrobytes: You can copy the inputs given and read them in locally to test
Astrobytes: NOTsteve: your solution should be as it would be in the IDE if you were solving any other puzzle
Astrobytes: ^ resolved :)
Astrobytes: JohnathanBarbee: further to my last comment, I mean you can read them in via text file or whatever in VS to check your sim/search
tibithegreat: or just embed them in an array in your code
Astrobytes: yeah, whatever is convenient
JohnathanBarbee: I might try doing that. Thanks
Astrobytes: Also unit test your methods, it helps
Astrobytes: You don't need to use a fancy framework or anything, just make sure they do what you expect
jacek: unit what?
Astrobytes: Sorry, I meant write 1500 loc and worry later
MSmits: works for me
Astrobytes: yeah yeah
Astrobytes: :P
Scarfield: just noticed my bot thought my pawns could teleport attack on the edges, forgot about masks for them, unit test ftw
AntiSquid: face masks for chess pieces?
Astrobytes: I seem to remember MSmits having a teleporting issue in OOC
Scarfield: i prefere my pawns pretty
Scarfield: prefer*
Astrobytes: Masks on pawns? That's almost pawnographic.
Scarfield: xD
Astrobytes: Softcore pawn.
jacek: pawns? breakthrough?
Scarfield: chess960
jacek: ahh, chess has pawns too.
MSmits: i did have a teleporting issue in ooc, in that my sub would not teleport
Scarfield: chess69 has pawnstars
MSmits: tried everything
MSmits: no go
Scarfield: bitboard ooc? wasnt that 15x15 or something
Scarfield: int per row or how?
jacek: int256
MadKnight: Astrobytes what's OOC ?
jacek: smitsiint
Scarfield: ocean of code MK
jacek: Scarfield what's MK?
MadKnight: Modular KSI
MadKnight: of course
Scarfield: multi kill (?)
MadKnight: Mario Kart
MadKnight: Monster Kid, a character from the video game Undertale
Scarfield: yes, thats the one
Astrobytes: OOC was the lockdown contest MK
Astrobytes: before the official spring 2020 one
MadKnight: >Megakelvin (MK), an SI unit of temperature
hmm that makes more sense
MadKnight: didn't see the lockdown contest
Astrobytes: Think there was an email, can't remember. Was high on painkillers those months lol
Scarfield: oh, your back is better now?
Astrobytes: Nope.
Scarfield: sad, hoped that was implied :/
MadKnight: what's up with your back ?
Astrobytes: Not quite as awful but I'm still severely limited. Spoke with my physiotherapist yesterday and scans are still backlogged until before my referral last year (the bone density scan)
Astrobytes: I take the fewest pain meds I can though.
Astrobytes: But for free movement I have to take them now and then.
Astrobytes: MadKnight: I had/have multiple fractures in my spine, suspected osteoporosis (I'm a bit young for that condition)
MadKnight: sounds pretty bad
Astrobytes: Well I'm not dying or anything so could be worse. Anyway, don't worry about it.
MadKnight: oke
MadKnight: got a link to OOC ?
Astrobytes: https://www.codingame.com/multiplayer/bot-programming/ocean-of-code
MadKnight: no wait i remember this one, i just kinda didn't participate
Astrobytes: Yeah I was fairly sure you were around when it came out
Astrobytes: You did the spring pacman contest iirc
MadKnight: yea
MadKnight: and i used my fancy lib with my cool fancy BFS for that
MadKnight: to eval the map
Scarfield: hmm my very first move as white, referee says i can only castle d1c1, but not d1e1, am i missing something?
MadKnight: and not just to pathfind
Scarfield: https://www.codingame.com/replay/529740040
JBM: oh dear i've been HLd roday
JBM: should i scroll?
MadKnight: no
JBM: heya maddi kak dela
MadKnight: there's no Automaton2000 pings in there
Automaton2000: you can do with it
jacek: or AutomatonNN
MadKnight: JBM norm
AutomatonNN: eulerscheZahl is there a way to see a code in the contest in contests?
JBM: my aunt sent me her CCCP phto album
JBM: man it goes WAY back
MadKnight: jacek why did u ping euler for no reason
jacek: not me eh
MadKnight: well u pinged NN one
JBM: "i didnn't know it back then, i was a MAJOR problem to our guide -- no way to mic tents"
MadKnight: u know he pings euler even more often than he says "oui" in fr
MadKnight: Automaton2000 is it weird than the most used word in #fr is oui while in here it's euler ?
Automaton2000: i like to play with it
MadKnight: for the NN
MadKnight: oui == yes
jacek: he likes to play with oui oui?
MadKnight: who doesn't?
MSmits: I wonder who said that
Astrobytes: ...
MSmits: wasnt me
Astrobytes: Like the guy who stopped for a French hitchhiker, asked if he needed a ride, reply was "oui oui oui!", guy says "not in my car you don't" and drives off.
MadKnight: lol
MadKnight: i actually thought of the wii platform firsyt
Astrobytes: I think that joke is older than me.
jacek: "man addicted to drinking brake fluid claims he can stop anytime he wants"
Astrobytes: yeah, also a golden oldie
MSmits: makes sense
Astrobytes: The man who stands on the toilet gets high on pot.
MSmits: lol
MSmits: keep them coming
AntiSquid: that's a new level of toilet humour
Astrobytes: groan!
Astrobytes: (good though!)
MSmits: nice one
Astrobytes: Scarfield: I think the castling rules are different
jacek: https://imgur.com/a/1WMf9MM
jacek: i havent done castling for 960 yet
jacek: theyre tricky
Astrobytes: lol jacek
Astrobytes: Yeah it's complex
Astrobytes: Compared to regular castling
struct: how is it complex?
Astrobytes: *more complicated
jacek: some castlings do nothing
struct: how does it do nothing?
jacek: king and rook are already on their target positions
Scarfield: ah i misinterpretted the rules
Scarfield: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HPtbyOOdMcQ
Astrobytes: "ecksdee"
struct: you mean if king and rook are next to eachother?
jacek: ecksdee? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hw3CE04LGiA
jacek: ah yeah, when they are next to each other
jacek: then castling can happen as 1st move
struct: When they are next to eachother you just switch pieces
jacek: eeyup
Scarfield: i thought they simply switch positions for whatever reason, but after castling the pieces will land on the same cells as with normal castling.
struct: they should only switch if they are next to each other
Scarfield: Here's an example of the castling that confused me https://www.codingame.com/replay/529745456
struct: I think that is wrong
Scarfield: thats the fisher rules
Scarfield: but i thought as well
struct: oh its right
struct: https://lichess.org/analysis/chess960/nqkrrbbn/ppp1ppp1/8/3p4/7p/3BPP2/PPPP1BPP/NQRKR2N_w_CE_d6_0_5
Astrobytes: yes, what confused you?
Astrobytes: @struct not ConfusedField
struct: https://lichess.org/analysis/chess960/nqkrrbbn/ppp1ppp1/8/3p4/7p/3BPP2/PPPP1BPP/NQRKR2N_w_CE_d6_0_5#16
struct: This is a bit confusing
struct: Due to
struct: if you castle left
struct: it only switches
struct: if you castle right it moves
Scarfield: yea, the rule is king and rook has to land on the same cells as with normal chess
Astrobytes: Blame Bobby
nassim_laghoub: hiiii
jacek: lets make new variant, chessfield
nassim_laghoub: c'est à dire ?
MSmits: c'est la wrong channel
jacek: #fr
Scarfield: coco chanel?
nassim_laghoub: yes
Astrobytes: anglais ici, français en #fr
nassim_laghoub: okay
nassim_laghoub: je suis entrain d'écrire en anglais mais ça se traduit automatiquement
Astrobytes: ...
nassim_laghoub: what ?
MSmits: you know Astrobytes, just because you speak the language, doesn't mean you can make people understand you
nassim_laghoub: Astrobytes ?
nassim_laghoub: :smirk:
Astrobytes: You are most definitely not typing english and it suddenly becomes french ffs
Astrobytes: pdm
MSmits: private dungeon master?
nassim_laghoub: je tape bien l'anglais
Astrobytes: MSmits: Bien sûr
MSmits: good sir?
Scarfield: Mr. Bien
MSmits: ooh right, the French version
Astrobytes: Zero tolerance today struct :)
struct: he checks too many boxes
Astrobytes: Indeed.
MSmits: oh, you guys have a secret form?
Scarfield: a warning would have been nice tbh, or are they not needed?
MSmits: he warned
MSmits: guy kept speaking French
Astrobytes: He was warned. Wasn't gonna kick him but level 1, trying to wind us up etc etc
LiudasStaniulis: does anyone know existing games that are like ghost in cell(one of AI courses)
Scarfield: i missed it somehow xD
Astrobytes: MSmits: btw PDM = Putain de merde
MSmits: ohh, that means damned :poop:
MSmits: gonna have to warn you to refrain from such fecal language
Astrobytes: That's a more sfw way of putting it yes
Astrobytes: Yeah you too, for that jobby emoji
MSmits: mmh ok
Astrobytes: https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Jobby
Wontonimo: what are you trying out in this uttt bot MSmits ?
MSmits: mostly i am checking out dozens of lost/drawn replays to see if it solves correctly
MSmits: i added another pruning rule
MSmits: but they are really complicated. Easy to do it wrong
Astrobytes: what now?
Astrobytes: (pruning rule I mean)
MSmits: this one had to do with situations where the player with the highest number of won boards has been determined
Scarfield: I remember enjoying to read the harry potter books in english when i was learning the language because of the funny curse words. but scottish seem to be on a whole other level cD
Scarfield: xD * (of course)
MSmits: in that case, if a miniboard cannot contribute to a line and cant be reached from another board, you should not play a free move there
MSmits: it's very situational
Astrobytes: That seems almost a no-brainer MSmits
Astrobytes: There must be a caveat
MSmits: how do you mean
Astrobytes: retract that, I missed your 'very situational' comment
Astrobytes: Expensive to detect or...?
MSmits: well it only happens sometimes, mostly when one side has maybe 4 won boards and there are 2 draws or something. then you may end up with 1 board thats isolated and cant be part of a line. It is also required you can't send a player there
MSmits: sometimes it's useful to be able to send a player to a useless board
MSmits: so you might not want to win that board, because that ends that
Astrobytes: Yes, makes sense,
Astrobytes: Scarfield: You should read some Irvine Welsh
MSmits: so a lot of ifs and loops to detect
MSmits: but i dont do it in the sim
MSmits: just in expansion
MSmits: together with tons of such pruning rules
Astrobytes: Well, if the pruning is successful it'll offset any of that stuff anyway. Still an interesting approach.
jacek: so you basically use prune array
jacek: what a ripoff
MSmits: it slows down my bot, but winrate stays the same more or less. I just like solving
Astrobytes: HAH
MSmits: :grin:
MSmits: here's an example of benefit Astrobytes https://www.codingame.com/share-replay/529752648
MSmits: solved as loss at 38
MSmits: draw at 44
MSmits: so i solved >6 plies sooner than Mealc
MSmits: somehow he made a mistake on 43, i dont pretend to know what it is, but my bot does :)
Astrobytes: Yes, I had to slow it down for it to make sense but yes I see
Astrobytes: Feck knows
MSmits: who's Fecj
MSmits: Feck
Astrobytes: Game makes almost no sense other than in a vaguely gamey way
MSmits: is that another Scottish Poop thing
Astrobytes: Ask Father Jack
MSmits: oh, i didnt finish the whole show, but what i did see was fun
Astrobytes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-e9Y023-mnc
MSmits: oh the old guy in the chair that breaks the TV?
Astrobytes: Ah go on now MSmits, you'll have to finish it, you will now, go on now
MSmits: I will at some point :0
Astrobytes: Yeah the old alcoholic womanising priest is Father Jack, Father Ted is the main character and Father Dougal is his somewhat challenged sidekick
Scarfield: trainspotting is based on a book :o didnt know that, gonna check his work for sure :)
Astrobytes: And Mrs Doyle makes tea and says "go on now"
MSmits: ah yes
Astrobytes: Scarfield: not just a book but accurate experiences of scotland in the 80s (also the 90s, and now depending where you live)
Astrobytes: (other than the obviously dramatised parts)
Astrobytes: Scarfield: Also he writes his books in Scots
Astrobytes: I think there might be English versions too
MSmits: did not know Scots is a language
MSmits: well aside from Jobby and such
MSmits: hey, is it like how Eskimo people have 100 words for snow or something. Only it's poop. Just wondering
Scarfield: "whan his mither Mary was mairry't till Joseph"
RSBat: finally reached legend in uttt. And the thing that pushed me over was just bigger hashmap
Wontonimo: !!! Congrats !!
Wontonimo: what were you hashing?
MSmits: nice!
jacek: or smoking
Wontonimo: no, seriously. I'm really curious because I don't have a hashmap of anything for my uttt
RSBat: states
key was board bitmap and last move in a miniboard
Astrobytes: Scarfield: :rofl:
jacek: using minimax or mcts?
RSBat: mcts
Astrobytes: intriguing
UnnamedCodinGamer: congratulations
UnnamedCodinGamer: I also did it earlier today
Wontonimo: you are using that to reduce and reuse boards
Astrobytes: yeah well done
Astrobytes: all this uttt s**t, I'm gonna have to actually do it soon right
jacek: you havent done it? noob
RSBat: UnnamedCodinGamer congrats, I saw you beat me earlier and your bot is way stronger than mine
Astrobytes: F off. Almost everything else on the site is more interesting.
jacek: :soccer: ?
UnnamedCodinGamer: thanks
UnnamedCodinGamer: I am not sure
UnnamedCodinGamer: 147 th currenly in legend
Astrobytes: Possibly even that jacek yeah
MSmits: Astrobytes you'll easily make legend
Astrobytes: I don't doubt it
UnnamedCodinGamer: it does around 12k iterations on second turn
MSmits: RSBat it's really courageous to use a hashmap in uttt, i havent even tried, assuming it will only hurt
UnnamedCodinGamer: basic uttc with rollouts with board win loss detection seems to do the job
UnnamedCodinGamer: mcts
MSmits: I was thinking of maybe trying a hashmap for late game situations
MSmits: you have more transpositions then
Astrobytes: vanilla mcts is enough yes
RSBat: wait, what do you use then? just store a tree?
Wontonimo: RSBat how many rollouts you clocking? I bet you don't need as many because of your hashmap
MSmits: ohh, you had everything in a hashmap and no tree ??
Astrobytes: wait what
Wontonimo: ^^
MSmits: thats awesome lol
MSmits: that you got to legend with that
Scarfield: https://prnt.sc/101bkmo
Astrobytes: lel
MSmits: my hat off to you RSBat
RSBat: actually I rewrote my tree to hashmap mid gold
MSmits: but in what way is the hashmap useful compared to the tree?
Wontonimo: is that rave effectively?
MSmits: not really
MSmits: to do a hashmap , when you loop over child nodes, you need to do like 9 hash lookups
MSmits: thats extremely expensive
MSmits: you might get some transpositions though. In that sense it helps
RSBat: but yeah, my goal was to reuse positions as much as possible. So I remap won/lost subboards to dedicated masks and store only move in subboard, not whole board
RSBat: should also remap drawn boards, but dont do it now
MSmits: remap means you have a simple code for win/loss/draw?
MSmits: so that you get more transpositions in the late game
MSmits: a won board is a won board, evne if it has a different layout
MSmits: thats what you mean right?
RSBat: yes
MSmits: i do that in my meta mcts
MSmits: but it only traverses a meta tree once per game, so it doesnt matter there
MSmits: if i have to do this 30-100k times it would be super expensive
MSmits: but I will think more seriously about using it after maybe 5 boards solved or something
MSmits: 5 boards ended i mean
Astrobytes: Interesting approach. Stop feeding MSmits RSBat
MSmits: lol
Astrobytes: :D
RSBat: basic idea is I precomputed winner for every board mask and use it as lookup table in rollout
MSmits: what do you mean by a board mask in this case?
MSmits: do you mean a 18 bit code for the bigboard or something?
Scarfield: corona guidelines of course
MSmits: the complete board i mean
AntiSquid: everyone and their neighbour's dogs using bit masks now?
MSmits: lol
Astrobytes: MaskField
RSBat: 18 bit for miniboard
MSmits: wait, so you precompute for miniboards only?
AntiSquid: i just want to use vectors, recursion and even python, why is life so difficult
Scarfield: no D?
AntiSquid: next contest, kept promising myself
RSBat: yes, there is no way to precompute whole board
AntiSquid: when is next contest
MSmits: ahh ok
MSmits: you can also do this:
MSmits: http://chat.codingame.com/pastebin/4501a55f-0856-4edf-90b8-08cd00c88b2d
Scarfield: may 6th it says
RSBat: thanks, will try that
MSmits: mark my words, as a surprise, , one week before, they'll move up the date 2 days earlier and do a star wars theme
MSmits: RSBat it's SimD, you might need some pragmas
struct: to use that you must enable avx
Scarfield: i reak that as "mask my words.."
MSmits: #pragma GCC optimize("Ofast","unroll-loops", "omit-frame-pointer", "inline")
- pragma GCC option("arch=native", "tune=native", "no-zero-upper")
- pragma GCC target("rdrnd", "popcnt", "avx", "bmi2", "avx2")
Scarfield: read *
MSmits: that works too
MSmits: just ignore me
Astrobytes: masd reak
Scarfield: xD
Scarfield: impressive typo
AntiSquid: is that best combo ? have some many variations, still didn't learn what all the pragmas do
Astrobytes: decksee
MSmits: I know most, but not all
Scarfield: that could be a scots word
Astrobytes: It depends what you're using in your code
AntiSquid: why do you eed rdrnd ?
MSmits: no idea
MSmits: it has dnd in it, i like dnd
Astrobytes: Scarfield: you have the Irish band Dexy's Midnight Runners - Decksee
Astrobytes: "it has dnd in it, i like dnd" - if Smits wrote documentation
MSmits: yeah
struct: whats dnd?
MSmits: dungeond and dragons ofc
Astrobytes: ^
MSmits: d = s
MSmits: well not every d
Scarfield: xD
Astrobytes: is rdrnd really necessary though?
MSmits: you'll reason it out struct
AntiSquid: Scarfield i even thought of a nice theme for avatar / profile for next contest to go along with D lang, hope i won't be too busy again
Scarfield: were finally gonna compete with alts and guess who's who?
JLukeSkywalker: lol
Astrobytes: At least my alt is obvious.
MSmits: Altrobytes?
MSmits: Smurfobits?
Astrobytes: No, but it says "Astrobytes alt account for testing purposes. Does not compete" in the profile
MSmits: well you should use my suggestions or someone else will
Astrobytes: That way if I ever really smurf you'll never know :innocent:
AntiSquid: why alt? i can change avatar for contest lol
MSmits: true
struct: Everytme I created a smurf
struct: I typed here by mistake
MSmits: me too
RSBat: so using avx2 pragma slows me down by 2-5k rollouts on second move:sweat_smile:
AntiSquid: hah, see nobody ever found out if i made a smurf
MSmits: RSBat that shouldnt happen
reCurse: RSBat Be careful, there are multiple CPU configuration at CG, picked at random
MSmits: yeah it was an unlucky test
Astrobytes: Ah that's how we found you out with your other alt struct, I remember
struct: There are 5 machines I think
Astrobytes: yeah RSBat, do a series of tests
struct: or more but with exactly same specs
Astrobytes: All Haswell, but all? different?
struct: all haswell yes
MSmits: whats this:
struct: Some have same cpu clock
MSmits: terminate called after throwing an instance of '__gnu_cxx::recursive_init_error'
what(): std::exception
Scarfield: dont forget about premium users, they have access to better machines
struct: but different cache size
RSBat: does it select new machine every time I click "play my code"? or should I reload ide/do sth else?
Astrobytes: Do you know if this varies over time or is it consistent?
struct: its random
struct: What do you mean astro?
MSmits: recursive_init_error sounds like what happens when reCurse wakes up on the wrong side of the bed
Astrobytes: Same set of machines over time
Scarfield: lol
struct: Ah, I have no idea
Astrobytes: Or is there variation every few months/weeks etc
Scarfield: or he keeps waking up from a dream, in a dream
Astrobytes: MSmits: hah!
MSmits: or that yeah
Astrobytes: fails to start all day
Astrobytes: In that case I think I suffer from recursive_init_errors frequently lol
reCurse: Or when you submit again on uttt :unamused:
Astrobytes: that's more of a recursive_damnit_error no? :)
MSmits: :)
Scarfield: (╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻
Scarfield: ︵ ┻━┻
Astrobytes: anyway, unfortunately an early night for me, see you all later, goodnight
Scarfield: gn :wave:
reCurse: Bye
MSmits: gn!
UnnamedCodinGamer: btw, what is a good way to pick the parameters of mcts?
reCurse: Prayer
UnnamedCodinGamer: other than that?
reCurse: Numerology and validate with a benchmark of 400 games against a reference opponent
UnnamedCodinGamer: hah
UnnamedCodinGamer: sounds like trial and error
reCurse: You're reading me correctly
reCurse: MSmits Are all of your latest submits deterministic?
Scarfield: a lot of people here use "CG bench" to test against other bots, i dont have a link though - never used it myself
UnnamedCodinGamer: well I do not ask specifically for use in CG
reCurse: Same applies, find a reference benchmark and validate continuously against it
UnnamedCodinGamer: I see
MSmits: reCurse they're all random mcts bots
reCurse: I thought you said your new bot is deterministic...
MSmits: but my CG benchmarks do show me as 40-50% vs you
MSmits: it was
MSmits: but this is not my new bot
MSmits: my new bot failed too much against weaker players
MSmits: so i used what i learned in my new bot, in my old bot
reCurse: Ah
reCurse: I make a tiny change and it crushes one of your latest then
MSmits: yeah thats very likely
reCurse: 91% winrate and mostly different games
reCurse: Made me wonder
reCurse: So it explains
MSmits: there was no book if you're wondering, just eval
MSmits: havent had a uttt book in months
reCurse: I need a more principled way of testing this is getting really dumb
MSmits: will make one in the future maybe, but just generalized openings, nothing nasty
Scarfield: you have been going at uttt for months? again :o
MSmits: weeks now, but a few motnhs ago i had a short run
MSmits: reCurse from cg benching a lot lately, i did notice uttt has more RPS than i expected. even with random bots. So for testing, you should probabyl just take the entire top 10 and do many more games
Scarfield: you really fall into rabuttt holes
MSmits: lol...
reCurse: This is way too time consuming
reCurse: I think a more principled way would be to automatically identify and store blunders and validate against them
reCurse: But fuck this game really
MSmits: blunders are hard to recognize in uttt, unless you sovle
struct: stockfish 13 released, +35 elo over sf 12
reCurse: You could probably measure deviation when giving 10x more time or something
reCurse: To act as a blunder proxy
MSmits: reCurse just put it at the bottom of your list, then you havent given up but since your list is always expanding, you're not actually working on it. That's a way to trick yourself psychologically
reCurse: It's 100% sunken cost
MSmits: well it's not 100% sunk cost if it's not wasted, you've got a great bot.
MSmits: uttt is one of the most active games, you're alwyas gonna have to come back if you reason this way
MSmits: kar liso is not going to accept you beating him either
MSmits: he's crazy like you, except he likes the game
tibithegreat: when people suggest using C instead of C++ on cg, do they mean use the C++ compiler without actual C++ features, or actually use the C compiler?
reCurse: It means you shouldn't listen
MSmits: there's no reason to use C unless you like it I think
tibithegreat: I tried writting in C thinking "how hard can this be, I've been using C++ for a long while"
Wontonimo: haha
tibithegreat: and keep hitting all kinda weird "bleah this horrible"
struct: You should use D
tibithegreat: fair enough
reCurse: See, case in point, people say the darndest things
tibithegreat: :))
Wontonimo: what's the main reason people state for C++ ? (I'm just curious, i don't think it'll have merit)
MSmits: Wontonimo speed
MSmits: there arent many alternative that can reach the same speed
Wontonimo: because you don't have to type the "++" ?
MSmits: probably C and Rust and ???
reCurse: C# is getting there
MSmits: really?
MSmits: for the things we do here?
MSmits: i know speed is relative to the task you're comparing on
reCurse: Ceres is seriously impressive, dunno about CG
darkhorse64: stl also makes your life easier
Westicles: I switched from g++ to clang++ here, it seems it is faster
MSmits: oh and of course you're talking about unsafe and such
reCurse: They did a lot more since
tibithegreat: yeah the memory management is the first thing I thought of as well
reCurse: You can get pretty close to bare metal with the latest stuff in .net core
reCurse: They're taking performance very seriously these days
tibithegreat: surprising
MSmits: yeah but, didnt you say this thing about python the other day reCurse
MSmits: if you're removing all the stuff that makes C# safe
tibithegreat: C++ seems to be going the other way to me with the latest standards
MSmits: why not just use C++
reCurse: Yeah but they're not doing it in a contorted way
reCurse: It meshes rather well
MSmits: hm ok
MSmits: do you use C# for anything reCurse?
MSmits: at work or?
reCurse: Used to
MSmits: ah ok
reCurse: I still use it for small programs and stuff
reCurse: Like my own cg bench is in c#
MSmits: makes sense
tibithegreat: wouldn't python be better for this kinda stuff?
reCurse: Or when I have to do some tools at work
MSmits: if you dont need speed it's better to just use a safer language
reCurse: I hate python
reCurse: I don't use it if I don't have to
tibithegreat: fair enough
Westicles: For example freecell in other languages would time out with g++, but pass with clang++. Not sure if it would speed up multis
MSmits: tibithegreat python has issues too, just like c++, you get different hard to track bugs
dsheedes: how to complete clash of code in python
dsheedes: solve()
MSmits: In C# you have to type a bit more code than in python, but less chance of typing bugs and such
tibithegreat: MSmits well mostly I use python for really small stuff where I really don't need any kind of performance
MSmits: me too
MSmits: i would not use it over 300 lines or so
tibithegreat: so I just code like a retard
tibithegreat: with no concern for performance, just to make sure it works without bugs
tibithegreat: like I do the most brute force stuff possible :))
MSmits: retard coding is cool
reCurse: I'm trying to write a web dashboard in python, I question my mental health sometimes
tibithegreat: very unlikely to have a bug in stuff like that
tibithegreat: well for web stuff I honestly don't know what other stuff you can do
tibithegreat: Javascript?
tibithegreat: I'm not touching that
reCurse: It's mostly for direct integration with ML stuff
tibithegreat: php?
reCurse: But geez
reCurse: It's like the worst of both worlds
tibithegreat: usually for this kinda stuff I think it's best to go with the language you are most comfortable with
reCurse: That's a mistake imo
tibithegreat: for me it's python mostly because I worked for 3 years in it professionaly
reCurse: You go with the language offering the best support for what you need
reCurse: Or, in a professional settings, you go with whatever is already in place
inoryy: be grateful you're not locked into a hermetic tech island :P
reCurse: Oh a wild inoryy
reCurse: Rare sight
tibithegreat: I meant for small scripts/tools I use once in a while
MSmits: hey inoryy
inoryy: hello!
reCurse: Referencing your workplace? :p
MSmits: you sleep at work inoryy
MSmits: ?
inoryy: i can neither confirm nor deny
inoryy: to both question :D
tibithegreat: reCurse: you mean me with the workplace question?
reCurse: No I meant inoryy sorry
tibithegreat: :)
inoryy: new avatar, reCurse
MSmits: he had it for a while, but you've been gone for a while
inoryy: yeah :/
inoryy: what's new aside from avatar?
MSmits: you guys should talk more, reCurse has made a lot of progress with ML on CG
reCurse: Not much, doing ML at work, doing ML at CG, eh
inoryy: nice! curious about the work part but I guess you can't share?
tibithegreat: is it as cool as it looks?
reCurse: Yeah I can't share
inoryy: alright then at least give me the deets on CG side :)
reCurse: ...not yet anyway, maybe down the line
reCurse: I got UTTT, BT, Othello and Checkers working on ML now
MSmits: oware too
inoryy: wow
MSmits: and csb
MSmits: and br2k
reCurse: Well he said what's new
MSmits: ah true
inoryy: uttt conv or mlp?
reCurse: Neither, but closer to conv I guess
BenjaminUrquhart: it's been so long since I've been here that CG didn't autofill in chrome
MSmits: hi BenjaminUrquhart
BenjaminUrquhart: hi
reCurse: Had rank 1 until MSmits spam submitted me out of it
Westicles: As Frost said, my goal in life is to unite my avocation with my vocation
MSmits: which game?
inoryy: err neither conv nor mlp that leaves what? 1 layer recurrent?
reCurse: uttt
MSmits: do you mean today?
reCurse: Well ok it's conv but not vanilla conv
MSmits: if you mean earlier, karliso was already 1, not my faukt
inoryy: ah ok
inoryy: is it something novel? plan to publish?
inoryy: I keep waiting for Agade & pb to publish theirs
MSmits: reCurse's problem is that he wants to be competitive also.
MSmits: can't give away all your secrets
MSmits: pb4 and agade did share some in their article
reCurse: It sucks because
reCurse: I'd probably end up learning a lot more going public
reCurse: But I'd also lose my motivation
reCurse: Catch 22
inoryy: I mean publish as a scientific paper
MSmits: thats my experience exactly.
MSmits: when i share stuff, i learn
reCurse: I don't think anything I do is worth publishing tbh
reCurse: I'm just a monkey banging very technologically advanced rocks
inoryy: that makes two of us :P
MSmits: the genius is domain specific to CG and the restrictions it has?
inoryy: I mean if it's a modification of conv that you could show is transferable to at least one more commonly used task then it's def worth a publication
reCurse: I doubt it's transferable
reCurse: More of a hack to make it work with uttt
MSmits: but what about the stuff you did with bt and such?
MSmits: there's something general there
MSmits: or is it just not new?
MSmits: ideas from other sources applied to these games
inoryy: Would be cool to hear more sometime :) I had a bunch of ideas to use CNNs on uttt but never got to doing them
reCurse: Well seeing as you're probably retired off CG I could probably give you details in private
inoryy: I'll take you up on that but some other time, gotta run
reCurse: Sure, poke me on Discord when you do
reCurse: Cya
MSmits: bye inoryy
MSmits: good to see you
MSmits: have a good sleep listening to the hum of TPU's in the night
reCurse: Glad my computer is not in my bedroom, GPUs sure are noisy
MSmits: yeah, well even cpus are too loud if you sleep close to them
reCurse: Not for me, I picked a pretty good silent cpu fan
reCurse: But you don't have that ease of customization for gpus
MSmits: i need to do that for my next computer, should be within a year
reCurse: Well it's also about picking a good case and all
tibithegreat: I used to have stock cooler for my cpu and that thing was so loud
tibithegreat: and my cpu was really hot (90 deg)
therealbeef: stock is sh*t
MSmits: 90 def is extreme
MSmits: deg
tibithegreat: then I went and overcorrected the problem with a big noctua cooler, never had a problem with it anymore :))
MSmits: how often do you remove dust and such from inside the cage?
reCurse: There you go, noctua
MSmits: I do it probabyl twice a year
therealbeef: 'good' case, or pretty case?
therealbeef: :D
tibithegreat: with the old cooler I would do it like once every 2 months or something
tibithegreat: it was an ok case
reCurse: Have a fractal design case, comes with those sliding plastic things where you can take the dust off
reCurse: Like a dryer really
therealbeef: built my hackintosh around the bitfenix portal
MSmits: nice
therealbeef: with red leds
tibithegreat: well I built a new pc in the meantime, gave the old one to my gf
reCurse: Hate leds
tibithegreat: and this one has an AMD 5800
tibithegreat: I went amd this time
tibithegreat: and this thing runs so hot
tibithegreat: like 45 deg idle temp
tibithegreat: with a big noctua cooler
tibithegreat: and AMD says it's ok to run it at ~90 deg
reCurse: Rocket Lake seems to be headed that direction as well
reCurse: A bit concerning
tibithegreat: well if the manufacturer says it's ok
tibithegreat: as long as it doesn't melt a hole in the motherboard
tibithegreat: should be fine I guess
Westicles: Can't believe Intel is still doing 14nm. Things must be a mess internally
reCurse: Well they got a new CEO right? Maybe it will help, who knows
reCurse: Heard some bad stories about their work environment
tibithegreat: ouch
therealbeef: tsmc is doing 7nm right
Westicles: They fired murthy, so that probably fixed a bunch of things
Wontonimo: mega corporation bent on profit above all else ... reCurse you surprise me
reCurse: And AMD isn't? :P
tibithegreat: well AMD might be in the same situation tho
tibithegreat: we just don't know about it :)
reCurse: They dropped the ball hardcore on GPGPUs
therealbeef: amd has a different design strategy i thought
reCurse: Didn't see the emerging market coming at all
tibithegreat: you mean Intel?
reCurse: No AMD
tibithegreat: oh
tibithegreat: I thought their latest GPU's are pretty good
reCurse: For gaming sure
tibithegreat: well I feel like that's the main GPU market
reCurse: But they're going to get eaten alive by nVidia if they don't come up with something on GP
reCurse: Umm, see you're falling in the same trap they did
reCurse: What's causing the shortage right now? Gaming?
tibithegreat: oh
tibithegreat: I see now
tibithegreat: I thought GPGPU was a typo
tibithegreat: but I was just uninformed
struct: What does GP stands for?
reCurse: General Processing
tibithegreat: general purpose apparently
reCurse: Oops
reCurse: Whatever
tibithegreat: :))
reCurse: CUDA, machine learning, cryptomining(ugh), etc...
struct: Thanks
reCurse: AMD is getting eaten alive
tibithegreat: is that such a big market?
reCurse: It will cost them dearly
tibithegreat: compared to gaming gpus?
reCurse: AI is booming
Wontonimo: like crazy
tibithegreat: hmm interesting. I thought crypto was a bigger market for this than AI
reCurse: Gaming may become a second class citizen in that area in a few years, but it's still not a done deal
Wontonimo: our ai budget at work is about 30% of our dev spend
reCurse: Crypto is very volatile, AI is not going away anytime soon
Wontonimo: and the IT costs are about 50% of our spend
Wontonimo: IT dedicated to AI
tibithegreat: well yeah but that is mostly dev people and researchers
Wontonimo: finance
tibithegreat: common people shouldn't have need for AI GPUS
Wontonimo: and tax
reCurse: We're talking markets
reCurse: AMD has missed a massive opportunity
reCurse: nVidia is laughing all the way to the bank with their gamble on CUDA 10 years ago
tibithegreat: well they need to get their pandemic manufacturing in order
tibithegreat: I struggled a lot to get my 3080
reCurse: It's mostly a shortage on gddr, nothing specific to nvidia
reCurse: From my understanding anyway
tibithegreat: it does seem to be a general issue, as sony is also having this issue
reCurse: And a crazy boom from cryptomining thanks to covid
LighTender: Do you know of any sites to learn Code Golf on python? (sites very advancing)?
reCurse: Oh and AI is coming to gaming with DLSS
reCurse: That's going to be a game changer, not sure how AMD will respond
tibithegreat: well DLSS has already been here for quite a while
reCurse: 2.0
tibithegreat: and AMD does indeed need a response to it
reCurse: Not requiring game-specific assets is huge
tibithegreat: it was one of the reasons I got a nVidia
tibithegreat: DLSS 2.0 won't require it to be trained specifically for the game?
reCurse: That was the big deal with 2.0 if I'm not mistaken
tibithegreat: I never heard of DLSS 2.0 actually
struct: huge improvement
reCurse: https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/news/nvidia-dlss-2-0-a-big-leap-in-ai-rendering/
reCurse: "One network for all games"
reCurse: Making it cheap for devs is a big key to democratization
tibithegreat: yep
tibithegreat: if this goes well and works as advertised
tibithegreat: then yeah it's gonna be huge
reCurse: I've been playing with DLSS lately, it's seriously impressive
tibithegreat: but I can't imagine AMD isn't cooking up a response
reCurse: They slept on GP all this time
tibithegreat: like DLSS has been here since 2000 series
tibithegreat: well yeah but this ate away at the gaming market
reCurse: But it was a niche feature
reCurse: 2.0 is another story
tibithegreat: they must have seen it
tibithegreat: right?
cooldude420: def yeah
reCurse: Sure but you don't come up with a corporate answer in a year or two
tibithegreat: like you can go ahead and brag about your teraflops
tibithegreat: but then nvidia comes in and sets "DLSS on"
tibithegreat: and blows you out of the water
tibithegreat: they must realize they are playing a losing game
reCurse: Yeah but they've been building up everything leading to this for over 10 years
tibithegreat: well it's time to invest in that R&D departament to come up with a breakthrough
tibithegreat: it's definetly not easy
tibithegreat: but it is what it is
tibithegreat: like if they lose the gaming market
tibithegreat: might as well just close the gpu shop
tibithegreat: well actually
tibithegreat: they still have consoles
tibithegreat: but not sure how much profit they get from that
reCurse: It won't kill them but they have a lot to catch up
therealbeef: there's always a profit for low-end too
reCurse: True, there's a lot of domains
loberhauser: why is codingame so slow right now?
kite1002: why not?
struct: database update
struct: Its always around this time
inoryy: a bit late to the party but having some experience with AI, I think DLSS and more generally what Nvidia does in CV is really impressive and would take AMD many years and a lot of money to catch up.
inoryy: the issue isn't even in reproducing DLSS 2 but preparing for the next step after that. Nvidia has strong research culture and reputation, which takes a long time to emerge organically
reCurse: Very good point
MaoKo: xor eax, eax or sub eax, eax to set zero?
reCurse: I'd say xor
MaoKo: right
EmbeddedIs77: who the hell uses java and php for shortest mode
EmbeddedIs77: https://www.codingame.com/clashofcode/clash/report/1601958d253aaebe42a3c10f32c8c82e9678932
u_know_not: certain people
Sarcovora: seems like the PHP guy did beat a python and javascript though
Sarcovora: Also, prob people that haven't yet learned multiple languages
Sarcovora: What are people's opinions on languages for shortest
RockNTroll: where's my boy madknight
MadKnight: Automaton2000 where am i ?
Automaton2000: i tried to fix it
MadKnight: RockNTroll let's go to DM
RockNTroll: I'm not ashamed to profess my love to you here
MadKnight: lol i'm not saying not to do that i'm saying let's just continue in DM
MadKnight: RockNTroll
KidAlex97: im dumb and i dont know how to code at all
KidAlex97: this dosnt make sense to my peanut brain sized head
RockNTroll: that's ok, me neither
RockNTroll: you're in the right place
RockNTroll: but you made it this far so that's actually impressive
KidAlex97: im dont get code this crud
KidAlex97: head star hurt yeds
RockNTroll: ok what's your smooth brain question
RockNTroll: I will try to find a wrinkle in my brain to help you
RockNTroll: Oh no he's gone
Guillermo.: Hallo
