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drdrdr: start

Default avatar.png Godot30: hi guys, new here, how can i start learning python with these puzzle? what puzzle should i choose? where should i start ?

Uljahn: start with easy puzzles, look for most solved like the Descent and Power of Thor ep.1, these two have a hints button on the left

Default avatar.png ChampionCoder: Mars lander episode 1 is also pretty good

Default avatar.png ChampionCoder: Episode 2 is crazy hard

bafian: the "my last play" function does not work right ?

Default avatar.png rekaxem: what is mars lander 2 about

jacek: flying on earth

Uljahn: isn't it about Musk colonizing Mars?

captainnarwal: how can i race my pod with my friend in coders strike back

jacek: you can choose a player under the ide

captainnarwal: thanks mate

captainnarwal: but i cant search my frnd

captainnarwal: do i have to be in same league

Uljahn: guess it works for top-1000 players

Fun007fun: Hello!

Uljahn: yep, top-1000 players of your current league and below

captainnarwal: means if i am in silver league i can play with top 1000 of bronze league

Uljahn: nope, means that if silver is smaller than 1k you'll get some from top bronze

captainnarwal: but its not showing the people i follow

captainnarwal: me and my frnd are both in bottom of silver leagues

Fun007fun: respect

gatitos: what are the league things you guys are takling about

captainnarwal: in coders strike back the pod races have leagues

gatitos: what is coder strike back

gatitos: i only play coding game

gatitos: the clash of code t hing

Uljahn: it's a multiplayer thing, also it has a tutorial


Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: hey guys

Default avatar.png Mr.intro: hi

jacek: ohai

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: can u help me with a problem?

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: i am doing the porcupine fever thing

Fun007fun: you guys just don't eat dinner?

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: no

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: but later i will

Fun007fun: :smile:

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: can u help me with a lil problem pls?

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: it says:

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: TypeError: 'int' object is not subscriptable

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: what can i do about it?

Fun007fun: maybe other guys can help you

Default avatar.png zhoubou: You will need to show your code if you want to be helped

Fun007fun: i am puzzled

Fun007fun: yep

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: ok

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: should i just send my code in the chat?

Default avatar.png zhoubou: Send a relevant snippet

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: for i in range(n):

Fun007fun: if it's not a secret,you can

mzbear: if he doesn't know what's causing the error, he might not know what's relevant either :)

Default avatar.png zhoubou: Good point

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy:

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: this ist the whole code

mzbear: a,k,g are all integers, therefore you have one dimensonal array of int ... but you treat it as two dimensional

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: ok...

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: how can i fix this

Fun007fun: porcupines should be a list

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: porcupines = list()

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: it is

Passifi: Bonjour !

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: hi

Default avatar.png zhoubou: Carsonfanboy A single porcupine should be a list [a, k, g] instead of appending a, k, and g separately. Then use indices to access them

Fun007fun: Bonsoir!

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: ok ill try

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: thank u guys

Default avatar.png zhoubou: :)

Fun007fun: what a nice thing that you got it

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: no i dont got it but i see the problem XD

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: and now i try to find a solution XP

Default avatar.png zhoubou: Feel free to DM me if you get stuck

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: ok thank u

Fun007fun: Sorry,but what's mean of "XD","XP"and"DM":joy:

Default avatar.png zhoubou: XD and XP are smileys with crossed eyes. DM is direct message

Passifi: XD is a type of crazed smile XP is experience dm is a privat message

Passifi: or XP is also a smily good to know

Passifi: :)

Fun007fun: :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes:

Fun007fun: like this?

Default avatar.png zhoubou: Yeah

Fun007fun: haha

Passifi: I think XD used to be more popular in the olden days

Fun007fun: :yum:

Passifi: before we had emojis bcak then we used to say rofl which is also pretty dead *nostalgicfeelings*

Fun007fun: :joy: is also very popular

therealbeef: roflmao

SPDene: roflshtcicoomn

Passifi: I know roflmao is roflshticicoomn a real thing ? :thinking:

SPDene: laughing so hard that coke (cola, not the other type) is coming out of my nose

Passifi: oh wow :D

Passifi: those were the days then people began saying lol in real life and we knew things went to far

Fun007fun: wow,time flies

Fun007fun: i need to have a easy dinner, so you next time guys

Passifi: Salut

MSmits: hi

Default avatar.png zhoubou: :hand_splayed:

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: i think that they should add the "excuse me wtf emogi" from fallout as an emogi

Default avatar.png Carsonfanboy: that would be fun

jacek: gib me new cpu

Passifi: I wonder: how do you unlock certificates?

Default avatar.png Mr.intro: solve puzzles, do clash of code..

Default avatar.png rekaxem: hi

Default avatar.png Mr.intro: o\

Default avatar.png Mr.intro: o/

AntiSquid: o-

Default avatar.png zhoubou: Certificates?

Default avatar.png Mr.intro: cerficatiions in profile

Default avatar.png zhoubou: Oh those are called certifications. Missed that

MSmits: wazzap!

MSmits: went to school for in person teaching today, one day a week

MSmits: in the train home now

MSmits: then racing my bike home to be home just in time to do 2 more hours of online teaching

MSmits: weird situation

Default avatar.png zhoubou: Weird indeed

mzbear: the approve puzzles, why the hell does EVERY approver have to check that the default code works for all languages? isn't this something that could be automated?

jacek: just do the tick and be done

mzbear: i am so not going to test every language one by one, and i refuse to tick a checkbox untruthfully

mzbear: thus, i suppose i'm never going to approve any puzzles

jacek: if people were honest, no puzzle would be approved

mzbear: i think people should start being honest

mzbear: flexibility ruins the system

mzbear: this is such a simple thing that could be fixed in the backend, e.g. adding a requirement that the default code must output a hardcoded solution for the first test case

Uljahn: easy fix could be making each approver to use different lang, so at least 4 languages to be covered

DomiKo: Maybe someone knows any public tricks about Hypersonic?

darkhorse64: write a beam search

darkhorse64: and ignore the opponent

DomiKo: Yeah, but nobody writes about it since 2016?

darkhorse64: It's on my todo

darkhorse64: list

Default avatar.png rekaxem: whats a beam search

DomiKo: BFS with fixed max width

Default avatar.png rekaxem: oh

darkhorse64: not only

darkhorse64: you also do pruning

darkhorse64: I mean, you keep the most promising paths

DomiKo: I mean feedback from contest is so old

DomiKo: And I know that it is outdated

DomiKo: Most of the top codes are from 2019

DomiKo: and there is no info :/

DomiKo: no feedback from them? :/

darkhorse64: Yeah but people have kept playing it after the 3rd leaked his code. Therefore, the top is much stronger. Ask MSmits for information

DomiKo: The 3rd one is 70th right now

DomiKo: so they are much stronger

DomiKo: I will ask

darkhorse64: There are lots of copypasted clones of the 3rd. Your(mine too) goal is to beat the clone wall

RoboStac: I think the top few have done a bit more on enemy prediction than the post mortems, but I don't think there has been any massive change

RoboStac: mines almost exactly the same as code in 2017, just with some beam search performance improvements I found during xmas rush

DomiKo: Hmmm

eulerscheZahl: beam search for me too. but I dropped out of top10 :(

jacek: oO

Default avatar.png Mr.intro: #short

Default avatar.png audif90: damn im bad

1400179: Yeah I think HS is one of the rare multis that got crazy progression after contest, the only other ones I can think is CSB and WW to a much lesser extent.

Westicles: RIP robinhood

jacek: hm?


Astrobytes: Constrated too hard.

Westicles: He was a fine young lad with the sensitive heart of a poet

1400179: Some low standards you've got

jacek: the third guy approved has beautiful avatar

Default avatar.png esfes: hi

Default avatar.png esfes: what does it mean ' If the ASCII code of the character is ABC'

Default avatar.png esfes: the ascii code of the first letter in the first test is 84

Default avatar.png esfes: so how is it possible for it to be ABC?

Westicles: ASCII codes are up to 3 digits

Default avatar.png esfes: up to

Default avatar.png esfes: but what about the codes that have only 2 digits

Westicles: Maybe A=9994?

Default avatar.png esfes: what do you mean?

Westicles: What is the only answer that makes sense?

Default avatar.png esfes: westicles?

Default avatar.png esfes: none

Default avatar.png esfes: A=0

Default avatar.png esfes: or C=0

Westicles: Let me get my ouija board and we can ask the author

Default avatar.png esfes: lol

Default avatar.png esfes: well you approved it, thought you solved it lol

Westicles: C=0 doesn't make sense, that would be 840

Default avatar.png esfes: i though about 084

Default avatar.png esfes: but than x is the same

Default avatar.png esfes: and the y changes

Default avatar.png esfes: checked it and didnt find an O

Westicles: AB=08=8, C=4

Default avatar.png esfes: I thought they meant a*b

Default avatar.png esfes: not ab

Default avatar.png esfes: thank you

Default avatar.png esfes: got it

Default avatar.png esfes: thanks for the help

Default avatar.png esfes: i think the author should rewrite the assignment because its not very clear

gatitos: oh someone linked that bards message challenge

gatitos: i got that in fastest and i epicly failed it because i didnt know what i was supposed to do

Default avatar.png esfes: i can send the code of the challenge

Default avatar.png esfes: if you want to

Default avatar.png esfes: The wording is not the best

Westicles: I don't play clashes so I can't edit, but find someone with over 300 and they can make it clearer

Westicles: Oh, somebody already did it, great

BennySama: W

BennySama: Whoops, sorry

gatitos: there is like a bug /w the coding game lua interpreter

eulerscheZahl: the interpreter or the language assist?

gatitos: maybe im just really stupid

gatitos: im running `print(exp, math.floor(exp) == exp)`

gatitos: where exp = 29.0

gatitos: it is outputting 29.0 false

gatitos: i can provide like the full code repo

eulerscheZahl: comparing floats is prone to errors

eulerscheZahl: are you sure it's exactly 29.0 and not 29.0001 or something?

gatitos: ah good point

gatitos: lua's __tostring might be coercing 29.00000000001 into 29

gatitos: hmmm

gatitos: it just said i faield a test case but got 100%

gatitos: O_O?

jacek: O:

gatitos: oh on the topic highlighting not working

gatitos: ruby's highlighter fails on statements that can be intepretted

gatitos: a?b:c

gatitos: things like "a"?"b":"c" i mean

gatitos: the highlighting will make everything beyond the ? go white iirc

gatitos: or sometimes it will do something else


eulerscheZahl: report it on the bugs channel on discord or on the forum

1400179: What's scarier than a bug? Spider?

1400179: I think I found an australian-class spider in my search code

eulerscheZahl: Huntsman spiders are gross

BlaiseEbuth: :scream:

1400179: Affects all my experiments since uttt :scream:

Astrobytes: I quite like spiders.

Astrobytes: Not in my code.

eulerscheZahl: the cook speaking here?

Astrobytes: No, I genuinely quite like spiders. Very interesting creatures.

BlaiseEbuth: That's fluffy.

1400179: What about australian-class ones?

JohnnyLuke: to prove im not a robot it made me select all boats, then forced me to select a jetski

Astrobytes: Yeah, I don't mind them. Fk living there surrounded by 'em though :D

Astrobytes: What's your enormous spider bug then?

1400179: You know the exploration term of mcts

Astrobytes: Yep

1400179: Turns out sum of child visits is not quite parent visits

Astrobytes: Oh dear, you've made a wrong calculation. And still won a lot.

Astrobytes: Don't fix it :P

eulerscheZahl: i know something worse than spiders: German car commercials

Astrobytes: lol

struct: Can people edit contribution if the source code is not downloadable?

struct: or does it only apply to public ones?

struct: By people I mean other users

1400179: ?

1400179: Other users can edit a multi?

struct: Yes

struct: ...

1400179: Um.

1400179: wat

struct: euler tried to edit yavalath and managed to do it iirc

Astrobytes: Couldn't edit Langton's though

eulerscheZahl: langton is an old contribution

Astrobytes: Ah right enough.

eulerscheZahl: i have very old private drafts that i can't even delete

BlaiseEbuth: Perhaps only euler can...

struct: Well you can try, just download yavalath source and reupload

struct: I was wondering if people could edit non downloadable

struct: and remove the boss for example

1400179: Website is so ripe for abuse it's not even funny

eulerscheZahl: recently i thought i found a big one but luckily I was wrong

eulerscheZahl: it's part of the SDK, so I removed it and tested some JS in the statement

1400179: Anyway to struct's original question, I don't see why it would prevent them then

eulerscheZahl: but it's just a duplication of what's done on the server again

1400179: Oh boy

struct: oh well

struct: I uploaded amazons to a private contribution

struct: it builded succesfully

struct: ..

eulerscheZahl: built :P

struct: (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻

struct: Maybe send doesnt work

struct: but Im not going to test it

struct: oh I can try the send in yavalath I guess


struct: oh well

struct: Im not even sure if its worth reporting it

Astrobytes: Most likely it comes under Very Minor . . .

struct: we will fix if its exploited

struct: its more suitable

struct: sorry im a bit salty

Astrobytes: Me too, don't worry.

1400179: Ever since the great salt flood

eulerscheZahl: to be fair far less than 5% of the users play community multiplayer games

jacek: "Turns out sum of child visits is not quite parent visits" w00t?

DomiKo: How much is 5% of users?

1400179: 5% iodine salt

struct: 100000 /s

Astrobytes: 42

struct: the survey was around 200k right?

1400179: 200k survey answers??

eulerscheZahl: 166k

struct: I think so

eulerscheZahl: totally all regular users

struct: lol

1400179: Well at least I can rest in peace, I was wondering if I should have botted in retrospect

1400179: But 200k is a bit much

jacek: botted?

eulerscheZahl: bot for survey

jacek: :scream:

eulerscheZahl: when i saw the survey i had no idea how relevant it would be

struct: ^

1400179: Me neither, but at 200k margin for error is small

Astrobytes: ^^

eulerscheZahl: not even sure if i answered "compete" or "fun"

eulerscheZahl: and competing is a subset of the fun part for me

struct: I either voted fun or learn

1400179: Then again god knows who answered that

jacek: 5%?

eulerscheZahl: school classes

Astrobytes: Robin Hoods

BlaiseEbuth: Not me

1400179: Wait so 166k survey answers

struct: yes

1400179: 5 new idiots per day in chat

1400179: And 15 regulars

1400179: Something doesn't add up

struct: lol

eulerscheZahl: most are "explorers"

Astrobytes: heh heh

Astrobytes: Explore once and then can't find their way back here?

struct: A true explorer

1400179: Then again I still have no idea how we have so many discord users so what do I know

1400179: Targeted audience of lurkers

Astrobytes: People see discord and click

Astrobytes: (a certain subset of people)

eulerscheZahl: i'm still on the codeforces discord and have it muted

BlaiseEbuth: Keep salting guys, I almost hear the seagulls...

jacek: and get disappointed because its not mlp

Astrobytes: The difference in subscriber count vs active participants is... not small

1400179: It's always low but that low is a bit of a novelty to me

Astrobytes: 2021: The Salting

1400179: 2.5k online in discord, you wouldn't effing know

Astrobytes: Indeed

eulerscheZahl: someone even decided it hide offline users

1400179: I think it does that by itself when there's too many actually

eulerscheZahl: 15k members in total

1400179: Here's what Discord has to say about our server

1400179: "Your server needs more members who visit and talk weekly"

1400179: "Your retention is too low. Try improving your new member onboarding experience"

pb4: "5 new idiots per day in chat And 15 regulars "

pb4: I'm not a regular

pb4: so am I an idiot ? :D

eulerscheZahl: we need more custom emojis on discord

1400179: If you are, not a new one at least

pb4: (hello)

Astrobytes: That logic!

BlaiseEbuth: We need a salt emoji here

Astrobytes: I said that a long time ago Blaise

eulerscheZahl: :salt:

BlaiseEbuth: Me too, but nobody add it...

kovi: pb?4 is surely with 5%

kovi: within

pb4: I'm surprised that I'm having fun with the Sopra challenge

Astrobytes: It's more fun than the original codebusters?

1400179: I'm surprised you're doing it at all

eulerscheZahl: i'm too reasonable for Sopra, I try the topcoder marathon

1400179: Where is the leaderboard anyway

pb4: reCurse : so am I actually !


1400179: If I knew you were doing it maybe I would have been tempted :p

1400179: Still need my revenge

Astrobytes: TC marathon started eulerscheZahl?

eulerscheZahl: yesterday

eulerscheZahl: 6 days remaining

Astrobytes: What is it?


pb4: What's really refreshing is that I'm regularly finding measurable improvements

eulerscheZahl: swap any 2 tiles

struct: candy rush?

Astrobytes: Oh bejeweled kinda thing

eulerscheZahl: then if there is 3 in a line (not diagonally) it disappears

Astrobytes: Not diagonally? Weird

eulerscheZahl: points for long lines and long lasting combos

pb4: Contrary to FC and OOC, where 95% of changes I didn't really know if they help

1400179: Hmm

eulerscheZahl: line: (length-2)^2

1400179: Any idea why?

pb4: In this game : 95% of changes *do help*

eulerscheZahl: sum of line scores multiplied by combo count

Astrobytes: Sounds reasonably interesting. Might take a look at it.

eulerscheZahl: you are still far from the end of the contest pb4

pb4: reCurse you still have a few days to take your revenge :)

eulerscheZahl: usually that's about the time when I run out of ideas

pb4: eulerscheZahl : I have run out of ideas already

pb4: Won't spend time grinding this one though

eulerscheZahl: then try Triangle Catch ;)

1400179: Nah that's starting too late

1400179: And if you're not tryharding it's not worth it either ;)

pb4: No good idea, no time spent

pb4: eulerscheZahl : I really should, it looks cool

eulerscheZahl: leaderboard for CB is almost exclusively French I guess without prizes as an extra motivation, many discarded the idea

pb4: I didn't think it would play such a big role, but I find it hard to muster the motivation when there is no real time limit

eulerscheZahl: (or job opportunity)

eulerscheZahl: i totally agree. I need a fixed deadline

1400179: And focused attention

pb4: Just knowing that it doesn't make a difference if I start today or tomorrow doesn't help starting :/

eulerscheZahl: a real one, not the bitrunner fake contest

pb4: Yes

pb4: Well we did what we could for BR

Astrobytes: Salt wave incoming

1400179: That wasn't a diss on BR really

1400179: But we all know

eulerscheZahl: if CG doesn't want contests, we can't really do anything about it building our own platform is not an option

jacek: build your own platform. with blackjack and hookers

1400179: fwiw I still enjoyed BR

eulerscheZahl: i still haven't started :(

Astrobytes: Me too, even though I didn't do particularly well. Great game.

1400179: pb4's bosses were quite fun

pb4: Thanks :)

Astrobytes: The hard bosses really make it.

eulerscheZahl: i still have a backup to read later

Astrobytes: lol

struct: I think it was a good game, better than some of CG official ones

eulerscheZahl: procrastination at its finest

eulerscheZahl: and no changes at all after release, were there?

1400179: Just would have been better with the CG attention magic

Astrobytes: Yeah, for sure

eulerscheZahl: for CG contests it's standard. bug fixes and each extra inputs like dead pacmen

Astrobytes: Don't think so euler

Astrobytes: (changes after release)

pb4: Nope, no changes

pb4: We had reserved the possibility to do so during the first few days of the fake-contest

1400179: Let me know next time you tryhard on something pb4

pb4: But apparently testing had been thourough enough :)

pb4: Haha reCurse :D

pb4: Will od

pb4: do*

1400179: Next best thing after a contest

Default avatar.png HiRadical: lol this is why I hate writing c# code.

jacek: oO

Default avatar.png HiRadical: I do a problem with 72 chars in python meanwhile someone has like 30000000 lines of code in c++ or something

jacek: on shortest mode?

eulerscheZahl: don't use a hammer for a screw

Astrobytes: Where's the "Use the right tool for the job" autoresponder

Astrobytes: Way too much of this exact complaint recently.

Astrobytes: For my liking.

Astrobytes: /salt

1400179: So what does that have to do with c# and what's the problem?

eulerscheZahl: C# and codegolf

1400179: Yeah but he said he's doing it in python

1400179: And something about gigabytes of c++ code

eulerscheZahl: my bad, selective reading when I sense a clasher

Astrobytes: Soon, every clash will declare everyone in 1st place.

1400179: ?

Astrobytes: People who don't use ruby/python/perl get real hurt about losing shortest mode.

Astrobytes: Complaints everywhere.

Astrobytes: The solution therefore is to declare them all as winners, to keep it Fun.

eulerscheZahl: should we get rid of clash? it makes some people lose which is sad

eulerscheZahl: they might get frustrated and never come back

1400179: Tempting to start trolling

1400179: Like start forum threads about using character multiplier for different languages

Stilgart: eulerscheZahl: same troll on #fr :D

1400179: C# should be 0.4

1400179: Java 0.01

struct: lol

Astrobytes: :D

struct: I dont understand why peolpe take coc seriously

Astrobytes: Yeah, but hate 'competing'...

eulerscheZahl: in Germany we have "Bundesjugendspiele" (kids running, throwing a ball as far as they can, long jump, ...)

Astrobytes: (Sports Day)

eulerscheZahl: and one kid came home crying as it performed poorly. logical reaction from the mother: make a petition to stop that event

eulerscheZahl: got a surprisingly high attention and number of signs

eulerscheZahl: i wonder how these kids grow up and perform in the real world after school

Astrobytes: We had the same issue with Sports Day even when I was at primary school. Nowadays everyone gets a certificate of participation so they don't feel like they lost.

Astrobytes: Yes, your last point there euler. Exactly.

1400179: The real world adapts to them

eulerscheZahl: so that's why we have less contests now? and noob friendly contests

1400179: It's much broader than that

1400179: Maybe it's just me but I'm tempted to bury the hatchet, topic got old and salt is out of control

1400179: It is what it is to quote a stable genius

eulerscheZahl: i accepted defeat already

Astrobytes: "stable genius" heh heh

Astrobytes: Yeah, the saltiness will surely be overtaken by a rush of syrupy-sweetness given time.

struct: Save the saltiness to when the new feature is released

Astrobytes: lol

eulerscheZahl: what will it be? the twitter post thing?

struct: No idea when, and ys

struct: yeS*

1400179: Let's just move on

Salted: Can we just know which clash we're going for? It's like signing up to play a sports game and no knowing which sport you're signing up for. Maybe it'll be hockey, tennis. Personally I would rather just pick the game I want to play in coc.

struct: private clashes allow you to choose

struct: But its not that usefull if you dont have people to join

1400179: The player pool is not big enough to afford fracturing the matchmaking

eulerscheZahl: easy fix: if it's a shortest one, you close the tab and start a new one

eulerscheZahl: reverse? close and start new

eulerscheZahl: fastest? also close and start new

1400179: Doesn't that tank your rating?

eulerscheZahl: yes

Salted: How do you know which one it'll be?

struct: Just submit 1 char with 0%

eulerscheZahl: you see it when it started

struct: sometimes its enough for top 50%

Salted: Oh you have to wait. That's lame.

Astrobytes: <insert comment here>

[Kian-carling]: ok

Salted: <insert rebuttal>

TBali: there are close to 500 solo puzzles - no competition, no time pressure, no (too much) language disadvantage

Astrobytes: ^

TBali: and in general more interesting problems

Salted: But no adrenaline rush either

Salted: The clashes are actually kind of addicting

1400179: Eh, now that's an interesting idea

1400179: Puzzle rush like in chess

Default avatar.png Wings_of_Safety: You know it would make sense not to compare languages that are inherently shorter to code in with more verbose languages. Should have different categories of code like in boxing; lightweight to heavyweight. Or, you know, just have each language as a competition category.

TBali: My max was 20 puzzles in a day

struct: new puzzle rush on lichess is pretty good

TBali: But unrepeatable now for me, remaining stuff is hard

struct: starts very easy but its good

1400179: Yeah, that would probably give a better alternative to clashes

Kr3sZ: guys, what's the statement if the input is 3 and 5, and the output is 5 6 7 \n 6 7 8 \n 7 8 9 ? i can't get it

TBali: That could be a nice contest-like event

1400179: You could even do like the fancy ones where the puzzle gets a rating

TBali: But that would need withhelding few dozen puzzles (to reveal them at the same time)

TBali: I like this idea

TBali: Pikaptcha was somewhat similar

struct: for(i=5;i<5+3;++i) s="" for(j=0;j<3;++j) s+=j+i+" "

struct: something like taht Kr3sZ

TBali: but tematic and 4h only

Astrobytes: I can't stand puzzle contests. Just imo.

SPDene: Kr3sZ looks like input: 3 5 means produce a 3x3 grid of numbers, startiong with 5 (not sure if that's what you're asking)

1400179: The only thing I could see in favor of clashes is time pressure, this would give it a better alternative imo

Astrobytes: Yeah I agree it would certainly be an improvement

kovi: hmm, i thought it is possible to reach legend uttt with pure many rollouts should i reach?

1400179: Umm

1400179: Was it 20k or 50

1400179: Forgot

struct: 20-25k

Astrobytes: 20-25k iirc

Salted: If it wasn't for the clashes I'd probably be on a different site or solving on my own. It really is just the rush of competition.

TBali: For pikaptcha was adrenaline for 4 hours

TBali: finished in 3:52 or so...

DomiKo: kovi 15K is good too

kovi: no heuristic?

1400179: No

DomiKo: no

kovi: hmm...i still need to double

eulerscheZahl: i hated pikaptcha done with the first 2 in 21min. then I didn't understand the möbius task

struct: Was site slow during pikapctha?

eulerscheZahl: and finished after >3h

eulerscheZahl: no, that was fine

eulerscheZahl: locam sprint was horrible

TBali: Maybe a puzzle rush would be better with more available puzzles and not building on each other

struct: yeah

TBali: so you can skip the one you don'T like or stuck

struct: No skip

struct: People should get space maze

struct: as first puzzle

TBali: :)

eulerscheZahl: episode 2

TBali: my fellow troll

eulerscheZahl: the one that i never published as i can't solve it myself

TBali: freecell can come after it

Astrobytes: Perhaps you can WIP it euler, see if anyone can solve it

TBali: what is the hardest puzzle in expert?

TBali: (subjective I know)

struct: What was the main difference in ep2?

struct: Well Nintendo probably has the lowest success rate

struct: But people are curious and click on it to check

struct: so that adds up

TBali: Yep, in it is still C++ only...

TBali: don't understand why, contest is over long time ago

TBali: I found some fairly easy puzzles ion expert, and some quite hard in medium

Astrobytes: That happened after The Great Mixing.

eulerscheZahl: just too many states in space maze 2. and my speed improvements don't work there anymore

TBali: another quick contest idea - you only 1 puzzle (not too hard or long) - first to pass in ALL languages wins

k4ng0u: how many people did finish space maze (1)?

struct: 10

struct: im not sure I think


struct: I thought I saw that number

TBali: stats page for solo

k4ng0u: and this is not the hardest puzzle ever?

k4ng0u: (on cg)

jacek: space maze?

eulerscheZahl: now it's freecell going by solver count

struct: ^

TBali: number of solutions also dpeends on since when the puzzle is there. Success % is also revealing

Westicles: the hardest one is that stupid one where you have to print out the stupid unix directory structure

eulerscheZahl: but those numbers are biased. much more users saw nintendo

TBali: you can sort the list above

eulerscheZahl: only try-harders got to see space maze

TBali: If I see you are the author, I know it will be interesting but bloody hard

k4ng0u: oh ok, must have missed a few messages in the feed hard puzzle harder than very hard and everything at 50XP classic CG

eulerscheZahl: and 250xp for creators

eulerscheZahl: no matter if clash or complex multiplayer

TBali: Westicles, which one is that? I remember solving a dir tree printer but that was not hard


k4ng0u: oh well. not much of a contributor myself but this sounds not so good, especially considering the harder the puzzle is, the most effort needs to be put in the testcases (outsider view though, might be challenged)

Astrobytes: Welcome to the CG Salt Mine :)

TBali: advanced tree - I did not find that one particularly hard. only tedious

eulerscheZahl: the animations are what usually takes the most time

eulerscheZahl: and testing corner cases for multiplayer games to make sure nothing breaks

TBali: 300 loc for me

Westicles: Oh, yeah I meant tedious... hard to finish

TBali: But my style is verbose

TBali: from medium, mars lander 2 is the hardest imho

MSmits: i second thaty

TBali: (except the 3 I still have left)

MSmits: I spent two days on that when i had just joined CG

Westicles: this nurikabe one is fun, but I doubt it will end up being very hard

TBali: 1 of course from eauler... :-)

MSmits: and then after that i tried skynet 2 and solved it in 15 minutes

eulerscheZahl: i even solved marslander 3 before 2

eulerscheZahl: my random search always failed 1 testcase when i tuned for the other

MSmits: yeah i guess when doing marslander 3, you use an actual search, that you can then also use on marslander 2

eulerscheZahl: then i wrote a few if statements and passed

MSmits: but marslander 2 is medium, so who is going to use GA on a medium puzzle...

eulerscheZahl: and added the random search to improve my solution from there

MSmits: yeah mine was fully heuristic

eulerscheZahl: how needs GA when there is MC?

MSmits: well it's a search anyways :)

MSmits: also, your MC are usually pretty smart

TBali: from expert Hitori is at most medium

TBali: simple backtrack

eulerscheZahl: then i checked solutions and included 2 more heuristics from those and just test all 3 combined with my random search

eulerscheZahl: find path with heuristic. then random step or 2. from there heuristic again to finish the landing. check if better

struct: I cant stay on the same puzzle for more than 1 hour

struct: adhd

TBali: "but marslander 2 is medium, so who is going to use GA on a medium puzzle..."

I suggest checking Agade's solution in C++ for The Descent

TBali: :)

eulerscheZahl: you mean Onboarding

TBali: the one with NN

TBali: don't remember

TBali: Right, onboarding it is. I found it because of the huge amount of upvotes (well deserved)

TBali: But the NN was trained offline, weights are hardcoded

TBali: This might be another idea for "beaty contest" - maybe for - publish the weirdest wolutions possible

TBali: Reminds me to the Niels Bohr barometer anecdote

TBali: (And we are coming back to the "right tool for the right task topic")


eulerscheZahl: have fun

TBali: Funny if you don't heard it yet

TBali: Whit perl it would be just plain codes

TBali: *with


jacek: and this reminds me of tom & jerry

TBali: maybe an anti-golf contest?

TBali: longest code, BUT all lines must have a purpose in the solution

TBali: (hard to judge automatically, I am afraid)

TBali: let me check - my longest puzzle solution is last crusade 2

TBali: at 22 kB

TBali: my shortest is google interview

TBali: ungolfed 163 bytes - but that includes the puzzle link in a comment

TBali: my contest/bot codes are longer

PatrickMcGinnisII: at least coc works better for me with the new web layout on cg

struct: you get the new layout?

struct: for me its 50/50

TBali: my browser reverted to the old upper bar. on mobile it is the new one

TBali: But why is it better? I thought only the menu bar changed

TBali: IDE is the same no?

eulerscheZahl: yeah, CG has a different understanding of A/B testing

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: Who needs a game made for them?

JLukeSkywalker: you can make my game

JLukeSkywalker: I just havnt bc I hate graphics

eulerscheZahl: add walls and power-ups already

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: Alrighty!

JLukeSkywalker: GRAPHICS

JLukeSkywalker: REEEE

eulerscheZahl: so you have to collect ammo

eulerscheZahl: and heal

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: Alrighty!

TBali: Don't forget fog of war

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: So like a First Person Shooter Game?

**eulerscheZahl slaps TBali around a bit with a large fishbot

Astrobytes: ammo/shields/speed boost

TBali: FPS but with a text parser input

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: Alright.

TBali: interactive fiction style

struct: astro this is what tric trac was talking about right?

TBali: By the way CG should support Inform 6

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: $5.00 = 1 Week Delivery at Minimum Free = 1 Month at the least.

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: I suppose you want free?

eulerscheZahl: take your time, a good game can take a month

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: True.

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: I'm a nice guy so I'm gonna make it as good as possible.

Astrobytes: struct: Not sure about mixing the sides like that

Astrobytes: black/white adjacent

Astrobytes: Not sure

JLukeSkywalker: currently have next leagues for tanks with shield and variable bullet size, working on adding the walls

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: Alright.

TBali: can we pay with CP?:

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: So you want:

- Realistic FPS Game

struct: port doom

eulerscheZahl: not sure if variable bullets add anything to the game

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: TBali its free!

eulerscheZahl: best case there is a clear best bullet and everyone is using it

eulerscheZahl: worst case some rock paper scissors

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: Multiplayer or robot shooting?

JLukeSkywalker: they cost your energy to fire, deals more dmg and goes slower

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: I think Muiltplayer.

Astrobytes: Ammo, shields, speed, health, that kinda thing

struct: 3d

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: Alright.

TBali: Okay, I see it is free, but at least add in game micro-transactions

struct: Surround sound

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: Email me at: so when I get home I can start making your game.

eulerscheZahl: for context MaxiLaw

Astrobytes: OK I'm commenting to JLukeSkywalker btw

jacek: struct ask MSmits to find balanced starting positions :v

TBali: I can provide better suggestions without context

eulerscheZahl: coming up with a game idea is the hardest IMO

JLukeSkywalker: i have the ideas, just too lazy

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: If you want a game just email me at: the best details you can give me.

JLukeSkywalker: after i finish tanks, next one is stock market

struct: I could force only one unit per player on each 4x4 board

TBali: I am wondering if Diplomacy can be implemented

Astrobytes: We'll beat that out of - I mean motivate you JLukeSkywalker

Astrobytes: :P

JLukeSkywalker: lol

TBali: But there offline negotiations are the key aspect

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: I am only in charge of game making and multiplayer services. You are responsible for everything else.

1400179: What the hell did I just read

struct: Which part?

1400179: Yes

eulerscheZahl: the email address?

eulerscheZahl: oh, the yes meme

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw:

TBali: added to spam bots - tick

eulerscheZahl: be careful sharing your email address


Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: Its fine.

Astrobytes: struct: that could work yeah

jacek: AutomatonNN will you spam

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: I get spam all the time.

AutomatonNN: Hi, I should have to look into that I have to add a ref solution

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: I just programmed something to prevent it.

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: It doesn't work the best.

Astrobytes: struct: Gonna have to experiment a bit initially

struct: yeah

1400179: Where is the check everything button when you need it

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: But yea I will start working on it when I get home@

eulerscheZahl: you want to approve a contribution reCurse?

eulerscheZahl: there are lots of checkmarks

1400179: Nah if clashers can do it I can manage

1400179: But that website you linked

1400179: That's a lot of checkboxes

Astrobytes: :D

JLukeSkywalker: are there even any puzzles on here that use trend-following and other stock prediction algorithms yet?

1400179: If you mean puzzles with no practical real-life use oh boy have we got those


Astrobytes: :rofl:


eulerscheZahl: had a crypto trader optim

eulerscheZahl: the internet had

MSmits: jacek if there was any point to using meta mcts to help out struct I would. But I would both need a reasonably strong bot which I have no idea how to write and then some way to deal with the branching, or a million hours of computer time

jacek: youll manage. i believe in you

MSmits: thanks :P

eulerscheZahl: yeah, you have the money to rent some servers

TBali: This would make a great AI game (

jacek: you dont need good bot. only mcts with enough rollouts

MSmits: technically i can afford some, but I would never get wife-approval :P

1400179: I have the algo you just need to provide infinity

eulerscheZahl: buy google

eulerscheZahl: i think i don't have to read the article to say "hell no"

TBali: which article?

MSmits: that seems like a uniquely human game

eulerscheZahl: diplomacy

TBali: I played it play bay email long time ago

TBali: it lasted 4 months

Astrobytes: Yes. Risk might work

TBali: Risk has random

MSmits: you mean platinum rift

TBali: Diplomacy is deterministic

TBali: much better

Default avatar.png piggymann23_funnergame25: yoo

Astrobytes: Yes but requires... Diplomacy

TBali: yes - that is the hard part

TBali: writing natural language emails to other bots

TBali: and understanding the incoming ones

Astrobytes: Off you go then, this is your project for the year. In PHP.

MSmits: this makes me wonder, has there ever been evidence of players cooperating illegally?

MSmits: i know it happened in halite

TBali: the game mechanic is very simple

TBali: and teher is no META

TBali: just subterfuge

JLukeSkywalker: might be easier to make the game coup, still some cool strategy and subterfuge

Astrobytes: I thought Halite had communication features?

TBali: Actually no trolling was intended, Diplomacy could ba made with a simplified diplomacy API

BlaiseEbuth: I'm starting to understand why people ask for reviews on their contributions on the chat or the forum... :(

TBali: make contact, make alliance

TBali: etc

TBali: agree on attacking X

MSmits: i mean two players identifying eachother in a game and then avoiding harming eachother

Astrobytes: Yeah, I thought that was part of it

MSmits: i think reCurse said something like that happened in halite

MSmits: i dont think that was supposed to happen

kovi: in 4 player game?

MSmits: yeah

kovi: which halite

1400179: H2

1400179: Can't remember if it was done in H3...

1400179: I know it was discussed

kovi: i c actually i learned enemy aggression in h3

Astrobytes: It was legal?

1400179: Nothing forbid it

JLukeSkywalker: someone just write an ai that reads in a game rule-book and spits out a codingame game

Astrobytes: Legal then.

1400179: Thankfully they run tens of thousands of games for finals

kovi: so i guess it would not be hard to learn patterns

MSmits: obviously not intended behavior though

1400179: I was able to measure the impact on rankings

1400179: It had none

1400179: But could have

kovi: well...anyone could still say...they dont want to mess with recurse and instead focus on easier opponents

MSmits: i guess you can do it when your output is sufficiently varied and you can output an id early in the game

MSmits: like if you output a float

1400179: It was continuous space so quite trivial

MSmits: ah right

kovi: i think in h3 someone trained his nn on recurse

1400179: Yeah

1400179: Supervised learning

MSmits: was it better than you?

1400179: No

Astrobytes: lol, how did that work out?

MSmits: ah good

1400179: Much better than it should have actually

1400179: I was also the only bot that was very learnable apparently

1400179: Namely failed on teccles

kovi: he said that in post mortem

MSmits: ahh, teccles should just be aheuristic like in uttt :P

Astrobytes: Been a while since I read all the halite pms

1400179: I didn't know anything about NNs back then, should read his again

MSmits: so basically, he just read the gamestate got an output from his NN and backpropagated a score based on how similar the orders were to your bot's

MSmits: thats my guess about how supervised would work

1400179: Yeah except the game features hundreds of agents so he must have had to hack something

MSmits: yeah that seems hard

1400179: Oh yeah I think I remember why it worked much better on mine than others

1400179: I had no adaptive collision detection >:(

MSmits: seems easier to just write your own bot tbh.

1400179: Depends on your goal

1400179: He has done the most impressive one imo

MSmits: because he did something that is hard to do?

Stilgart: h3 ?

Default avatar.png piggymann23_funnergame25: :grin:

1400179: Hard to do and with much more generalized uses

MSmits: I see

1400179: One of the main goals was to promote machine learning

1400179: He may be the only one who did that and made it work

1400179: Keyword: and

kovi: i agree. and it is not simple, i read it few monthes ago when i got some (minimal) nn understanding and there are interesting parts

MSmits: hey, i know you're nr 1 in pr-2, but would it not be a good goal for you to try a NN there, new challenge?

1400179: Implying I don't currently have a challenge with easier parts

Astrobytes: Fixed the bug now?

1400179: Yeah the fix was easy

jacek: what bug

1400179: sum of child visits != parent visits

jacek: :O

Astrobytes: Yeah easy fix, you're retraining now?

1400179: Yeah

jacek: how come

1400179: Off by one error with catastrophic implications

MSmits: transpositions?

MSmits: oh

jacek: log(0)

1400179: I'd have to describe everything I do to properly convey how bad it was

1400179: So you'll have to take my word for it

jacek: what gamre

1400179: uttt, bt, othello, checkers...

jacek: :scream:

Astrobytes: Comparing to 3.6 roentgen/hour it was on the terrible side of not great.

MSmits: that's pretty bad

Astrobytes: Seemed appropriate :)

1400179: I don't get it

Astrobytes: REM values. Also Chernobyl reference.

1400179: Hmm

Astrobytes: "3.6 roentgens per hour? Well, not great, not terrible"

MSmits: ah 3,6 roentgen is actually not that much

MSmits: i never use that unit

Astrobytes: No, it's not great, not terrible either.

MSmits: yeah that's actually accurate, i thought it was some kind of understatement

Astrobytes: I never used it much either apart from a few exams.

Astrobytes: Well, the meters only went up to 3.6 roentgens....

MSmits: well if you have to stand in that radiation all day it's a problem yeah

MSmits: with no protection

MSmits: I have to teach this stuff in a few weeks

MSmits: we use Sv unit for equivalent dose

Astrobytes: The point was that there was a lot more than 3.6 roentgens coming from the open core.

struct: MSmits the amazons will probably be 8x8 and have random starting positions, suggested by trictrac

MSmits: makes sense, if it topped the meters...

struct: random mirrored

MSmits: struct can't hurt to be safe

MSmits: as long as they are balanced

MSmits: we dont want another bandas

Astrobytes: It blew the meters with higher limits too.

MSmits: you said mirrored, thats probably ok

1400179: lol bandas

1400179: I tried it for fun

1400179: Biggest regret of my life after uttt

struct: lol

1400179: How did this get approved

1400179: No don't tell me

MSmits: ahh you place too much emphasis on leaderboard viability. Sometimes it can just be fun to code something :)

1400179: Fun?

1400179: What's that

jacek: whats wrong with bandas

MSmits: my point exactly :P

jacek: aside its solved after few turns

MSmits: jacek it has starts that are so unbalanced, the winner is clear when there are two good bots

MSmits: no matter what they do

1400179: Eval saying -0.8 on first turn

1400179: Yeah.

jacek: and its right?

MSmits: yeah it's right

MSmits: my mcts says -0.3 or so, with scores between -1 and 1 and it's very reliable

1400179: Map gen is a joke and I don't even know if it's fixable

MSmits: it was actually improved

1400179: !

MSmits: was worse at first

MSmits: i meant before you tried it

1400179: You can't make worse

1400179: That's like saying there is negative abs(x)

Astrobytes: that fireball guy should not have approved, he was a big copypaster iirc

MSmits: - abs(x) ?

1400179: No, x where abs(x) < 0

jacek: imaginary?

MSmits: imaginary doesnt do that

MSmits: thats when you square

Astrobytes: That's not imaginary

Astrobytes: eh, too slow again

jacek: absolutely imaginary?

1400179: Gotta go for fictional

MSmits: wait, we did not count on jacek's imagination

Astrobytes: Imaginatively absolutely fictional?

1400179: I'm sure there's a pony that has a negative absolute

1400179: Would reinforce my theory actually

Astrobytes: Princess Negabsolutor

Astrobytes: I feel dirty.

jacek: well if you can have sqrt of negative, why not abs of negative

jacek: im gonna look for that

1400179: negative abs not abs of negative

1400179: Big difference

jacek: whatever

MSmits: what's the meta on game of drones?

MSmits: do people use GA?

Default avatar.png Angecide: found a discussion about it on math stackexchange, seems like it could exist in some obscure field

1400179: Uh oh

MSmits: I'm just asking because I have 3 students doing game of drones and it would be helpful if i knew the game a bit better, maybe get out of silver

1400179: I was replying to Angecide

1400179: I completely forgot what I did for god

MSmits: yeha i got that

MSmits: i wonder if it has to be approached as some kind of partial optimization problem

MSmits: not just an adversarial bot search like we usually have

MSmits: (on boardgames etc)

1400179: It's definitely unique

MSmits: I was thinking of trying SA with a solution assigning drones to a primary and secondary target

MSmits: then doing some sims and repeating the same for opponents

Astrobytes: Why SA in particular?

1400179: Physics

MSmits: cuz I like it

MSmits: and i dont know many others

Astrobytes: :D

1400179: Biologists go for GA

MSmits: that too :0

Astrobytes: Meh, I like SA too

MSmits: I think god might be better or just as good as csb for people who are relatively new to coding. It's so easy to get a starting bot and slowly add new things

1400179: :thinking:

MSmits: there's no physics and stuff, all you do is send your drones somewhere

MSmits: big searchspace, simple actions

kovi: isnt it about economy rather?

1400179: If you can get past how boring it looks you might be right

kovi: (havent played it)

MSmits: right yeah somewhat boring i guess

Astrobytes: Heh. Not wrong there actually.

MSmits: kovi, no economy

MSmits: just score from keeping captured nodes

MSmits: like domination in a fps

Astrobytes: Definitely has a scheduling thing going on though

MSmits: except no shooting

Astrobytes: iirc

MSmits: how do you mean Astrobytes

Astrobytes: what to send where and when

1400179: This may be wildly off topic but

Astrobytes: So, some part of it might be reducible to a simpler problem

1400179: Gladiabots has something very good about teaching "coding" within a "bot game"

1400179: Execution is a bit off imo but the underlying idea is pretty good

Astrobytes: That name tho

MSmits: that's not off topic at all, always nice to check those things out

MSmits: ohh a steam game

1400179: And behavior trees have a major relevance when it comes to game AI

MSmits: right

MSmits: you see a lot of that in those turnbased and real time strategy games

MSmits: saw some edited behavior files for some of those

1400179: I'm no teacher but I'm sure there's some gold to be found there

MSmits: if there is, it's probably going to be for those really strong students that are already far along. Most of my students can barely code

MSmits: that's the difficult part with AI

1400179: Yeah but you don't need to code to do behavior trees

jacek: just wait for AI to code for you

MSmits: oh I see

Astrobytes: You can do them on a whiteboard

1400179: Yet it teaches similar principles

MSmits: I'll check it out

1400179: In a context that might be more appealing to some

jacek: AutomatonNN can do them as well

AutomatonNN: eulerscheZahl is there a way to understand the internet

1400179: I know I didn't give a damn about geometry until I learned it could be used in video games

jacek: no one understands the internet

Astrobytes: Yeah, it's always great to show applied examples of what you're learning

Astrobytes: Varied examples at that

TBali: multiplying huge matrices became fancy only with the advent of ML...

MSmits: reCurse yeah I got a lot more interested in linear algebra when i was building custom weaponry in space engineers and scripting them to hit spaceships moving at a constant velocity :)

TBali: same with graph theory and CG

MSmits: yeah

1400179: While we're into these recommendations, if you want to get bitten by parallelism problems in a gamey way, spacechem is fantastic

Astrobytes: I love all the zachtronics games tbh

1400179: True

TBali: I bought only one (actually because Astrobytes recommended) - I don'T dare to buy the rest, I am afraid of the lost time

TBali: I mean time to be lost

1400179: Is it lost if you have fun

Astrobytes: Whilst keeping your mind sharp

TBali: Ask my social peers like family, friends...

Astrobytes: Make them play it.

TBali: Justr checking my Gog account. Actually I bought Spacechem besides TIS100 but did not install it yet

Astrobytes: You know what to do.

TBali: bye, be right back (in February)

jacek: o:

TBali: but another topic - just listening to a C++ tutorial. This unique_ptr, shared_ptr thing seems a bit complicated. Do people actually use these?

struct: yes

Astrobytes: Yes.

1400179: Yes

BlaiseEbuth: No

TBali: that is overwhelming vote :-)

Astrobytes: It's really not complicated.

TBali: this manual memory management seems to be tough for any code over 50 lines

1400179: ???

TBali: I mean in general

TBali: not the *_ptr

1400179: What are you talking about, it's the opposite of manual

Astrobytes: That's automatic memory management, manual memory management is * fun

TBali: I meant C++ in general - so no CG, haveing to worry about delete

TBali: but not finished th course yet, so even my comments might not make sense

1400179: Well you lost me

RoboStac: thats why unique / shared ptr exist so you never have to type delete again

1400179: ^

Astrobytes: Once it's out of scope it's done for you

TBali: okay, next time I actually FINIS the lecture before I ask :-)

MSmits: well there's no segmentation faults in C# :P

MSmits: he's not wrong that there's more ways fk up in C++

1400179: Do NPEs count?

MSmits: nonylphenol ethoxylates ?

1400179: Exactly

Astrobytes: I mean I'd still practice using raw pointers if you're unfamiliar but the unique/shared pointers are a real help

TBali: but if they delete automatically isn't part of the speed advantage lost?

TBali: is it so good?

TBali: That is half GC, only determeniszic timing, no?

1400179: Don't take offense

1400179: But there's so many things wrong in that question I'm not sure what to say

1400179: What performance are you talking about?

1400179: And it's not garbage collection because it still needs to be explicitly freed

1400179: It's just done automatically via the destructor

1400179: What is allocated needs to be freed regardless

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: I didn't get a email for the game that someone wants made, I am home.

TBali: okay, thanks.

RoboStac: yeah, either you free the memory before the pointer goes out of scope or you leak the memory and lose it forever

RoboStac: I mean I guess it's technically faster to leak until you run out of memory

Astrobytes: lol

1400179: That's true, it's also led to the invention of GC

TBali: Actually in PHP with some puzzles I start with "disable_gc()"

MSmits: I played a lot of games where players were complaining about memory leaks happening in extended play

MSmits: before i could even code

TBali: if I am not out of memory till I solve it I am much faster

1400179: What if I could leak until I run out of memory and then let someone else free the memory for me

struct: you can disable gc on php?

TBali: yes

Default avatar.png MaxiLaw: For the person that wanted a FPS game made I never got a email on complete details? I am home so I can work on it now if you send me a email.


TBali: otherwise I am dead lost with objects in 100 ms turn time

MSmits: "Deactivates the circular reference collector"

JohnnyLuke: lol, is maxi trying to scam on a site of programmers?

MSmits: circular reference collector seems way more specific than GC?

1400179: The leak everything strategy rarely applies outside of CG

1400179: Well GC solves the circular ref problem

MSmits: but doesnt it solve more than that?

1400179: But when it comes to PHP I would assume the least possible except it's probably not doing what it says

RoboStac: php is reference counted so things do get collected as they go out of scope unless they have circular references

MSmits: ah ok

1400179: So they kind of have both at the same time? Sounds like PHP

MSmits: circular reference means 1->2->3->1 right?

MSmits: so it seems everything is still in use

TBali: CG in PHP is implemented with counting circular references

1400179: Or more simply, 1->2 2->1

MSmits: also 1 -> 1 ?

1400179: Hmm

1400179: I would say yes?

RoboStac: I'd imagine so

MSmits: hmm but what if it's a really large circular reference and you're actually using it? Or is that not possible?

TBali: This is how it works in PHP

1400179: Then it won't get GC

TBali: might be different from Java

MSmits: ah ok

1400179: GC only collects what cannot be referenced

1400179: From a root

MSmits: got it

jacek: could be a nice puzzle, to program GC behavior

MSmits: I guess I also understand now why gc can be so expensive

MSmits: it's BFS/DFS-ing everything in memory

MSmits: or floodfilling i guess

MSmits: better name for it

1400179: Btw it's not the only way to solve the circular ref problem

1400179: Weak refs are another way

TBali: Appeared in PHP 7.4 and more of it in PHP 8 just recently

MSmits: what's a weak ref?

TBali: never used it though

Astrobytes: doesn't increase the ref count for one thing

Astrobytes: but you can still hold the reference

MSmits: oh it's a low priority ref that leads to gc removing it if there is no other connection?

TBali: Weak references allow the programmer to retain a reference to an object which does not prevent the object from being destroyed. They are useful for implementing cache like structures.

TBali: "was a quote"

1400179: Doesn't have to be GC related

1400179: Concept exists in C++ as well

MSmits: ah ok, got it

1400179: Node and children

1400179: If parent and child are strong ref, you can't free the tree

1400179: If parent is weak ref, all is good

MSmits: mmh I just do parentIndex = 0 on my giant node cache :P

MSmits: I'm so horrible at c++

MSmits: I dont leak memory though

MSmits: i just claim it all in a giant object pool

1400179: That's a very legitimate allocation strategy

1400179: Maybe the oldest one

MSmits: yeah it's funny how windows will still just use your claimed memory

MSmits: I claim 1 gb and it will only show 200 mb in memory

1400179: There's a lot to say about that

1400179: Not sure it's worth it though

MSmits: dont bother, i sort of half know enough about it

MSmits: i just think it's funny it works that

MSmits: way

MSmits: they had to work this out or programs would claim too much memory and not use it

MSmits: i guess

1400179: Let's just say it falls apart when you want your computer to do more than one thing

MSmits: sure, it works under the assumption you dont run out

Astrobytes: Anit-threading

Astrobytes: *Anti

TBali: Airline overbooking works the same not?

MSmits: yeah sounds similar TBali

MSmits: that would really piss me off

1400179: That's a creative analogy

TBali: Just do not appear all the ticket holders at the airport...

MSmits: or people taking all their savings out of the bank at once :0

TBali: even better analogy

JLukeSkywalker: finally hit lvl 20

TBali: I have friends working at bank branch office. Elderly custromer came in, "please show me my money" I don't wnat to take it out just show me that you have it

Astrobytes: So violent. What did lvl 20 ever do to you?

TBali: Beware lvl 20 fighters can hit back

TBali: or mages trun you to frog

JLukeSkywalker: it never called me back

TBali: But we do like frogs here at CG

PatrickMcGinnisII: there's your game cat v frog v dog, frogs have waterguns, cats have claws, and dogs have teeth

1400179: waterguns?

PatrickMcGinnisII: cats and dogs usually don't like getting sprayed

Astrobytes: Frogs should have venom or very sticky tongues.

Astrobytes: Regardless, it's RPS/

Astrobytes: *RPS.

struct: it will get aproved anyways dont worry

1400179: Well no, frog is obviously OP

TBali: Are there other language where tongue and language is the same word?

1400179: FR

TBali: HU as well

struct: PT-PT

Astrobytes: Depends if it's actually poisonous or not

TBali: why PT-PT? BR-PT not?

PatrickMcGinnisII: trying to get 50 clashes, boring

Astrobytes: Yes, you can say tongue and language interchangeably in English too

1400179: ??

struct: br-pt should be too

TBali: poll: what is your favourite coding tongue?

TBali: sounds weird

1400179: Please stop sticking out your language at me

Astrobytes: No, doesn't work like that.

ryantimjohn: but mother tongue does

struct: thats 2 words

1400179: Sure but same word means both ways

Astrobytes: In the context of speaking about language I should have said, my bad.

Astrobytes: As always, context is everything.

TBali: in context free grammars not

TBali: there was a puzzle

Astrobytes: Yeah yeah

TBali: and I remember íChomsky from the university

TBali: was a quite weird course

TBali: don't remember anything

TBali: just the guy's name

Astrobytes: Noam Chomsky is a fairly well known guy

Default avatar.png owent3877: hi

TBali: yeah, and not a computer only

Default avatar.png owent3877: I'm new here

Default avatar.png owent3877: like, two minits ogo

Astrobytes: Indeed. Much of his great work is outside the field of linguistics alone

TBali: but I met with his work only in the context of this semester course dealing with artificial grammars

Default avatar.png owent3877: hello?

Default avatar.png Mr.intro: hello @owent

Astrobytes: TBali: It's a tough subject (for me at least)

Astrobytes: Hi new here

TBali: at that time it sounded very theorethic. Maybe good if you plan to write a parser for a compiler.

TBali: Not sure if it is used in NLP?

jacek: or html parser


TBali: or NLP went completely the deep neural networks way

jacek: Nay Little Pony?

TBali: yes that one

TBali: :)

Astrobytes: lol at your link jacek

TBali: regex was quite a mystery for me, I mean how can it be so fast,

TBali: Then I learned about KMP

TBali: last summer (did not know about this before)

TBali: But maybe regex is not using KMP

Astrobytes: regex matches patterns

TBali: yes, the deterministic state automatons can be extended also for patterns not just exact strings

TBali: my shallow knowledge on the topic comes from this course

Astrobytes: Hm. My knowledge isn't great either but I know that it's Yet Another Case of right tool, right job.

TBali: there was even a YACC in unix

TBali: Yer Another Compiler Compiler

TBali: implemented exactly the Chomsky parsing topic we discussed

Astrobytes: (hence my Y A C capitalisations)

jacek: yacek?

TBali: :)

TBali: Yet Another Coder Emitting Kode

TBali: okay, not the best one

TBali: With regexp as a (hobby) coder, my problem is that I don't use it on a weekly basis, so by the next time I need it, I always forget the syntax

TBali: Had to look up dozens of time already

TBali: I don't like code syntax not self-describing

Astrobytes: Yet Another Computationally Expensive Kill

jacek: what a coincedence. my app for android is call ya paper soccer - ya for yet another

Astrobytes: Yeah, if you don't use regex er, regularly, it can be a bit tricky to remember past the very basics

Astrobytes: Nice advertising there jacek. Didn't know you'd made an app. Does it sell?

TBali: yay = yet another yes

jacek: its free. i released it about 5 years ago

Astrobytes: Ah ok

jacek: it was actually my first serious ai project

TBali: is it same as the multi?

Astrobytes: Nice

TBali: (which I did not try, just see it )


jacek: sry for advertising

1400179: ban inc

TBali: cool, congrats

TBali: this is just okay self promotion imho

TBali: does it plays against human?

PatrickMcGinnisII: 1 clash left for 50

Astrobytes: Yes

PatrickMcGinnisII: yawn

jacek: ai and human, via wifi or bluetooth

TBali: Patrick, 50 ? go for the 500 achievement

Default avatar.png owent3877: do you know the ansed to code vr zombies?

Astrobytes: PatrickMcGinnisII: you're trying to get the achievement?

jacek: paper soccer as paper and pencil game is pretty popular in poland' schools

Default avatar.png owent3877: HELLO?!?!?!?

jacek: OHAI

1400179: DONT SCREAM

Default avatar.png owent3877: hello?

Default avatar.png owent3877: i nead help

struct: what is ansed?

MSmits: did you fall down a well owent3877?

Astrobytes: owent3877: 42.314^59266

Astrobytes: damn, missed a digit

Default avatar.png owent3877: Maybe


MSmits: the 42 is in there, thats enough answer

Astrobytes: What's that Skippy? Owen's fallen down the well?

MSmits: :grin:

MSmits: was this a dolphin or a kangaroo

MSmits: i forgot

Astrobytes: Flipper is the dolphin

MSmits: ahhh ok

Astrobytes: Skippy's the kangaroo

MSmits: got it

Astrobytes: Lassie was the dog

MSmits: keep going

Default avatar.png owent3877: and i thought i said answer

TBali: jacek - I did not this one in particular. I used to play a "car race" paper-pencil game on grid. Have to go fastest through a track , where each turn you can modify your movement vector by 1 only

MSmits: ed was the horse right?

1400179: Let me guess, homework?

Astrobytes: I'm all out of animals MSmits

Astrobytes: and lol

MSmits: you forgot ed

Astrobytes: How could I forget Mister Ed

MSmits: ye

MSmits: a horse is a horse is a horse

MSmits: of course

Default avatar.png owent3877: do you know the answers to code vr zombies?

1400179: Let me guess, homework?

Astrobytes: VR Zombies would be quite something

Default avatar.png owent3877: this is hard

MSmits: it's not hard, you cant die

MSmits: he just shoots all the zombies

Default avatar.png owent3877: i need the answers

1400179: Why

Default avatar.png owent3877: cuz i cant do it

Astrobytes: Learn.

1400179: Why do you 'need' it?

TBali: but with the answers in your hand, yu still "cant do it"

Default avatar.png owent3877: cuz i'm 10

MSmits: but he has the answers TBali, he doesnt need to, then

1400179: Ok. So why do you 'need' the answer?

Astrobytes: oh looks like one of our trolls again

MSmits: owent3877 you're not allowed to play zombie games, they're 12+

MSmits: too much blood/gore

Default avatar.png owent3877: shigh

MSmits: it's safe


MSmits: you will develop mental issues

Default avatar.png owent3877: i play halo reach

struct: good enough

MSmits: not safe i mean

1400179: Yeah we figured.

1400179: Start by answering my question, why do you 'need' it?

Default avatar.png owent3877: then all do the bat man thing

Astrobytes: I'm doing it right now

MSmits: you're doing the batman thing?

Astrobytes: I'm sure everyone will join in as you asked

TBali: this conversation gets weirder by the minute

Astrobytes: "all do the bat man thing"

MSmits: oh right

MSmits: let me go suit up

MSmits: reCurse, you can be Robin

Default avatar.png owent3877: i am soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo bad

Astrobytes: I'm doing the "BLAM! KAPOW! SPLAT" thing and nananana'ing around the small area of my chair seat.

1400179: Can't tell who's the bigger troll here

Default avatar.png owent3877: huh?

1400179: Can you explain what you need?

Astrobytes: owent3877: Talk sense

Default avatar.png owent3877: why?

Astrobytes: Or you get rubbish as a reply.

MSmits: I think he just got here randomly

1400179: You ask for something, I ask you why

Default avatar.png owent3877: did not

PatrickMcGinnisII: huh, quest map isn't updating

Astrobytes: What are you trying to do? Program? Or play a game?

MSmits: maybe we just should stop feeding the troll and let reCurse finish his responsible moderating

PatrickMcGinnisII: oh i had to click it

Default avatar.png owent3877: program

Astrobytes: You think reCurse isn't feeding it MSmits? :)

1400179: Doesn't sound like a troll, but you guys sure are

Default avatar.png owent3877: me?

MSmits: maybe

TBali: Owen, there is a forum thread with some hints


TBali: You might start by xhecking this out

MSmits: I guess we were assuming he was a troll, when he's actually serious

PatrickMcGinnisII: batman thing? Ahh, you know chicks think they are a sexy harleyquinn ... that just means they date jokers

Default avatar.png owent3877: owen is my real name

Astrobytes: Sounds like most of the trolls/idiotic randoms we get throughout the day: "GIVE ME THE ANSWER"

1400179: Sounds like a genuine 10yr old to me

1400179: Might want to get your senses checked out

Default avatar.png owent3877: sorry dude

Default avatar.png owent3877: i am 10

**MSmits goes to fix his troll radar

1400179: What are you trying to do?

**Astrobytes checks his senses

Default avatar.png owent3877: what?

TBali: If you find Zombies too hard try an easiwer one

Astrobytes: Have you solved other puzzles Owen?

MSmits: owent3877 do you know a little bit of coding? If you can't code at all it might be better to go to a learning website such as or others

struct: owent3877 the easiest way to solve cvz

MSmits: the idea is, if you're on CG, you know at least the bare minimum in language

struct: is to move to the closest zombie

MSmits: such as loops/conditions/input/print

MSmits: in 1 language i mean

Default avatar.png owent3877: i cant moov

TBali: move to the closest zombie almost works but not 100%

Default avatar.png owent3877: crap

struct: it is 100%

struct: I think

1400179: 100% is moving to closest human

struct: oh right

MSmits: yeah that works

Default avatar.png owent3877: what

Astrobytes: owent3877: which puzzles have you solved so far?

struct: Thats what i wanted to say

Default avatar.png owent3877: 3

MSmits: did you solve the descent, thor etc?

Astrobytes: which != how many

Default avatar.png owent3877: yes i salved thor

MSmits: i suggest you keep doing more easy puzzles

MSmits: optim arena's are a bit harder

Default avatar.png owent3877: what is that?

MSmits: zombies is an optimization arena

Astrobytes: What you're doing.

MSmits: and those are harder

Default avatar.png owent3877: oh

MSmits: than easy puzzles

TBali: Practice menu up at top of screen

TBali: the select easy

TBali: or

Default avatar.png owent3877: im doing ASCII ART

MSmits: also our apologies for making fun of you earlier owent3877, we get players who are trolls here sometimes

jacek: or solve puzzle of the week

Default avatar.png owent3877: i was trolled?

Default avatar.png owent3877: wow

MSmits: no, we thought you were a troll, but it seems like you're not

TBali: For the beginning few puzzles, what CG suggests as next is usually fine

MSmits: so, sorry about that

Default avatar.png owent3877: what would i troll for?

MSmits: good question

Astrobytes: I always reserve judgment.

TBali: Shoot firs, ask later

TBali: that is my motto

Default avatar.png owent3877: i dont know what trolling is

MSmits: trolling means players come here and then pretend they dont understand anything, call people names and such

MSmits: use bad words etc.

Astrobytes: Then how would you know to say: "what would i troll for?"

TBali: Check Astrobytes and myself: we are trolls

MSmits: not really

jacek: :unamused:

Default avatar.png owent3877: shure

Astrobytes: Out-trolled you jacek. Slacking ponyboy, slacking!

Astrobytes: owent3877: Back to the subject in hand

struct: Should I write meta for amazons

struct: to test?

MSmits: struct i doubt there is a point

Default avatar.png owent3877: my name is owen!

MSmits: meta mcts only works if you can get some depth in the search

Astrobytes: Player test struct

struct: I need a heater

Astrobytes: owent3877: We have established this Owen.

struct: should be enough

MSmits: best thing you can do if you have the time is try to find from literature what are good moves and try to write a good bot

Default avatar.png owent3877: im in greenland

MSmits: or wait for tric trac to do it]

struct: I guess I need to find a good paper

struct: there are thousands on it

Default avatar.png owent3877: it is cold

MSmits: nice

Astrobytes: The reason I suggested Amazons for CG in the first place is because it's a highly studied game

MSmits: it's also interesting because the usual approaches to board games won't work here

TBali: Owen here are some of teh easy puzzles with the highest success rate:

MSmits: like D&B, it's also the case there that you cant just slap a typical minimax on there

Astrobytes: Exactly MSmits. Well, certain combinations of them for sure

Astrobytes: Yes. Additional complexity.

MSmits: owent3877, use TBali's list

MSmits: (pinged him)

Astrobytes: reCurse: did you see tric tracs Fireworks contribution? (basically Hanabi)

Default avatar.png owent3877: what?

MSmits: click on TBali's link

MSmits: do those puzzles

MSmits: they are probably some of the easiest available

Default avatar.png owent3877: thay dint work


TBali: need to copy in browser

struct: you need to copy the link and paste in the browser


TBali: or 1by1 here



Astrobytes: These are the easiest outside of the official CG ones?


TBali: not sure but over 90% success rate

Default avatar.png owent3877: im doing There is no Spoon

TBali: (I hope he is not a troll, working so much for help... :-) )

Default avatar.png owent3877: im not a trool

Default avatar.png owent3877: im mean troll

TBali: Spoon is a good choice!

TBali: Episode 1 I mean

Default avatar.png owent3877: im doing 1

Astrobytes: owent3877: Did you finish ascii art?

Default avatar.png owent3877: no

TBali: What language do you use?

Default avatar.png zhoubou: He's doing puzzles in bash

Astrobytes: Well... why move on?

Default avatar.png owent3877: cuz i can

TBali: That's the spirit!

Default avatar.png owent3877: crap

Default avatar.png owent3877: im a falure

TBali: actually CG is good for practice what you already KNOW, but not the best to learn a language from scratch

TBali: You can find tutorial of your choice for your language (whixh you did not specify, crap is not a language) and come back to CG a bit later

MSmits: I'm not convinced of that TBali

TBali: If you are 10 and did 3 puzzles in a real programming language, you already do great. I was 11 when I had my first code written

MSmits: there's rockstar, brainfk, shakespeare, emoji, why not crap

Default avatar.png owent3877: There is no Spoon is hard

Astrobytes: Based on the time you have spent on these puzzles, you'd find tictactoe hard to play on paper.

Default avatar.png owent3877: what/

jacek: uttt?

TBali: Msmith, I don't dare to think about the reserved words in craplang

Astrobytes: TBali: type MSm and press tab

TBali: MSmits

TBali: sorry

Astrobytes: :D

TBali: my mistype ratio is 20%

MSmits: there's so many words for crap

Default avatar.png owent3877: good by

TBali: and no correct in webchat

MSmits: it would be a great language

MSmits: bye owent3877

TBali: bye, and don't give up coding

Astrobytes: Welp. We tried the educational approach, we tried the anti-troll approach, we tried reasoning, we tried directing to puzzles, we failed.

Default avatar.png owent3877: im going to code combat

TBali: and not being able to correct myself after hitting enter is like unix mail

Astrobytes: owent3877: that's probably a better idea, codingame is not good to learn your first language.

Default avatar.png owent3877: i havve lerned pithon

TBali: eulers #1 spot is spared

TBali: python is a good start

Default avatar.png owent3877: i know

Default avatar.png owent3877: brb

Default avatar.png owent3877: what about screeps

Default avatar.png owent3877: want the link?

TBali: google helps me

TBali: never tried this one

BlaiseEbuth: Pay to win...

Astrobytes: We don't want the link for screeps thank you.

Default avatar.png owent3877: ok

Astrobytes: You already play screeps then owent3877?

Default avatar.png owent3877: no

Astrobytes: Right.

Default avatar.png owent3877: i just found it

Default avatar.png duckymirror: In case you need anybody to discuss, I play Screeps.

Default avatar.png owent3877: cool!

Astrobytes: Got put off by the JS thing, you can compile other langs now these days right?

MSmits: go here #OfficialScreepsChannel

TBali: With so much altruism in me I won't finish this C++ video tut today...

Astrobytes: Statement of the year TBali

TBali: Chat should be banned if one has other stuff to do

Default avatar.png owent3877: i dont

MSmits: best is to go to the #OtherStuff channel and not say anything there

TBali: only 75 mins to go.. tommorrow

TBali: I create a LonelyTrollClub

MSmits: that's cool

MSmits: Is jacek moderating it?

TBali: yes, kicks and bans me all the time

MSmits: he does that

TBali: I tried also /dev/nulll

Astrobytes: TBali: "Chat should be banned if one has other stuff to do " - no, it's a question of focus.

Default avatar.png owent3877: what about tis-100?

Astrobytes: Yeah. Do that.

TBali: not juts focus, it is question of multitask. I am too old for that

Astrobytes: How old are you again TBali?

TBali: 10

Astrobytes: :expressionless_face:

Astrobytes: :expressionless:

TBali: My mum told me not to reveal my age online. There are bad men

Default avatar.png owent3877: same

Default avatar.png owent3877: im 10

TBali: with innocent cat avatar

TBali: Me too. And I started coding at 11

TBali: C64 BASIC

Astrobytes: TBali: OK you won the trolling

BlaiseEbuth: Yeah beware of the skirt-wearing men with cute cat avatars...

TBali: I am slightly younger than C

MSmits: So, D

Astrobytes: B

Astrobytes: no wait

Astrobytes: ffs

Astrobytes: It's late

Astrobytes: D indeed

MSmits: lol

MSmits: would it help if i said i also wanted to type B a split second before i said D

Astrobytes: lexical vs chronological meh

Astrobytes: BlaiseEbuth: :rofl:

TBali: almost same old as Intel 8080

TBali: but I age better :-)

TBali: or that is how I think

Astrobytes: Not wrong I suppose

Default avatar.png owent3877: im doing

TBali: But my memory can be adressed in 3-4 bits

TBali: and my max clock rate is 1 instructions per minute

Astrobytes: Heh

Default avatar.png owent3877: huh?

TBali: hah!

TBali: (lucky there is no moderator here to kick me)

TBali: ops, there is

**BlaiseEbuth slaps TBali around a bit with a large kick.

**Astrobytes slaps BlaiseEbuth around a bit with a large HAGGIS and eats a nice buttery piece of kouign-amann

BlaiseEbuth: Can I have some ? :yum:

Astrobytes: (I confess to the lies. I have none. It's been a month or 2 since I made any :( )

BlaiseEbuth: :(

TBali: Blaise how did you do that. Immediately after the kick I lost my wifi connection

BlaiseEbuth: :imp:

TBali: Conspiracy theory is proven - next year math Wolf prize winner

TBali: :imp:

BlaiseEbuth: Meh... I gonna dream about eating kouign-amann... See ya

TBali: At least I learned something new today (kouign-amann) despite the stopped video

TBali: looks yummy

Default avatar.png owent3877: by

TBali: How is this webchat "chuck norris roundhouse kick" works? you can write anything after a prefix?

TBali: * kick

TBali: soes not work for me mere mortal

MYBK: Hello everybody, does anyone, knows how to approach Shadows of the Knight - Episode 2 ? I don't think binary search is enough to solve it... thanks

TBali: binary search independently by axis was almost enough for me but not completely for some tests.

TBali: I had some trouble and tweaking and finally got it, but don't remember exactly how

MYBK: Emm I see, thank you for your response I will try I little bit more than. :D

TBali: The problem is when you change from x to y, you loose extra turn

TBali: that was needed to be saved

Astrobytes: TBali: type /me followed by some words

MYBK: thanks TBali for your help :)

**TBali too

**TBali slaps power around a bit with a large fishbot

**TBali slaps self around a bit with a large fishbot

TBali: soo much fun

**TBali is feeling young again

TBali: I thought it was a moderator thing

**TBali stops messing around with webchat commands

**Astrobytes kicks TBali gently

Default avatar.png **rekaxem ?