eulerscheZahl: hi WINWINWIN, haven't seen you in a while
nothing new about the contest
InfinityIQ: hi everyone
AsianCutie: hi everything
IfIHadATail: o/
WINWINWIN: Yeah, JEE preparation, so only log in occasionally during online school :P
FoXbOw: https://www.codingame.com/clashofcode/clash/join/1334060d36d25ee5237797ec80ce177d06d0d72?utm_source=Slack&utm_medium=SlackBotLink&utm_campaign=BiKay+Academy
FoXbOw: https://www.codingame.com/clashofcode/clash/join/133407642e85e4bd6dfdd1de95b5d9a0b6d165c?utm_source=Slack&utm_medium=SlackBotLink&utm_campaign=BiKay%20Academy
jacek: ...
alirezadigi2:
alirezadigi2:
alirezadigi2: https://www.codingame.com/clashofcode/clash/13340910268429b574f01141d3cd84ae6c75fc5
alirezadigi2: :nerd:
eulerscheZahl: please stop sending clash of code invites here.
go to #clash
eulerscheZahl: (i need a macro for this one...)
LoganWick: How is this website made?
jacek: with tears and blood
FoXbOw: well noted Euler :)
FoXbOw: not aware about the channels
alirezadigi2: https://www.codingame.com/clashofcode/clash/133409762a6a6bbb33f01b80f480e0391334b8d
Uljahn: i guess desired behavior for coc link sharing should be stated straight on the coc page or it never ends, also promoting the #clash channel could be a good idea :/
jacek: could clash links be censored? with msg saying it should go to #clash
alirezadigi2: Im sorry I didnt know that!
aCat: hi euler
aCat: can you provide an extension of your list of puzzles easy to language-achievement-spamming?
eulerscheZahl: so you solved those i was suggesting?
eulerscheZahl: https://www.codingame.com/training/hard/the-hungry-duck---part-2
that has 2 parts solvable by the same code
eulerscheZahl: same here: https://www.codingame.com/training/hard/x-egg-problem
eulerscheZahl: not directly easy to solve. but once you solved it, the code is easy enough to convert
aCat: I had eggo problem solved in python2 so my code is locked ;p
aCat: I spammed onboarding, rubik and A*craft :D
aCat: and noted simple official easy CG puzzles as marslandr :D
eulerscheZahl: while True: print("0 3\n0 4")
aCat: yeah, I gave you upvote ;p
eulerscheZahl: :D
aCat: damn hungry duck I also have locked
eulerscheZahl: why did you use a deprecated language? :P
eulerscheZahl: https://www.codingame.com/ide/puzzle/rugby-score
aCat: cause it was not deprecated when I was doing them ;p
eulerscheZahl: same game: i fail to find the list of best known scores you mentioned
aCat: http://www.js-games.de/eng/highscores/samegame/lx
aCat: https://arxiv.org/pdf/2003.10024.pdf - this is probably one of the latest updates, but some more will appear at MCS 2020
eulerscheZahl: wow. i'm at 48.8k on submit
eulerscheZahl: and that's with doubled testcases
Illedan: Mornin
aCat: hello
Illedan: I wonder how they decided on that 200 char limit for the Quest map, on Don't panic -.-
eulerscheZahl: they took you-1
eulerscheZahl: spoiler:exactly 200 is enough already
eulerscheZahl: spoiler 2: you shouldn't use C# on this one
eulerscheZahl: great, Thibaud is back
Illedan: Yeah, I figured :P
Illedan: But was wondering if it was possible without invoking a different language
eulerscheZahl: in C#?
Illedan: yeah
eulerscheZahl: dbdr mentioned not doing any cheap tricks of that kind
eulerscheZahl: has 176 in C#
Illedan: hmm
eulerscheZahl: me: 188 in python
eulerscheZahl: (╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻
dbdr: :)
Illedan: xD
dbdr: you can do <200 in Java too
Illedan: ...
Illedan: oooh
Illedan: I can use local functions in C# now
Illedan: :tada:
eulerscheZahl: i wait until i don't have to declare a Main function anymore
Illedan: ^^^
eulerscheZahl: saw that as a draft, not sure if it will happen
Illedan: CG should create their own wrapper
dbdr: if the source file is "¤DP", the program will solve codingame.com's Don't Panic puzzle
Illedan: Let me use NuGet in my CG projects and I'll push packages solving everything :evil:
dbdr: too much overhead to import it
Illedan: true
Illedan: At 390 chars.. Going down slooowly -.-
dbdr: <200 is possible in C# and Java, but it's not especially easy
dbdr: if that's your goal, a scripting language is probably a better idea
eulerscheZahl: will it pass any testcase or just the ones provided?
eulerscheZahl: my python assumes max 9 rows, other than that it should be always working
dbdr: need to check :)
dbdr: not any testcase
dbdr: does your python work for the upper limit of every constraint under 100ms? ;)
eulerscheZahl: i don't even remember what the constraints are
dbdr: 1 ≤ nbFloors ≤ 15 5 ≤ width ≤ 100 10 ≤ nbRounds ≤ 200 0 ≤ exitFloor, elevatorFloor < nbFloors 0 ≤ exitPos , elevatorPos < width -1 ≤ cloneFloor < nbFloors -1 ≤ clonePos < width 2 ≤ nbTotalClones ≤ 50 0 ≤ nbElevators ≤ 100 Duration of one game turn: 100 ms
eulerscheZahl: but i did nothing fishy i wouldn't do in a non-golf puzzle
dbdr: no need to be fishy if it's too slow
eulerscheZahl: should be fine
eulerscheZahl: that's part 1, while part 2 is the hard one CPU-wise
eulerscheZahl: building new elevators
dbdr: well, there could be cases that can be solvable with an optimal solution, not a greedy one
dbdr: that should be intensive
dbdr: optimal looks exponentially hard to me
eulerscheZahl: are we talking about the same problem?
dbdr: why not?
eulerscheZahl: there's only 1 elevator per floor, you have to decide if you have to change direction to reach it
dbdr: ah, didn't know about this constraint
eulerscheZahl: a working solution will always be optimal as it's unique
dbdr: wat?
eulerscheZahl: there is only 1 solution
dbdr: if you move a blocker by one, it can still be solution
dbdr: so it's not unique
eulerscheZahl: d'oh
eulerscheZahl: forget the last thing i wrote
eulerscheZahl: but still it's easy to find a shortest solution
dbdr: it's possible a greedy solution can be unique with that constraint, yes
eulerscheZahl: shortest path, not code
dbdr: yes, minimal number of blockers, if you need to change directions
eulerscheZahl: so: let's turn it into a harder community puzzle :P
eulerscheZahl: Do panic
dbdr: :D
dbdr: is there a version with multiple elevators per floor already?
dbdr: I think a "PANIC" action would be cool
dbdr: could replace BLOCK. when you panic, other clones turns away
dbdr: just need a crazy animation
dbdr: can we include a towel too?
eulerscheZahl: https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/southpark/images/0/07/Towelie-0.png/revision/latest?cb=20170604100720
eulerscheZahl: should have linked the article for those who don't know Southpark that well
https://southpark.fandom.com/wiki/Towelie_(Character)
eulerscheZahl: at don't panic too I think you have to build elevators on floor despite there already being one (shorten the path)
dbdr: *don't panic either /s
Marchete: struct closed his account?
Marchete: yavalath is anonymous
jacek: yavalath is older
jrke: but in othello its showing by struct
jacek: yinsh still has struct as contributor
eulerscheZahl: but where is struct himself?
eulerscheZahl: missing for almost a month now
jacek: so now he is destruct
jrke: nope i think he is class
jrke: what was the general rank of struct
jrke: ?
Phenomz: which boss u guys at?
jrke: boss??
Phenomz: oh nvm i thought it was the chat for what we're currently doing
Phenomz: XD
ditsche: if i join a clash i get alot of captchas, is there something i can do to get rid of them?
SPDene: stop doing clashes for a while
jrke: nope captchas are to prevent bot clashers so basically its for your goodness
jacek: write bot to solve captchas :v
jrke: Or do this ^ Oo
eulerscheZahl: pay someone to solve captchas for you
jacek: or invite mod to the clash
Astrobytes: Or ban jacek
jrke: or don't play clashes for few hours
ditsche: ^ that's exactly what a bot would do
jrke: yep
SydM107: oh boy, I feel dumb I forgot that in C x^2 is x xor 2 not x*x
MSmits: hey, I have an interesting mcts issue
MSmits: say you're using transpositions in mcts (which can be messy)
MSmits: there is no particular reason not to use a node, that was meant to be used by player 1, by player 2 is there? If he is in the same state p1 was?
MSmits: since the nodes gather statistics that tell you if that state is good or bad, it's true whether p1 is in that state or p2 is. The state being the full state of course, just mirrored
MSmits: it's similar to using the same node in a symmetric state, only now it's symmetric between players
MSmits: let me know if this sounds wrong to you :P
jacek: so you want extend board inversion value to the transposition table
MSmits: well it seems natural. If I am storing p1 and p2 the same way anyway, they can also share nodes
MSmits: it will be pretty rare that they are in the same state of course
MSmits: but it saves me from having to store who's turn it is
MSmits: i just store the player who's turn it is as the first board
jacek: theoretically sounds good but it will occur rarely during actual game. but if its gonna help your particular implementation, why not.
MSmits: hmm ok, cool. Transpositions seem good in breakthrough because the overhead from storing the states is small
jacek: there are many transposition in breakthrough
MSmits: I store when i expand and because 1 expansion adds so many children you dont do it as often as say, in oware
MSmits: that too
MSmits: my only problem is memory. At some point I run out of node pool and reset my node pool. By that time the transpositions become invalid because I may be overwriting series of children that the transposition map points to
jacek: but im also thinking move grouping. many moves have practically the same score
jacek: and thats not traposition
MSmits: you mean doing this on expansion?
MSmits: that's possible
MSmits: it's basically pruning
jacek: nah just thinking out loud
MSmits: if 5 moves are equally good, only pick 1 as a possibility
MSmits: I do this in some games. For example CSB
MSmits: CSB has equivalent series of moves
jacek: right
MSmits: (turn left, then turn right is the same as not turning)
jacek: the same goes for capture sequence on the same square
jacek: with multiple captures
MSmits: yeah
MSmits: ohh crap, I forgot something
MSmits: if i do this transposition player thing, I do have to switch the stored gamestate on the nodes as well, not just the keys in the transposition map :P
MSmits: otherwise when reusing the node by the other player, it's gonna have all boardstates for its children reversed
MSmits: more complicated than I thought
AndreiHarsia: :grinning:
jacek: good thing im so slow, no need for memory pool tricks
MSmits: yeah it's annoying sometimes
jacek: yes, its annoying being the best all the time
jacek: oh, train accident in scotland
MSmits: cant find anything about that?
Astrobytes: Yeah, up Stonehaven way
Astrobytes: (near Aberdeen)
eulerscheZahl: new optim approved: same game
MSmits: what optim?
Astrobytes: Same Game
jacek: the same?
MSmits: ow lol
MSmits: eulerscheZahl did that on purpose
eulerscheZahl: but in this version of the game you have to play as bad as you can it seems
jacek: so youre perfect
MSmits: is this why you are at nr 1 euler?
MSmits: :P
eulerscheZahl: was 2nd https://prnt.sc/tyd2v1
eulerscheZahl: but now i'm at #1 in this game
MSmits: confusing
jacek: less is better?
jacek: is it time?
eulerscheZahl: i already informed aCat on discord that it's the wrong order
jacek: who approved this
MSmits: Approved by radekmie Zylo hoggi
jacek: poland stronk
eulerscheZahl: not me. I wanted more testcases. not twice the same
jacek: but its same game
eulerscheZahl: not same testcase
Memo12334: anyone knows if there is a walkthrough for detective pikaptcha ep2?
MSmits: mmh it's not really an adventure game, I don't think we have any walkthroughs :P
Memo12334: would be my last easy challenge before I do other stuff on CG but I can't solve it
MSmits: what are you stuck on?
Memo12334: I just don't know what to do with the directions and which wall to follow
MSmits: ill see what i did for ep 2
Memo12334: I don't understand the probelm completely at all
MSmits: pikaptcha walks along a wall and you have to count how many times he steps on a cell
MSmits: sometimes he follows right wall, sometimes left
MSmits: depends on the input
RoboStac: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maze_solving_algorithm#Wall_follower
RoboStac: but stop when you get back to the start again instead of an exit
eulerscheZahl: https://www.codingame.com/share-replay/481439920
maybe a replay helps to explain the idea
Memo12334: I only get one wall input for every test case right
eulerscheZahl: you get the full map
MSmits: Memo12334 it's not a turnbased thingy. You get the full map and have to predict the full future
MSmits: so you dont get new input that tells you pikaptchas new surroundings on anything. You have to simulate that all on your own
Memo12334: ty , im going to read the wikipedia page from RoboStac and try to solve it
MSmits: I would not say this is an easy puzzle btw, it's more like medium
MSmits: it's easy if you're used to making simulations in games, which you do in bot games all the time, but if you've just been doing easy puzzles, it's not
MSmits: good practice though
Memo12334: yes I like these kind of puzzles where I have to resereach algorithms that I can use.
Memo12334: 0 exp tho
Astrobytes: lol, what an awesome bug that is (the same game one)
MSmits: I thought you get some xp for the community puzzles?
Memo12334: oh not that exp
Astrobytes: There's XP and CP
eulerscheZahl: he has no personal experience on that field, regardless of what CG gives credits for
Memo12334: exactly
MSmits: ahh
Astrobytes: Oh I see
Astrobytes: We're so CG-ified
Astrobytes: sorry
eulerscheZahl: Astrobytes that score looks like always finding the largest group on Same Game, isn't it?
MSmits: beamsearch seems great here
eulerscheZahl: I might go with Chokudai
MSmits: dont remember what that was exactly
Astrobytes: Hm, possible
eulerscheZahl: similar to beam. but extending the size instead of depth
eulerscheZahl: size = width
MSmits: like best first search?
Astrobytes: I was thinking to try Cegimax with Prune Array, personally
eulerscheZahl: yeah MSmits
eulerscheZahl: where's ceg himself?
Astrobytes: NRPA seems pretty good too, was reading some paper the other day
eulerscheZahl: acat linked that paper
Astrobytes: He was around the other day, back from whatever was keeping him busy
Astrobytes: Yeah that one
MSmits: https://www.nrpa.org/
Astrobytes: There're some others too
eulerscheZahl: https://arxiv.org/pdf/2003.10024.pdf
eulerscheZahl: that's a troll link MSmits
MSmits: ah so thats just mcts
MSmits: I know :P
MSmits: the link is meant to say: huh ?
MSmits: I guess mcts works fine here
jacek: and your favourite variant: meta (nested) mcts
MSmits: do you mean people will run this offline?
MSmits: validators will be public/
MSmits: ?
jacek: i meant online meta mcts
jacek: at some puzzle games its better than pure mcts
jacek: even in real time
MSmits: oh
MSmits: interesting
jacek: https://www.lamsade.dauphine.fr/~cazenave/papers/nested.pdf
MSmits: hmm this seems similar to just running multiple random rollouts during selection and expansion
darkhorse64: Last at SameGame with the best score ? Is that the misère version ?
eulerscheZahl: yes MSmits: validators are public.
and it's 20 testcases, each appearing twice
eulerscheZahl: i have a 48.806 score for the protocol
eulerscheZahl: and I DMed aCat
darkhorse64: OK. Scores are wrong then ?
eulerscheZahl: it's just the config.ini where you have to replace an ascending by descending
eulerscheZahl: https://github.com/eulerscheZahl/Bender4/blob/master/config/config.ini#L4
linking to my own game as aCat didn't link a github for his. same principle
darkhorse64: Makes sense
MSmits: eulerscheZahl do you mean that the 10 testcases that we see, appear twice as validators?
MSmits: or are the validators different? If so, where are they?
MSmits: ohh I see it
MSmits: they are the same as the human playable game linked in the description
eulerscheZahl: http://www.js-games.de/eng/games/samegame/lx/play
you can select a game here
eulerscheZahl: "presetting"
MSmits: sorry, i should have figured it out 3 seconds earlier :P
eulerscheZahl: 20 games. each appears twice as a validator
MSmits: silly
eulerscheZahl: while I tried to argue against it, someone else game the 3rd approval vote :/
MSmits: whats the reason for it?
MSmits: that it needs arguing?
eulerscheZahl: these 20 testcases are "common tests"
eulerscheZahl: so you can find scores for them on papers
MSmits: right
eulerscheZahl: i wanted 20 random tests in addition. but that would make it harder to compare scores with papers
eulerscheZahl: at least for the global leaderboard
MSmits: true
MSmits: so the random tests are in there, but they are the same as the original
eulerscheZahl: one could still make each individual testcase publicly playable in the IDE in addition to submit validator
MSmits: right
eulerscheZahl: there are no random tests
MSmits: but why do they appear twice then?
eulerscheZahl: just the common testsets again with different colors (swap green with red or whatever)
MSmits: whats the point of that?
eulerscheZahl: that's what I was arguing about
eulerscheZahl: my point: you still only have to hardcode 20 testcases if you play offline. and same score for deterministic solver
MSmits: I can define my bot to define colors as when they first appear
eulerscheZahl: aCat: but different for random solver when running online
MSmits: which means its immune to any change in color setting
eulerscheZahl: and then deus ex machina: 3rd approval vote
MSmits: right
Astrobytes: If only there was some kind of "Pause Contribution" feature, pending further discussion
MSmits: it would not be different with random solver
Astrobytes: Without having to revert back to WIP etc
MSmits: if you define colors the way i just explained
MSmits: if the first color that appears is always red, even if the game defines it as blue, then colors will be the same
MSmits: or wait, do the points also differ?
MSmits: by color i mean?
eulerscheZahl: random search count yield different results when getting a different seed or about of simulations
MSmits: oh right, the time thingy
eulerscheZahl: it's exactly the same testcase again if you substitute the colors
MSmits: right, seems silly
eulerscheZahl: my point!
eulerscheZahl: i was more diplomatic
MSmits: silly is pretty diplomatic here I think
eulerscheZahl: :D
MSmits: well it looks like I have an excuse to write another meta mcts
eulerscheZahl: oh no!
jacek: meta metamcts?
MSmits: currently running oware and breakthrough, but noone seems to be resubmitting breakthrough
MSmits: so i can switch it out
MSmits: wait
MSmits: i mean othello
MSmits: not breakthrough lol
MSmits: dont have that (yet)
jacek: there are 2 common breakthrough openings
eulerscheZahl: how much CPU time do you spend on these games on average?
MSmits: i saw it yeah
MSmits: eulerscheZahl hmm 2 cores, 12 hrs a day or so
jacek: yet my bot prefers the mix of the two o.O
MSmits: havent paid too much attention to it, i saw its usually taking a pawn from the edge?
jacek: yes, and make row hole in the middle
wlesavo: it would actually even be an ok multi
MSmits: hmm ok
MSmits: wlesavo you mean taking turns picking a cell?
wlesavo: yeah
MSmits: interesting
wlesavo: with mirrored games
eulerscheZahl: mirrored, yeah...
MSmits: or just randomized maps
eulerscheZahl: well, might even be doable. i think i saw something like that in the SDK
MSmits: like bandas
eulerscheZahl: and it should be possible to replace parts of it to allow swapping
wlesavo: well yeah, maybe mirror is not a requirement
MSmits: you can also do some tests and figure out p1 advantage and just give p2 a bonus
MSmits: or do pie rule, even better
MSmits: well my TT version of breakthrough is worse :(
MSmits: no crashing, works fine, but just ranks lower, no idea why
MSmits: only game where i was able to make it work to use TT in mcts is yavalath so far, even then it was questionable whether it was actually better
wlesavo: map generation should be reliable for multi though, pure random would be bad in general, because of the maps with only a few moves, which would be decided in a few turns
MSmits: true, not sure how likely that would be with this game
MSmits: you might also just use 1 basic map
MSmits: if it's a good one
MSmits: like boardgames do
MSmits: but then you risk people writing opening books of course
wlesavo: you can fill some parts of the map by tetris-like shapes and the other parts by random or smth like that
MSmits: yeah
MSmits: bandas was improved also, when it was pure random it would give bad maps sometimes
MSmits: and maps are still pretty bad sometimes
field3: breakthrough algorithm to remember.
If there are three pieces facing each other, raise the middle.:relaxed:
darkhorse64: Same for chess. It's been a known combination for one century
darkhorse64: Re samegame. I think known validators really spoil the fun (making it with severe time and space constraints)
MSmits: hmm not sure, it's possible that a better algorithm might be a million times more important than more computation time
MSmits: these guys describe something like that:
MSmits: https://www.lamsade.dauphine.fr/~cazenave/papers/nested.pdf
MSmits: http://chat.codingame.com/pastebin/c675a4e7-750d-4437-a666-afd898445747
Hjax: isnt thinking twice as long only worth like, 10 elo to stockfish?
MSmits: i think it depends a lot on the domain,
MSmits: we saw this in numbershifting also.
MSmits: many different possible algorithms and they all got stuck at some level, the levels varied dramatically
darkhorse64: New challenge: beat other algos within 30s running time
MSmits: kinda hard to enforce
MSmits: the annoying thing with trying to keep validators secret is that you always risk them being reverse engineered
MSmits: for the validators I can do: If cell x == green on first turn, break and check which validator fails
MSmits: just submit a few 100 times
MSmits: and i got them
Hjax: i considered doing that for one of the code golf games
Hjax: but then decided it wasnt worth the effort
MSmits: sure, but they should have enough testcases that even if they are known, you'd need too many characters to hardcode them
MSmits: if that's not the case, then it's a bad code golf
MSmits: you cant do that for optimization games
MSmits: no matter what you do, there's ways to reverse the opening gamestate
MSmits: even continuous games. You can do things like if "first digit of x position of first creature == 5"
MSmits: but could be a lot of work yeah
jacek: you just want to book a solo game
cheeze2000: :flag_pt:
cheeze2000: :flag_pt::flag_pt::flag_pt:
MSmits: maybe :)
AllYourPellets: is rust code compiled with --release flag?
AllYourPellets: i'm seeing different performance numbers in ide vs submitted code
jacek: its debug in ide
jacek: thats why i cant test against dbdr in breakthrough :f
AllYourPellets: its weird because i lose a game on the leaderboard, copy it to the ide and then win it... im seeing better performance in ide
jacek: huh? it should be release in leaderboard and debug in ide
AllYourPellets: oh wait there was an extra number
AllYourPellets: nvm
Hjax: yeah rust in ide is painful
Hjax: i hope they fix it, makes testing a huge pain
Hjax: no one can test against me, but i cant test against anyone
AllYourPellets: hmm anyone have any ideas how i lose in release mode because of timeout but then win in ide test?
Hjax: infinite loop if you run too long maybe?
Hjax: or some weird slowdown from running too long
jacek: is it really timeout or crash
Hjax: ^ good point
AllYourPellets: it says time limit exceeded
AllYourPellets: theres no crash info in the output
AllYourPellets: how can i tell?
jacek: then maybe it is really timeout
jacek: most games say timeout in any ocassion
Hjax: if you can, try to replicate the game locally
Hjax: and see what happens
Hjax: ill upload a dummy bot that prints its IO to stderr
Hjax: and then copy paste to my local bot
Hjax: and step through with a debugger
AllYourPellets: good idea
AllYourPellets: hmm is there a way to tell how much memory you are using?
AllYourPellets: maybe im hitting the memory limit
jacek: its 768MB
AllYourPellets: yeah on my local machine im surpassing that, that's gotta be it
cheeze2000: :flag_pt:
Hjax: seems like a reasonable explanation
Hjax: cheeze2000 nice toko profile pic
cheeze2000: ty
JaggBow: hello everyone, I hope you're well. For some reason CoC gives me 75% success rate after htting send when I have already check all testcases and they're all correct, someone had this issue before?
jacek: there are more testcases after submit
jacek: so you cant hardcode the solution
Hjax: yeah the test cases in the IDE and the validators when you submit are different
JaggBow: Ah okay didn't know that, thanks !
Astrobytes: Hey, how come my Same Game score didn't update? It's stuck at 8860, when I got 10018
eulerscheZahl: uno reverse card
eulerscheZahl: you have to get a lower score, check the order on the leaderboard
Astrobytes: Oh right, right. I misunderstood the earlier bug
**eulerscheZahl didn't approve it :P
Astrobytes: :grin:
eulerscheZahl: :popcorn:
Astrobytes: I'm blaming Radek, just because.
wlesavo: am i stupid or SG grid is a little messed up
Astrobytes: 0,0 is in bottom left
eulerscheZahl: is that a puzzle or a real world question?
wlesavo: we get a rows in a reverse order?
eulerscheZahl: i also complained about the placement of the origin, see contributions comments :P
wlesavo: i mean this origin would be ok if we would get the grid starting from origin
MSmits: the bottom row is 0 because that is where the horizontal contraction happens
MSmits: I guess it made more sense to acat that a special row is 0
jacek: so catty of him
MSmits: I'm ok with that part, but the duplicated validators are silly
eulerscheZahl: small detail. I did it wrong when parsing the input at first. but fixed now to never look back
735487: eulerscheZahl: uno reverse card, is there uno game on CG? played this game few times with my child when bought it to him
eulerscheZahl: no uno here :D
eulerscheZahl: there was another card game pending for a while
735487: do you know the rules good?
eulerscheZahl: guinote or however it's spelled
eulerscheZahl: i played uno as a kid too
eulerscheZahl: with an extra rule made up by my parents as i later discovered
Astrobytes: Maybe aCat will do it as part of his series
eulerscheZahl: there was this advertising card just having the uno logo on both sides
wlesavo: damn, im trying to get closer to euler but it seems that you have to really dedicate to geting a lower score to achieve that
735487: it is not clear for me how the black cards may be break. only with reverse cards or with black cards too
eulerscheZahl: my parents just included it into the game. you could play it followed by 2 cards of the same color
wlesavo: best results from random choices
eulerscheZahl: i do depth 2 bruteforce
MSmits: lol
wlesavo: oh i see, you do search for lower
wlesavo: lol
eulerscheZahl: lol to depth 2 or the uno card?
MSmits: that people are trying to beat you at a lower score because the leaderboard is bugged :P
dbdr: gamification at its best
eulerscheZahl: my highest is 48806
735487: i bought uno almost without rules at all. so i tried to find the rules but some points still not clear for me. so we played our rules ))
MSmits: wait it stores the lowest?
MSmits: i thought it just ordered the board wrong
Astrobytes: No, I just found that out too MSmits
eulerscheZahl: that's connected to each other
735487: keep best results i think
eulerscheZahl: related is a better word i think
Astrobytes: I misunderstood earlier
MSmits: related yeah
eulerscheZahl: some cat wrote the config.ini file wrong
eulerscheZahl: it always get confused as well. so i look at an existing optim and check that config file + leaderboard sorting
wlesavo: some cat in some game wrote something in some config file wrong
eulerscheZahl: then: "i want the same" or "do the opposite"
735487: oh sorry guys. completely dont undestand what is going on here :) will do some work. see you
MSmits: good luck with SomeWork !
wlesavo: lol
Astrobytes: amurushkin: new optimisation game, "Same Game"
735487: thanks
Astrobytes: It has a bug currently
Astrobytes: It takes lowest score as best :)
eulerscheZahl: a feature
Astrobytes: hehehe
wlesavo: yeah, gl beating eulers score
735487: sound easy to be fixed
Astrobytes: Yeah, I guess aCat will fix as soon as he can
eulerscheZahl: change 1 line in the config and reupload
MSmits: i am guessing this game was in WIP too short to test the leaderboard properly?>
eulerscheZahl: there is no way to test the leaderboard during WIP
Astrobytes: ^
MSmits: mmh i thought contributions had leaderboards?
MSmits: wait i mean in the approval stage i guess
MSmits: wip is before approval right?
Astrobytes: haha beat that wlesavo!
MSmits: Astrobytes are you doing any floodfill?
dbdr: looks like multis have leaderboards but not optims
MSmits: never done a floodfill in C++ yet that wasn't a bitboard
Astrobytes: Yeah MSmits
Astrobytes: Bitboard it then :P
wlesavo: damn, you beat my random choice Astrobytes, are you up to smth?
Astrobytes: :D
MSmits: mmh so visited cells are a bitboard and use integers for cell indices as a queue?
MSmits: I can steal code from my playground
dbdr: but that's stealing!
MSmits: yeah :(
Astrobytes: Ah I forgot about that playground
dbdr: (IT crowd reference)
MSmits: it's in C#, but it doesnt do anything thats not easily done in C++
MSmits: probably the shifting of the board after a move is a bit complicated
MSmits: who reused their smash the code bot just now?
eulerscheZahl: not yet. but the dropping logic is slightly more optimized for STC than for same game so far
eulerscheZahl: more so when it comes to chain reactions that we don't have here
MSmits: do you use any tricky stuff to make the dropping fast for STC?
eulerscheZahl: not really tricky
eulerscheZahl: more like stupid for same game (SG from now on)
MSmits: ah ok
eulerscheZahl: dropping by 1 cell each time
eulerscheZahl: in a loop
MSmits: hey, if there is another game with SG as initials, will you call this one SG-1?
Astrobytes: lol
Astrobytes: What if the other is called Stargate tho
MSmits: that'd be funny
MSmits: gonna start be defining my own colors so that it does the same moves on thos e colorflipped validators :P
MSmits: by
MSmits: int colorMap[5];
eulerscheZahl: cells[0][0] has value 0
next different is substituted to 1 and so on
MSmits: exactly
MSmits: it's really easy to do
eulerscheZahl: soon: all top scores are even numbers
MSmits: yeah!
eulerscheZahl: darkhorse the only odd guy atm
MSmits: which is odd, because I don't think of him as odd at all
aCat: eulerscheZahl thanks for the info
aCat: what it should look like
aCat: sorting_order=desc
aCat: ?
eulerscheZahl: you are about to break the leaderboard :scream:
eulerscheZahl: yes
aCat: yeah, didn't think of this ;(
aCat: silly cat
Astrobytes: great bug tho :D
eulerscheZahl: if you delete the config file, the SDK will even prompt you to define the sorting order
eulerscheZahl: or was it removing that one line? i forgot
dbdr: CGP Grey using a wrong quote in a video explaining how he was wrong about something else :D
LegendsOfCodeAndMagic: ;]
LegendsOfCodeAndMagic: auch, other window ^^'
Astrobytes: ban!
MSmits: ;]
MSmits: wait is this acat?
Astrobytes: Yeah
eulerscheZahl: alt accounts are forbidden
MSmits: oww
LegendsOfCodeAndMagic: This is technical account ;]
eulerscheZahl: then you shall not chat!
AntiSquid: euler is my alt
eulerscheZahl: i'm tempted to kick
MSmits: my color map works
MSmits: http://chat.codingame.com/pastebin/196ecf85-9661-482e-af55-9ed3bf55d45d
AntiSquid: someone delete my alt please
eulerscheZahl: ezpz
LegendsOfCodeAndMagic: I already submitted testcode to SameGame
LegendsOfCodeAndMagic: so you can kick :P
Astrobytes: :D
aCat: au
aCat: that hurts
aCat: bad frog
aCat: ^^'
eulerscheZahl: F5 and you are back
ban = only back after chat server restart
eulerscheZahl: i miss an option between
eulerscheZahl: ban for 30min or so
AntiSquid: if chat gets restart all bans are undone?
aCat: yeah seems reasonable to have some time-based silence spell
eulerscheZahl: yes, bans aren't stored permanently
AntiSquid: i don't understand percentage in SameGame
Astrobytes: Mod spells would be awesome. Temporarily remove CP/XP, invisibility etc
AntiSquid: why am i at 0% ?
AntiSquid: aCat explain
eulerscheZahl: invalid or no move
AntiSquid: but someone is at 35%
eulerscheZahl: you have to remove all groups of size 2+
AntiSquid: also i have more points so i clearly pass some cases?
aCat: yeah, rules changed as it was stupid to allow everything as you can increase your timer in such case
eulerscheZahl: you hit some groups and then fail to print a valid action
eulerscheZahl: we will solve it offline and hardcode anyways
eulerscheZahl: always the same problem for optim games
aCat: flat mc gives 38 k
MSmits: i dont mind really, I've yet to run up against someone that rented thousands of dollars worth of amazon/google hardware
eulerscheZahl: back to top :)
AntiSquid: top of what?
eulerscheZahl: SG
Astrobytes: the SG lb
AntiSquid: ah it updates slowly
MSmits: who was it that was top at numbershifting on an old laptop ?
eulerscheZahl: westicles
MSmits: right
MSmits: thats fine with me
AntiSquid: dbdr can't beat D high performance i see
eulerscheZahl: he's first again
eulerscheZahl: about 150 levels above dbdr
MSmits: cool
eulerscheZahl: not sure if he ever got the submit script running
MSmits: does he do anything else on CG this well?
eulerscheZahl: played some game of drones
MSmits: ah ok
eulerscheZahl: top10 range i think
eulerscheZahl: definitely a player who can do better when trying
MSmits: yeah
MSmits: I think we have lots of those
MSmits: that just do 1 or 2 multis/optims but could be top 10 in all of them if they tried to
MSmits: you see them come out on contests
eulerscheZahl: even then not all of them try in the same contest
dbdr: MSmits: I would say it was me, not w
MSmits: were you the one with the old laptop?
MSmits: maybe you both had one
MSmits: maybe I should get one
dbdr: it's relatively old and slow yes
eulerscheZahl: i think westicles had even worse hardware
dbdr: and my algo is faster
eulerscheZahl: but not sure anymore
dbdr: possible
MSmits: dbdr you mean he just keeps it running for longer?
eulerscheZahl: let's do a fund raising. new laptop for dbdr
MSmits: to beat you?
dbdr: slow hardware is good, it encourages you to optimize more :)
jacek: man 80s and 90s code is an art
AntiSquid: you wait more for things to load up
eulerscheZahl: pixi is a pain
eulerscheZahl: even that 3D teapot was less resource intensive
dbdr: once he ran for a long time without submitting, and I caught up pretty quickly because my implementation is faster
dbdr: now he did it again, after even more time
MSmits: 3d teapot?
eulerscheZahl: https://www.codingame.com/contribute/view/52965be9af1e1e9f5b35487a3cc449f24bf2
Astrobytes: In Contributions MSmits
jacek: darkhorse512?
Astrobytes: darkhorse360
eulerscheZahl: darkhorse180
you can't even do a full rotation for 1 axis
MSmits: runs very well eulerscheZahl
Astrobytes: meh
Astrobytes: yeah, cool innit
MSmits: yeah its great
jacek: ignit
MSmits: now make 3D chess
Astrobytes: :D
eulerscheZahl: why me?
MSmits: you made the pot
eulerscheZahl: i did my job, the next is your turn
eulerscheZahl: i imported the pot
eulerscheZahl: copy-paste ftw
Astrobytes: import chess pieces then
Astrobytes: copy-paste ftw
Astrobytes: Get JBM to do textures for you
eulerscheZahl: craftpix even has some 3D stuff
MSmits: oh it's webgl
eulerscheZahl: https://craftpix.net/freebies/filter/3d-game-assets/
MSmits: you know, eulerscheZahl, you can code stuff in unity and it can compile to webgl
MSmits: so you can do this in C# :)
AntiSquid: get a 3D scanning app
eulerscheZahl: i think you can use any language if you manage to tell maven how to compile it
eulerscheZahl: the pom.xml is the entry point
MSmits: cool
MSmits: hmm, this runs on GPU right
MSmits: so some people that open your contribution will not be happy :P
eulerscheZahl: i think it can do both depending on your hardware
MSmits: oh ok
eulerscheZahl: i remember emh doing something in webGL that was a pain for my poor computer
eulerscheZahl: and inoryy calling my out for having a "potato GPU"
Astrobytes: Not that NSFW CSB thingy
eulerscheZahl: don't remind me :scream:
Astrobytes: lol, yeah. I'm still scarred.
Astrobytes: Scarred for life in fact.
MSmits: rofl
MSmits: sometimes it's good to work from home
inoryy: :grimacing:
Astrobytes: What is your "potato GPU"?
eulerscheZahl: geforce gtx 570
Astrobytes: Wow, I thought I was behind with my GTX 660
MSmits: test it here eulerscheZahl
MSmits: https://sketchfab.com/3d-models/white-potato-b883eab7d2a54c9b974d55373429c24b
Astrobytes: lol
eulerscheZahl: works fine
eulerscheZahl: wait, i feel insulted now
MSmits: potato gpu then
Astrobytes: ...
Astrobytes: If yours is a potato, what's mine?
MSmits: try this Astrobytes
MSmits: https://sketchfab.com/3d-models/tortilla-chip-ac945048744f4027b1376b13283a93f5
Astrobytes: A tortilla chip?
MSmits: yes
MSmits: it's easier to render
MSmits: cuz it's flat
Astrobytes: easier to render than what?
eulerscheZahl: like the earth?
MSmits: a potato
eulerscheZahl: :popcorn:
Astrobytes: The potato rendered fine?
MSmits: oh
MSmits: i thought you meant your computer is worse
MSmits: so i sought out a lesser challenge
Astrobytes: euler has the potato GPU, he's got a 570 I have a 660
MSmits: ahhhh
eulerscheZahl: and 660 > 570
inoryy: a fried potato
Astrobytes: That implies it's borken with the 'fried' part though
Astrobytes: Or broken
eulerscheZahl: back in 2011 it was on the higher end
inoryy: I think the pc I ended up having to throw out during the move had a 7xx card and nobody wanted it...
Astrobytes: Meh. Don't need fancy GPUs for Zachtronics games anyway
MSmits: got GTX 1060 myself, but I've had this for like 3 years
MSmits: so it's not exactly new
eulerscheZahl: in my first semester I had a really old PC. like struggling on a 10 page google document with formulas
MSmits: I used to be a gamer, CG ruined that
eulerscheZahl: 1GB RAM
threw that away
Astrobytes: I upgrade every decade
eulerscheZahl: 2.4GHz single core
MSmits: I used to upgrade gpu every 2 years, everything else 4 years
Astrobytes: actually, I upgraded 3 times last decade
inoryy: I think the pc I have now is the last "big" one, if I ever buy a new one it will be a NUC
eulerscheZahl: i upgraded my SSD. rest is still from 2011 when I bought it
MSmits: I need to get a threadripper to meta mcts 10 games at once and save money on heating
inoryy: well by "I have" I mean my wife has and sometimes lets me play on it...
Astrobytes: :D
MSmits: really inoryy? Why does your wife have the strongest machine?
MSmits: mine has a relatively good laptop, but that's about it
jacek: so she can train NN
inoryy: she's a graphical illustrator, needs a lot of RAM and a beefy-ish CPU
MSmits: makes sense
inoryy: the GPUs are a waste now but meh
Astrobytes: Yep, that would figure
MSmits: why are they a waste?
MSmits: no animations?
inoryy: yeah, neither 3D
MSmits: ah ok
MSmits: when I started coding it was all 3D physics stuff
dbdr: MSmits: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DYQ2Z9gU8AA3_Vt?format=jpg
MSmits: that's average
MSmits: I doubt thats true for mine :P
MSmits: getting a lot of mileage out of it
dbdr: to some degree
dbdr: it's still an order of magnitude difference
MSmits: most people hardly use their cpu and mostly gamers use their gpu a lot
MSmits: that's why those botnets are so effective
MSmits: it's not being used anyway...
MSmits: didn't they have a botnet of traffic cams somewhere?
inoryy: "17in monitor" -- something tells me that's not the newest data out there..
MSmits: yeah I could not get a 17 inch one when i wanted to
MSmits: it was all 20+
dbdr: I still doubt it's a good idea to buy new hardware because usage is more efficient
MSmits: yeah unless your hardware is really really old and doesnt have much life left in it
dbdr: inoryy: you can search for other data, but I doubt it will reverse the results
dbdr: it's mostly driven by physical processes
dbdr: MSmits: how much did the laws of physics change recently? ;)
MSmits: been out of the loop
dbdr: :D
dbdr: this is good to know because it's non obvious. we get the stuff in the shop and have no idea how it was produced and how much energy was needed for it
dbdr: while we do see the small part of energy usage at home
Uljahn: so green energy is not so green
inoryy: tbh I'm not even sure what's the argument in the first place -- are you thinking of global carbon offset?
MSmits: I imagine the price of the energy is negligible compared to the price of the machine
dbdr: I think I misread MSmits, thought you said you would save on energy bill :D
MSmits: nope, heating
dbdr: but you won't save on heating either :D
MSmits: energy bill will go through the roof
MSmits: so will most of the energy
MSmits: sure i will
MSmits: my heating bill = gas
MSmits: I will use a lot less gas
MSmits: instead using electricity to heat my house
dbdr: and more electricity
MSmits: through mcts
dbdr: and electricity is more expensive than gas per watt, isn't it?
MSmits: definitely
Astrobytes: Mass Consumption Tree Search
MSmits: otherwise we would all use electric heaters
Scarfield: but still saving money on heating, if you isolate that calc :p
MSmits: yes, and I am
inoryy: alright but then again I don't get the argument. it's like saying don't replace your V12 from the 70s with a modern hybrid because think of the energy used to produce it?
dbdr: reminds me of someone who did not turn off their gas cooker because they could not afford to buy matches ;)
MSmits: inoryy it wasn't even an argument because dbdr decided to misunderstand my poor excuse of a joke :P
dbdr: actually france pushed for electric heating at some period, because the nuclear reactors were underused
Astrobytes: Don't spoil it MSmits, this is CG chat, we can make an argument out of anything! :P
MSmits: true true
MSmits: i'd say underused is better than overused when it comes to nuclear reactors
dbdr: and then metaarguments
Astrobytes: (I mean that affectionately btw)
inoryy: no I get that, I'm just going with the misread version and trying to get where the argument comes from
Astrobytes: Yes MSmits, I tend to agree there
MSmits: ahh, well some people argue that you should replace somewhat older machines with newer ones to save money
dbdr: sometime people argument to buy new equipement because it is a bit more efficient than the old, still functional one
dbdr: ignoring the inefficiency of producing new equipement
MSmits: meh, I think I said it better
MSmits: :P
dbdr: you're much better obviously
dbdr: ;)
Astrobytes: As to whether it's efficient depends on your application of the equipment I guess
MSmits: :)
dbdr: yes, it's something you can calculate
dbdr: but many decisions are irrational or forget some aspect
MSmits: Astrobytes, the more you use it, the more it would help to replace it, but I doubt there are many instances where the new machine is that much more efficient that it's worth the cost of replacing it earlier
Astrobytes: I mean it's true a lot of people upgrade things (not just computing hardware) just because "bigger, better, FASTER MOAR" mentality
dbdr: yes, consumption addiction
MSmits: the efficiency argument is just a crutch to get that other stuff you just mentioned
Astrobytes: Yes MSmits, that's what I'm getting at. If you're gonna be running the hardware to it's full potential the tradeoff is sound
dbdr: not necessarily
MSmits: my point is that it might not even be sound then
MSmits: it might be better to run the old hardware into the ground first
dbdr: you need to do the math. you might need to use it at 500% of max capacity for it to start to make sense
Scarfield: development cost, production cost, transport, etc
MSmits: I calculated it for a TV once, one of those old tube TV's
MSmits: replacing it for a flatscreen
Astrobytes: Hm, yes I'll take that. I'm including industrial equipment here though
MSmits: didnt even come near being better to replace
MSmits: i mean that thing has a particle accelerator in it
MSmits: and it wasnt worth replacing
Astrobytes: hehe
dbdr: another fun calculation: in most cases, cars are in average slower than bikes, once you count how much time you need to work to pay for them
MSmits: I believe that
Scarfield: xD
Astrobytes: Cars are overrated.
MSmits: I never learned to drive because I would need to almost work an extra day just to pay for it
dbdr: nice
Astrobytes: I never had to learn to drive, and hopefully don't have to
Astrobytes: Always used public transport, my bicycle and my legs
dbdr: I have the license but never owned a car either :)
MSmits: I mean we are one of the most densely populated countries in the world with a great public transport system, why are people even considering cars if they dont need them
dbdr: brainwashing
dbdr: it's not rational in most cases
inoryy: dbdr why would you calculate it this way? typically your work hours are limited, as are your off-work hours. you either shave off 1+ hour on commute or you don't
MSmits: inoryy basically he counts driving as working
Scarfield: freedom and saving time
Astrobytes: London is like that (most cities I suppose). No need whatsoever to drive for *most* people. And try parking.
dbdr: don't buy a car, work 1 less hour per day
MSmits: I do too, I can't drive in the car and spam you guys on CG, but I can in a train
inoryy: but you can't in most cases
dbdr: or take unpaid leave sometime and enjoy life
inoryy: you work your work hours the same, that's my point
inoryy: the 1+ hour commute /day will be on top
dbdr: or time between jobs
MSmits: inoryy it depends on the country I think. I only work 4 days a week
dbdr: there are many options
MSmits: I could not afford this with a car
inoryy: I mean sure it depends on the country
Astrobytes: Yeah, work/life balance really needs to be addressed globally. Might be some other issues to solve first but that might help in the long run.
MSmits: also it gets even worse when people go to fitness studios when they could use their commute to fitness
dbdr: sometimes you can also decide to rent/buy closer to your job with the money saved
Astrobytes: Not in London mate :D
MSmits: I walk 1 hr a day as part of my commute
MSmits: when i work that is
MSmits: thats not wasted time in the way that driving would be
inoryy: to clarify the car culture is mostly a thing in US, and in US I don't think you have that freedom of choice you're speaking of
dbdr: I know london prices are crazy
MSmits: inoryy car culture is here too, but you're right in the US distances are longer and the public transport is worse
dbdr: in the US, depends where. some cities are dense
Scarfield: im not sure how many complanies are willing to take on someone for a 4 day week, when others are willing to do 5 days. but i like the idea.
dbdr: in NY I think most people don't use their cars
MSmits: depends a lot on the line of work i suppose
MSmits: in my line of work most of my colleagues are parttimers
Scarfield: but that so many people (myself included) has a 0.5-1ton machine for transport doesnt make sense
MSmits: fulltimers are a dying breed
MSmits: hopefully not literally... I am dreading where this is going next week
Astrobytes: In the UK we work you into the ground so that hopefully nobody has to pay out your pension.
inoryy: the point is that if a person in US does ends up buying a car for commute it's not like he's dumb dumb and doesn't realize he could just work 35 hours / week or take unpaid leave or whatever and ride a bike instead, almost no company would take that deal lol
Scarfield: ^
dbdr: you can take time off between jobs too
MSmits: inoryy maybe not a software company
MSmits: schools, hospitals etc, will do it just fine
Astrobytes: In the US?
Scarfield: not as an engineer either in my exp
MSmits: not sure about US
Astrobytes: He was talking about US :)
MSmits: here coders will work full time also, I guess that's expected of them
MSmits: my friends that are coders do work full time anyway
dbdr: you can also do consulting and chose your pace
inoryy: you can also not work, that's an option
dbdr: yes :)
Astrobytes: Not a good option anywhere other than France lol
Scarfield: many places its kind of frowned upon to not work more than the minimum hrs, but it seems thats about to change. Have heard about more companies trying shorter work weeks in DK at least
Scarfield: especially during the lockdown
MSmits: shorter work weeks are great at reducing unemployment
dbdr: a smart company would accept an employee working 75% of the time for 75% of pay. they will be more productive in average, so it's a net gain
dbdr: since your productivity goes now as you get tired
MSmits: thats not guaranteed, but they might be more productive yes
MSmits: there's also a work-experience/learning argument
MSmits: when you reduce the percentage, at some point you will spend too much of your time learning how to do the work
dbdr: will depend on the situation, for sure
MSmits: but 75% seems very nice for the company, if the lines of communication are good
MSmits: like... when i am off work, i will still reply to e-mails flexibly
MSmits: I will even work when I am off work if necessary and I'll work less on another day
dbdr: reminds me of this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xNzXze5Yza8
dbdr: apparently it's a real ad. to me it feels like a parody
MSmits: thats because of the actor in it
Astrobytes: Jeez
MSmits: he always plays humorous mega-villains
Scarfield: lol
dbdr: I don't know the actor
dbdr: for me it's because of the message
dbdr: nice top comment by the way
MSmits: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4d0Js2TP04k
Astrobytes: It is a real ad
Astrobytes: btw
Scarfield: yea, and apparently a serious one :o
Astrobytes: Grim, ain't it.
Scarfield: Brothers. Grim, aint it. :p
Astrobytes: Grimm really, but yeah :P
Astrobytes: Spellingfield
Scarfield: hehe, well i would have had spelled either the name or the word wrong, there was no winning :p
Astrobytes: Hahaha
jacek: springfield
JBM: damn on HL before the big thoughtful discussion
JBM: now i've read it all, damn you astroes
Scarfield: ban !
Scarfield: or !ban :thinking:
JBM: that mod list is getting dangerously close to the window hwight
Astrobytes: lol
Astrobytes: Oh nice writeup on your site btw JBM
Astrobytes: The Brainfuck one
JBM: glad you liked it
Astrobytes: Moar content needed. You have a good style of writing imo
JBM: you have no idea how many times i proofread it
Astrobytes: I think I spotted an error, hang on
JBM: plz tell
Astrobytes: Found it. In the "But why?" section, "The brainfuck case stands out with the compiler being typically easier to implement than the compiler"
JBM: lol
JBM: good catch thanks
Astrobytes: np
JBM: there, fixed
Astrobytes: Cool. Also, "It sags the mind" is possibly the best title ever, nevermind Brainfuck-related title
Astrobytes: *shags
JBM: yeah that one took some time too
Scarfield: "Shall we shag now, or shall we shag later, baby"
Astrobytes: Yeah, very Austin Powers to most, yet very normal here in the UK ;)
JBM: shag tends to pass way more word filters than fuck
JBM: i had to get so creative to be able to even edit my twitch "started streaming" message
jacek: braincoitus?
JBM: no it reads as brainfuck
Astrobytes: Well played in any case
JBM: lemme check what the final version is
JBM: those people did their work
JBM: "JBM started streaming in brainſ̵uck.
Boy was that a tough broadcast message to get past Twitch."
JBM: LATIN SMALL LETTER LONG S ; COMBINING SHORT STROKE OVERLAY
JBM: anything 1-char in the f's place was no no
JBM: (or the u or the c)
Astrobytes: Hah! Very nice
JBM: took me 20 tries to find something acceptable
Astrobytes: Being Scottish it's always difficult to understand why anything has a 'bad' language filter in the first place.
JBM: us monoculture
Astrobytes: True. I imagine the French have similar issues with it.
JBM: not sure
JBM: what do you mean more precisely?
Astrobytes: A lot of casual phrases in French are considered bad language in the UK
JBM: for example?
Astrobytes: As in less culturally acceptable
MSmits: j'ai une grosse baguette
JBM: that one's ostensibly ridiculous
MSmits: thats what i was going for
jacek: omelette du fromage
JBM: that one's like not even really french
MSmits: makes sense
jacek: dexter's doesnt lie
JBM: was in dexter?
JBM: don't remember
JBM: i've seen the meme propagate, and never really understood who it was trying to make fun of
MSmits: dexter?
MSmits: the show about the serial killer?
jacek: the cartton
eulerscheZahl: Dexter Morgan
jacek: how old are you
Astrobytes: Dexter's Laboratory
jacek: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2kArCRjT29w
Astrobytes: JBM, I should have said words tbh, not phrases. e.g. putain, merde are (in my experience) a lot easier to get away with in many situations than me saying shit and fuck in English company
JBM: is that the source?
eulerscheZahl: i miss some cartoon knowledge.
a lot was aired on a station called SuperRTL. We had an antenna shared with the neighborhood and a bandwidth for 22 channels. majority vote was against the cartoon station
JBM: ah, ok
Astrobytes: and yeah that's the source of that quote
MSmits: dexter for me will always be dexter morgan. Great show
JBM: yeah, same here
eulerscheZahl: and damn Kinderkanal was one of them. cartoons too but more pedagogic value
wlesavo: books actually quite ok too, but the plot is very different, so that it becomes a little bit annoying if you saw the series
JBM: ok now i saw the source
JBM: so yeah Astrobytes shit and (some translations of) fuck are rather common in everyday french
JBM: they're still categorized "bad" (like, my mother would NEVER say them)
JBM: but no one bats an eye
Astrobytes: Oh yeah absolutely, just less taboo than they are here
JBM: yes
JBM: a good thing too, imho
Astrobytes: Yes I agree fully
JBM: not that cursing is the point or anything
JBM: but being afraid of words is not only pointless, but self-defeating
Astrobytes: No, it's legitimate expression.
Astrobytes: Absolutely
JBM: i'm more like "ok, magic button, tomorrow the word shit disappears from everywhere, words, books, memories"
Astrobytes: It's the "brush it under the carpet and it'll go away" mentality
JBM: well, people are going to invent a new word to ban anyway
Scarfield: made me think of this https://youtu.be/rkfFyELXdoM?t=4
Astrobytes: Quite.
JBM: you can't ban talking about reproduction
JBM: and you can't ban people insulting each other
JBM: the choice of words they use... so insignificant
JBM: (well you *can* ban people insulting each other, but they're still going to do it)
Astrobytes: Be a bit more prudent to address why they are insulting each other in the first place tbh
JBM: because people need an antagonist?
Astrobytes: Yep. Modern existence seems to be all about skirting around the issue and finding a scapegoat.
Astrobytes: Hell, all our existence.
JBM: gays, muslims, protestants two centuries back, eastasia
JBM: wait it's more than two
JBM: darn, my entire argument invalid :(
jacek: clashers
Astrobytes: The Catholic/Protestant issue is alive and well in Scotland and Ireland
JBM: scotland too?
Astrobytes: (as an aside)
Astrobytes: Yes
JBM: didn't know
Astrobytes: Many Irish came here, so you still have the republic vs the crown
Astrobytes: Alive and well in football rivalry, separate schools, divides in towns (by street, sometimes groups of houses in the same street)
Astrobytes: Not formal divides in towns, informal.
Astrobytes: It's pretty sickening. Orange Order walks/processions are still a thing
JBM: *googling*
JBM: #Controversy
Astrobytes: That's the Protestant side, the Orangemen.
jacek: orange order, trump?
Astrobytes: Battle of the Boyne, William of Orange, etc etc
JBM: oh wait
Astrobytes: Nothing but religious bigotry.
JBM: that's *our* Orange
JBM: took me 3 wikilinks
JBM: lol
JBM: not sure anyone there's still aware of that
Astrobytes: What part? He fought against a Catholic French dude iirc
JBM: "William of Orange"
JBM: from the principality of Orange, Provence
JBM: 90min's drive from here
Astrobytes: Ah right, yeah. Unimportant detail if you're engaged in persistent multi-generational religious bigotry
JBM: sure
JBM: i figured claiming the land would be their endgame
JBM: silly me
MSmits: hmm Willem van Oranje?
JBM: it's all about bickering with the catholics
Astrobytes: I don't speak to about 2/3 of my family because they're Orange lunatics
MSmits: he;s in our national anthem
JBM: treaty of Utrecht ceded the land back to france
MSmits: or is william of Orange != Willem van Oranje ?
JBM: could be a link
Astrobytes: Well he was Dutch so I guess so
MSmits: right
MSmits: he's basically considered our founding father of sorts
JBM: orange was also famous in the 90s for being one of the first town halls to "fall" to the racist FN
Astrobytes: Willem Hendrik MSmits?
MSmits: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_the_Silent
Astrobytes: Figures JBM, all the Orangemen I know are racists of the most ignorant kind
JBM: i KNEW it
MSmits: why do you know so many racists that it becomes statistically significant Astrobytes ?
MSmits: :worried:
JBM: i'm afraid we all do
JBM: knowingly or not
Astrobytes: To be clear for anyone not in the know, the Orangemen/Protestant crowd in the UK are Unionists, that is they endorse the occupation of Northern Ireland by the crown
MSmits: ah right
MSmits: great britain needs more atheists
Astrobytes: And have a vitriolic hatred of Catholics
Astrobytes: (I was raised Protestant)
Astrobytes: *born into
jacek: its solar empire vs new lunar republic all over again
MSmits: I was raised heretic
Astrobytes: It's a load of old bollocks is what it is
MSmits: does bollocks get through the twitch filter
MSmits: jbm, go do another stream
Astrobytes: And the flames are fanned by increasingly far-right government in Westminster
JBM: MSmits: nobody watches my streams, what's the point :p
MSmits: I don't watch any streams, but if I did I would watch yours JBM
Astrobytes: There were 4 or 5 viewers when I joined late the other night
JBM: it's been "stable" between 5 and 12 all along
JBM: i'm in it for the long tail
Astrobytes: If you wish to learn you a Haskell for great good JBMs streams are worth a watch
JBM: i *think* (i oughta check) i get a lot more views on youtube
JBM: MSmits: that's [would be] so nice of you! :D
MSmits: :)
Astrobytes: Probably. Time constraints/timezone constraints mean streaming niche stuff never gets the views at the time
JBM: yea that plays for a lot
MSmits: I spend way too much time following what happens in the US
MSmits: i should stop that
Astrobytes: Watch JBM streams, get inspired and then punish your soul by writing Haskell very badly
MSmits: does JBM do CG stuff in haskell?
JBM: (or better, if you stay to the end)
JBM: yeah that tends to happen
JBM: but i've also streamed C++ and Perl
MSmits: what made you decide to do this?
JBM: boredom ;p
MSmits: I shared on you tube before, but streaming is a different beast
Astrobytes: I didn't mean JBM's Haskell was bad btw, I mean mines is bad
MSmits: oh, I wonder if i'll learn haskell next year
BenFreanklin: HI
MSmits: I signed up to functional programming course
Astrobytes: You should definitely do some videos MSmits, if not streams
MSmits: are they likely to use haskell?
BenFreanklin: On a pickle watt up
Astrobytes: Lisp for sure
JBM: which uni?
JBM: utrecht has a big haskell rep
MSmits: Astrobytes personally I like writing > youtube > livestreaming
MSmits: hmm might be utrecht
Astrobytes: Whatever suits :)
JBM: they used to maintain a haskell compiler of their own, UHC
Astrobytes: Nice
MSmits: let me see if i can find this
MSmits: Elm!
MSmits: is what they use
JBM: oh, elm
JBM: "it's complicated"
MSmits: I have no idea,
MSmits: brb
kingslayer2020: hi
firecraftgaming: I love how people seriosly doesnt think im 13 years old
kingslayer2020: me too
firecraftgaming: it isnt a joke i am 13 years old
JBM: sure yeou are
kingslayer2020: yap me too
Astrobytes: We heard you the first time
firecraftgaming: yes i am how should i prove it
AntiSquid: i think you're 12
MSmits: you have to be at least 14 imho
MSmits: firecraftgaming how old will you be in 21 years
JBM: why would you even want to?
firecraftgaming: 34
MSmits: how about in twice that many years
AntiSquid: no idea how this started by why should everyone care firecraftgaming?
AntiSquid: anyone *
JBM: he started it on his own
JBM: how convincingly suspicious
AntiSquid: i just entered chat and i see this mess
Astrobytes: Indeed.
MSmits: he's still working on my math puzzle, don't distract him
Astrobytes: You missed all the good conversation AntiSquid
firecraftgaming: what math puzzle????
MSmits: how old would you be in twice that many years
MSmits: it's important
AntiSquid: he did answer you MSmits
firecraftgaming: ok? 55
MSmits: i asked a followup
MSmits: ah see
MSmits: thats too smart
MSmits: if you said 68 i would have believed you were 13
firecraftgaming: haha
Astrobytes: lol
MSmits: want another chance firecraftgaming?
MSmits: to prove you're 13?
Astrobytes: Just mention Minecraft
JBM: take a nude pic; send it to any of the americans here
Astrobytes: Or what's that other crap, Roblox
JBM: if the fbi brings their door down, you were 13 or less
Scarfield: how do you tame a horse in minecraft?
dbdr: seems like the "prove you're a human" asimov story, where the robot has to pretend to be dummer than he is
AntiSquid: bad argument Astrobytes, lots of 40+ people stream minecraft and other pixelart games
MSmits: err i think they'd be bringing your door down JBM :P
Astrobytes: Not Roblox though AntiSQuid
JBM: i'm not american
Astrobytes: And yes, fair point
MSmits: since when has that stopped them
AntiSquid: i am sure even roblox
JBM: mmm good pt
Astrobytes: Surely not AntiSquid
Astrobytes: Nice point of reference dbdr
AntiSquid: i occasionally tune into twitch and check some random games, often see bored tired old faces of people playing all sorts of games and i wonder why?
MSmits: i know
dbdr: I wonder how
MSmits: you search for tired old faces on twitch
MSmits: better search terms
AntiSquid: lol dbdr
Astrobytes: Hmm. Cult of celebrity, monetisation, low self esteem... need I go on
AntiSquid: sure MSmits
JBM: and all that you could see was...?
MSmits: https://www.twitch.tv/sleepy
MSmits: this came up when i searched for tired old faces
dbdr: just another ...
AntiSquid: there's some streamers worth watching every now and then
JBM: tired old face
dbdr: red black tree
JBM: what a lousy rhyme
JBM: ah, better
kingslayer2020: are we coding orr??
JBM: no u
AntiSquid: kingslayer2020 sure, have any ideas?
kingslayer2020: yap what i expected
AntiSquid: what did you even expect?
Astrobytes: Are YOU coding kingslayer2020
kingslayer2020: some people saying no
kingslayer2020: nop
Astrobytes: That is the pertinent question here. And if not - why not?!
MSmits: I coded a line only 10 mins ago kingslayer2020
AntiSquid: does it count as coding if you just graph plots in python ? kingslayer2020
kingslayer2020: i dont know
Astrobytes: I commented something out a minute ago, if that counts
kingslayer2020: maybe
AntiSquid: maybe not
kingslayer2020: i dont know
Astrobytes: Get coding kingslayer2020
kingslayer2020: how about you ask msmits here
coderinblack: alr
AntiSquid: in the future if i do an API call to some advanced ML model to solve a problem for me, is it still coding?
AntiSquid: kingslayer2020
Astrobytes: bms coderinblack
kingslayer2020: i guess so
kingslayer2020: what do you think??
AntiSquid: well i wrote the one line API call so ofc
AntiSquid: hard work
Astrobytes: More coding less chatting kingslayer2020
kingslayer2020: ha not the smartest guy here are you??
AntiSquid: Automaton2000 is
Automaton2000: i'm curious how much you can do that in c#
kingslayer2020: so much
kingslayer2020: you would get blindd
AntiSquid: also you need to get an avatar
MSmits: Automaton2000 what kind of avatar does kingslayer2020 need ?
Automaton2000: i don't know why it does not
Astrobytes: So much talking rubbish, you could get a warning kingslayer2020
MSmits: Automaton2000 that's an unacceptable answer
Automaton2000: still not sure how to make a game for cg ?
Astrobytes: Tell us how Automaton2000
MSmits: Automaton2000 just make a teapot
Automaton2000: can you paste the code
MSmits: euler did
Automaton2000: but you did well on a few
Astrobytes: Not the point Automaton2000, tell us how you do it
Automaton2000: was about to write that
Astrobytes: Go on then Automaton2000
Automaton2000: but you have to check
MSmits: Automaton2000 is stalling
Automaton2000: because that is the question
AntiSquid: Astrobytes don't be hard on kingslayer2020, guy is new here
MSmits: think he might be new anywhere?
AntiSquid: welcome to CG kingslayer2020 what are you up to ? :)
Astrobytes: Not being hard, I just don't take fools lightly
kingslayer2020: well coding i guess and gaming
MSmits: so you take them hard?
LmK1337: :P
JBM: do they like it?
LmK1337: hey anyone here programs PLCs ?
MSmits: you can count on jbm to make it weird
Astrobytes: I take fools harder than a hard thing on a hard day
Astrobytes: You started that one MSmits, you always do. Don't feign innocence here
Astrobytes: :grin:
MSmits: hey, to be fair, i only realized that after i typed it
MSmits: was still before i hit enter though
Astrobytes: see!
Astrobytes: I shall rephrase. I do not suffer fools gladly.
AntiSquid: Astrobytes CG was far more fun when i joined, back when madao was active and trash talking along with other new peeps in chat, good times :'(
Astrobytes: You need to stay in chat more often then, you've missed it
MSmits: are you saying CG has gotten too nice?
AntiSquid: also madao "lol, want me to ban you AntiSquid?"
Astrobytes: And was trying to get Maddy back ;ast night
Astrobytes: *last
MSmits: how?
Scarfield: secret rituals i presume
kingslayer2020: ms sits:https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=how+not+to+be+stupid+-+a+guide+to+critical+thinkinghttps://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=how+not+to+be+stupid+-+a+guide+to+critical+thinking
AntiSquid: just my impression
Astrobytes: He 'slipped' into Gorbit's DMs. So I had a chat by proxy
kingslayer2020: i think you need it
MSmits: kingslayer2020 it's great that you are looking to improve yourself
Astrobytes: He says he was busy but will come back
AntiSquid: kingslayer2020 trolling overload
kingslayer2020: ohh you mean you
MSmits: indeed, i did say you
Astrobytes: Try harder kingslayer2020
kingslayer2020: yeah your stupid enough not to recognize yourself
AntiSquid: no . kingslayer2020 please be more polite . get along with the other users
kingslayer2020: fine
Astrobytes: OR just be a knob
AntiSquid: get an anime avatar
Astrobytes: Or no avatar and a good reputation
MSmits: also, when you're calling people stupid, don't say "your stupid". It's you're
AntiSquid: kingslayer2020 what games do you like and what do you like to code? also get an anime avatar
MSmits: just some helpful advice :P
JBM: what's an avatar
MSmits: it's like a smurf, but more elongated
Scarfield: xD
AntiSquid: don't listen to JBM, he's the chat villain
JBM: am i?
AntiSquid: yes
kingslayer2020: thanks for your information mssmits but i prefer my way
JBM: how did i gain the title?
AntiSquid: nothing official, i can't grant titles
MSmits: kingslayer2020 ok, but prepare to be misunderstood
JBM: darn
Astrobytes: I thought the Villain was MadKnight
AntiSquid: why
kingslayer2020: as you wish
Astrobytes: It's his discord
AntiSquid: kingslayer2020 your means belonging, you're is contraction of you are
MSmits: AntiSquid don't jinx it
MSmits: you just made him nicer
kingslayer2020: ??
AntiSquid: your *something* = the something that belongs to the person you address
kingslayer2020: what does that even man
AntiSquid: if i say Automaton2000 your idiot, it means i am telling Automaton2000 i am his idiot
MSmits: I mean I just noticed you got nicer and now AntiSquid is annoying you again :P
Automaton2000: that's the only reason i can think of that
MSmits: Automaton2000 already assumed you were AntiSquid
Astrobytes: See, now this is why I wish we had a delete on the chat
Automaton2000: when i have time i will make a ga for that
AntiSquid: why? lol
Astrobytes: So we can delete trash talk stuff
Astrobytes: afterwards I mean
AntiSquid: did i do something wrong? :(
MSmits: nah, not this time
Astrobytes: No lol
MSmits: but we got a log now, I'm sure if I dig....
JBM: i call that not "yet"
Astrobytes: I mean, when the trash talking is done, we can clean it up
kingslayer2020: its me isn't it??
JBM: it's not us it's you
AntiSquid: MSmits hm ya there were often fun arguments in chat
MSmits: I remember you and re curse going at it :P
AntiSquid: kingslayer2020 you're alright, just missing an avatar, no worries
MSmits: dont remember when exactly
Astrobytes: Oh I wouldn't delete stuff like that
Astrobytes: Just random stuff that serves no purpose
AntiSquid: i don't consider that even worth mentioning MSmits
kingslayer2020: im trying but its not my problem the file arent uploading
MSmits: allright :)
MSmits: maybe the dimensions arent correct
MSmits: you can use a simple paint program to cut it a bit so it has the right size
AntiSquid: maybe it's not an anime avatar ?
AntiSquid: were you trying to upload something else?
Astrobytes: you need m-dimensional pics on here
MSmits: m-theory?
AntiSquid: where is the node-js guy gone? firecraftgaming you just joined the community, are you already gone?
Astrobytes: Sure. Gotta use your m-brane
MSmits: AntiSquid thats because you didn't believe he was 13
JBM: i forgot who was 13
MSmits: or wasn't
MSmits: he never did prove it
JBM: thta one
AntiSquid: i said 12, he will be 13 in a year no?
JBM: hopefully
MSmits: might be less even
Astrobytes: Not if he carries on like that
MSmits: a year would be the upper limit of that
JBM: is he in a "herd immunity" kind of country?
AntiSquid: wow that expression ...
MSmits: I'm immune to herds, when a herd of people all do one thing, I do the opposity
MSmits: opposite
dbdr: :)
MSmits: are people in a herd immunity country immune to herd mentality?
AntiSquid: netherlands isn't as strict as other countries i heard
Astrobytes: Herd immunity comes from vaccination parlance, it's totally misappropriated wrt Covid, UK government wholly responsible
Scarfield: so if a herd of people where all hetero, how would you react?
MSmits: it was pretty strict before, but it's gonna be bad after next week I am afraid :(
MSmits: schools open up
MSmits: no restrictions at all
AntiSquid: sweden never had a real lockdown during this time so is it really that bad?
MSmits: recipe for disaster I think
MSmits: sweden had way more deaths
Astrobytes: Schools opened today here. Apart from a few that were flooded/damaged after last nights 7 hour thunderstorm
MSmits: than most countries
dbdr: some people saying sweden counted better
AntiSquid: true, but media blown up the entire thing out of proportions, some where thinking 90% of people out there will die
MSmits: Sweden: 571 per million. Netherlands: 359 per million
MSmits: and Netherlands is more densely populated
MSmits: which makes it easier to spread
Astrobytes: Sweden were a little more complacent initially.
Scarfield: the minister responsoble for the approach in sweden admitted they didnt do enough
Astrobytes: ^
MSmits: AntiSquid people keep forgetting that the deathrate is not the most important thing
AntiSquid: belgium 865 per million, what happened there?
MSmits: I think there are more people surviving with lifetime serious health considitons than people dying
Astrobytes: While the shit was hitting the fan here my friend Erik was not giving a shit (he's a chef) and everything was open, continuing as normal
MSmits: conditions that is
Astrobytes: Yes. People are not grasping the consequences MSmits.
MSmits: AntiSquid I think Belgium counted everyone dying in nursing homes as having died of covid, it should maybe be 100 lower or so, or 200
Astrobytes: They still think it's a cold
AntiSquid: at the end of the day i hope russia is honest about having a vaccine
jacek: its :vodka:
Astrobytes: Missed out 3rd phase
MSmits: you mean having a safe and effective vaccine
jacek: who cares about 3rd phase
Scarfield: it does so that you dont die from covid, in 100% of the cases
dbdr: russia is not more advanced than others, they just announced earlier
Astrobytes: Antibody-dependent enhancement
IfIHadATail: oh good my facebook feed has spilled over to codingame :/
MSmits: I am not on facebook
MSmits: this is my facebook :P
Astrobytes: The 3rd phase of testing is supposed to eliminate that possiblity
AntiSquid: with all the russia hacking conspiracies out there thought they might at least have stollen it from elsewhere dbdr
MSmits: AntiSquid is my mark zuckerberg
Astrobytes: *possibility
DarkDev: who knows lua
AntiSquid: woah MSmits what does that suppose to mean? :/ not sure how to perceive that
MSmits: hey, i thought you wanted to trashtalk
MSmits: I am making a serious effort here
Scarfield: he thinks you are a lizard im sure
Astrobytes: The virus can sometimes cause a more severe response when exposed a second time, that's the danger of not doing the 3rd phase testing
Astrobytes: *when you are exposed a second time
MSmits: Mark zuckerberg talks like a robot, you talk *to* a robot, it's similar
AntiSquid: no MSmits, geez have some moderation
IfIHadATail: DarkDev it is just easier to post your question in the chat and people that know the answer will help you
MSmits: :P
Astrobytes: It's an immune response, it depends on the antibodies produced in the initial infection
AntiSquid: and if i was you're mark zuck then i'd ban you AND sell your data
Scarfield: xD
IfIHadATail: cause like i know Lua but I don't "know" Lua if you get my drift :P
MSmits: I think he would just sell my data
Astrobytes: Absolutely nobody listening to my explanation of why the Russian vaccine announcement is bad.
AntiSquid: i am reading, just not speed reading
MSmits: thats because I mentioned zuckerberg
IfIHadATail: I'm not russian so I could care less
jacek: and i forgot the topic of conversation
Astrobytes: Bearing in mind I work in pharma and am a biologist
jacek: im sorry
MSmits: jacek
MSmits: lemme get you up to speed
MSmits: Astrobytes is filling us in about the conspiracies
AntiSquid: it's the usual CG topic jacek
Astrobytes: No conspiracies
MSmits: really?
MSmits: then you must be deep-state
Astrobytes: Clearly.
Astrobytes: Cold hard science has that effect.
IfIHadATail: lol everyone thinks they aren't a conspiracy theorist
MSmits: but sure, the stupidest thing you can do is a poorly tested vaccine. There's already people afraid of fake vaccins
MSmits: of real i mean
AntiSquid: i also wonder every time i see the word vaccine, will it help against all strands of the virus ??
jacek: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=liiVX55tJ7E
Astrobytes: No way to tell currently AntiSquid, it's a completely new virus
MSmits: I think it also depends on what type of vaccine
MSmits: it's also possible that it doesnt work on all strands, but the strands it doesnt work on are harmless
MSmits: it may not have to work on all
Astrobytes: The variants seen so far are not harmless
MSmits: no, but you dont see the harmless variants maybe?
MSmits: because they are harmless
AntiSquid: are mers and sars harmless?
Astrobytes: Haven't checked the sequencing data, if it's there tbh, I admit
MSmits: there's a selection effect there for sure
Astrobytes: Covid is a SARS variant (of sorts)
MSmits: AntiSquid the vaccine wont work against those for sure
MSmits: too different
MSmits: from what i understand vaccines are usually more specific than that
Astrobytes: It's called SARS-CoV-2 for a reason ;)
IfIHadATail: viruses mutate and the vaccines chase the mutations that is why you need to get them all the time
Astrobytes: Yes, precisely.
MSmits: I dont get them all the time though?
jacek: i wonder how the russian put the autism into vaccine so quickly
MSmits: lol...
AntiSquid: as long as it's not a Microsoft TM vaccine :p
Astrobytes: Oh here we go
IfIHadATail: he said using his free OS that tracks everything he does :P
MSmits: I had quite a scare the one time I tried to install windows 10
AntiSquid: Astrobytes it's meme worthy at least
Astrobytes: Anyway, good chat. Catch you all tomorrow :) gn
Astrobytes: hehehe :D
MSmits: it really tries to get you to connect your microsoft account to your windows installation
MSmits: I tried my work account and suddenly my windows computer was basically a work terminal
MSmits: the button to install without an account was really well hidden
AntiSquid: Bill Gates intended for a some invisible ink tatoo, so it makes people talk
IfIHadATail: yeah they are trying to make the expereience seamless between devices
MSmits: I dont want my boss to control my private computer :P
AntiSquid: run windows 10 on a VM inside linux eh
IfIHadATail: yeah I don't have the whole "work" problem right now :P
IfIHadATail: must be a nice problem to have
MSmits: lose your job due to covid?
IfIHadATail: no I lost it due to work related injury
MSmits: ah that's worse, sorry to hear that
IfIHadATail: yeah well that is how I finally took the steps into coding so love-hate lol
MSmits: I'd give up a toe to discover coding
MSmits: maybe two
IfIHadATail: 20 year career down the drain for this new and scary one lol
IfIHadATail: honestly I've wanted to do this for ages so yeah I just hope it works out lol
AntiSquid: what were you before ?
IfIHadATail: custom metal fabricator
AntiSquid: ok
MSmits: career changes are always scary voluntary or involuntary
IfIHadATail: yup it was fun while it lasted lol
AntiSquid: wasn't for me MSmits
AntiSquid: i thought "screw it, whatever happens happens"
MSmits: maybe because you were swinging knives in your previous job
MSmits: nothing scares you anymore
AntiSquid: YOLO
AntiSquid: try to make the most out of it?
MSmits: did Jordan Peterson talk you into it?
AntiSquid: IfIHadATail i don't have any idea what your previous job involves, but wouldn't data science (maybe some machine learning) be helpful for you ? do you have a strong chemical background?
AntiSquid: i mean you could combine the knowledge you have with that and get yourself further than just "coding" imo
AntiSquid: no MSmits
MSmits: he talks a lot of that kind of thing, youtube for some reason has decided i should watch him
AntiSquid: now that you mentioned him, would like to know what you think about him ? curious
MSmits: I like him when he talks about what he 's an expert in
MSmits: his field
AntiSquid: forgot about his existence, watched him briefly confronting some weird activist, watched him talk and then i thought he is wasting his breath with those people, then moved on
MSmits: he has a lot of followers online
AntiSquid: watched him talk about life in general i mean *
MSmits: millions
IfIHadATail: I do not have a strong chemical background no. I did study metals but only how I would use them in their annealed, normalized, and hardened states definitely no chemestry involved :P
IfIHadATail: or extremely little
AntiSquid: entertaining for a while, but i felt i need to move on at some point, it feels like watching same ideas over and over again after a while MSmits
MSmits: yeah
IfIHadATail: I'd be closer at home in engineering TBH
MSmits: Simulated Annealing should feel right at home :)
kingslayer2020: has anyone completed thee coders strike back challenge??
IfIHadATail: which challenge is that?
MSmits: kingslayer2020 it's not a challenge you complete. It's a multiplayer competitive arena
MSmits: you just get better and rank higher
kingslayer2020: fine whatever you say
MSmits: but sure
MSmits: I rank fairly high, ask
kingslayer2020: has anyone done it though??
MSmits: almost everyone
AntiSquid: well you could get 1st place and pretend you completed it, but nothing on that ranking seems to last forever
IfIHadATail: oh right the competition. Yeah I just got to gold the other day : )
MSmits: good job
inoryy: "I rank fairly high" says top5 competitor
MSmits: 6th
kingslayer2020: how do you adjust th thrust
inoryy: oh that changes everything, carry on
MSmits: :)
IfIHadATail: TY : ) my bot completely skipped silver league and I was pretty proud of that actually lol
MSmits: kingslayer2020 just use a power lower than 100
kingslayer2020: thnx
AntiSquid: nice, now do ocean of code IfIHadATail
MSmits: but usually you either do 0 or 100 to make this simple, I do
MSmits: when you turn you could sometimes do 0 to turn more easily
AntiSquid: if you dare that is :p
IfIHadATail: I might do that next. I just wanted to see if I can get higher in coders strike back first cause I only got as far as getting my program to work with now having two pods
MSmits: IfIHadATail ooc has a high entry level
kingslayer2020: print(30 <= thrust <= 0):corrections
AntiSquid: was half joking, it's imo the hardest on CG
MSmits: yeah might be
inoryy: really?
MSmits: locam is fairly complicated to start out in as well
AntiSquid: i said imo MSmits, just my opinion
kingslayer2020: print(30 <= thrust <= 0)
IfIHadATail: OOC was actually my first ever live competition on codingame ever lol
MSmits: yeah i am not sure, maybe I agree
kingslayer2020: print(30 <= thrust <= 0)
IfIHadATail: I bare made it to bronze lol
kingslayer2020: print(30 <= thrust <= 0)
kingslayer2020: print(30 <= thrust <= 0)
kingslayer2020: print(30 <= thrust <= 0)
kingslayer2020: print(30 <= thrust <= 0)
AntiSquid: please don't spam
MSmits: maybe he thinks he has to output it here?
kingslayer2020: fine just correct me
MSmits: i dont know what language that
MSmits: is
kingslayer2020: python
MSmits: does python do <= in strings? I didnt even know
AntiSquid: but that's a comparison afaik @_@
AntiSquid: you want to output a value ?!
inoryy: aside from why would you print that in the first place, you're testing for x to be in-between [30, 0] with 0 being upper bound..
AntiSquid: print(x,y,thrust) ???
AntiSquid: forgot CSB
IfIHadATail: yeah
MSmits: inoryy will that always be false?
MSmits: so he just prints false?
inoryy: unless math changed
MSmits: been out of the loop lately
MSmits: might have
inoryy: as with physics? :)
MSmits: yeah :(
jacek: pi is 3.2 now
IfIHadATail: :O
AntiSquid: new version?
MSmits: oh noes, they changed pi!
inoryy: monsters, everyone knows it's 3
jacek: pi was too OP, they nerfed it
kingslayer2020: when your more nicer thats the day monkeys will fly
IfIHadATail: they are always trying to find ways to give us less for the same cost
MSmits: is this because of changes in the space time curvature? Are we now non-euclidean?
IfIHadATail: we are using facebook physics now
AntiSquid: you need to change your perception, don't assume people are being mean so easily kingslayer2020
IfIHadATail: where that guy that got a c in science class in HS is an expert in everything
MSmits: our worst crime here is trying to be funny kingslayer2020
MSmits: HS?
MSmits: hypersonic?
AntiSquid: worst crime is laughing at our own jokes, while thinking everyone else laughs along
IfIHadATail: lol high school :P
MSmits: oh ok
MSmits: guilty!
IfIHadATail: super guilty
MSmits: ok ok super guilty then
MSmits: jeez dont rub it in
IfIHadATail: :D
MSmits: :P
AntiSquid: kingslayer2020 look at the statement check required output format
AntiSquid: also gave you an example earlier
MSmits: AntiSquid is being super nice, he would have said RTFM otherwise
AntiSquid: this is your fault guys, making fun of Madknight until he quit CG, he used to help everyone in CSB
MSmits: true
MSmits: euler still helps
MSmits: and he doesnt try to get you on teamspeak :P
IfIHadATail: oof you guys made someone leave?
MSmits: nahh
AntiSquid: but euler isn't anything like the high priest of a CSB cult
MSmits: madknight is a nice guy that helps, but a little weird sometimes. He has not been very active as a player for a loooong time
IfIHadATail: wow didn't know there was a cult
AntiSquid: i just made it sound dramatic IfIHadATail
AntiSquid: the cult part is also me making it sound dramatic
MSmits: not coding much, just trashtalking veterans and helping new people
IfIHadATail: looks my aspirations of leegeond are dead
AntiSquid: he did code
IfIHadATail: I can spell I swear
MSmits: hmm not much in the time i was here?
AntiSquid: IfIHadATail don't worry about madknight, actually he liked to try stuff out outside CG
MSmits: not in contests and i didnt see him appear much in multis
AntiSquid: he basically just moved on
MSmits: aside from CSB
AntiSquid: he spent a lot of time on rendering a cube from scratch in C ! :D
AntiSquid: coding NES games
AntiSquid: then trying out other stuff and inviting people to try it out too
IfIHadATail: lol sounds like fun >.>
MSmits: yeah he would sometimes PM me asking how to do those things or getting me to do them
AntiSquid: IfIHadATail ya the conversation resulting from that was fun
IfIHadATail: lol
MSmits: didnt he also do a lot of chess?
AntiSquid: wonder if he managed to train a model that renders a 3D cube for him
AntiSquid: isn't cyberpunk the chess guy ?
IfIHadATail: I honestly can't wait 'til I am good enough to make bots for games. IDK why but that just sounds super fun to me
MSmits: I thought they both were, but might be wrong
AntiSquid: people get bored after a while IfIHadATail, or they try to learn new things while still being on CG every now and then
MSmits: IfIHadATail it is super fun, but there isn't a clear line where you can say you are "good enough"
MSmits: dont put the bar too high
MSmits: sometimes a few lines of code can get you halfway up the ladder in some games
AntiSquid: IfIHadATail not sure what you mean by good enough, you just do, fail, correct the mistakes, do some more, fail, read forums about post mortems, fail again ...
IfIHadATail: well I mean like making bots for actual games
AntiSquid: ya even that
MSmits: oh outside CG?
AntiSquid: same approach
IfIHadATail: yeah : )
AntiSquid: google a tutorial
IfIHadATail: well I don't know how to get my code to interact with the games lol
AntiSquid: and follow along, google another tutorial ...
BenVlodgi: I'm working on AI for an actual game, but taking a break to play CSB here xD
AntiSquid: eventually you get an idea
IfIHadATail: and I can't for the life of me find out how
MSmits: IfIHadATail I learned most of my coding writing mods for space engineers. Its awesome for learning how to code
MSmits: and it's physics
AntiSquid: start with "google dino bot" i think that's simple enough
MSmits: and there's metal too
MSmits: is that the cactus jumping thing?
IfIHadATail: and it'll tell me how to control other programs with my program? that is seriously the wall I can't get over right now
MSmits: control other programs with your program?
MSmits: how do you mean exactly?
Uljahn: like with autohotkey?
MSmits: do you mean the bot interfacing with the controls of a game?
MSmits: like an auto-aim bot in a shoot em up?
IfIHadATail: yeah like I want to write program that reads the state of a game makes calculations and then outputs controls
IfIHadATail: IDK if like an aim-bot
MSmits: ahh well, in some games they give you an API
MSmits: and it's just a matter of using the right commands
MSmits: space engineers has an API. You could a ship there, mine craft-like and then write code to fly it automatically, using C#
MSmits: build a ship i mean
IfIHadATail: well like I want to be able to make a bot that can play Gradius for NES
AntiSquid: IfIHadATail which kind of games do you want to write a bot for? you could use a macro editor for repetitive tasks type of games ... then move on to autoit or whatever the name was ... there are so many programs and frameworks to work with for bot creation
MSmits: ahh, well there's probably some helpful tools to interface with those
firecraftgaming: Were do I see how many times i have won?
MSmits: won what?
IfIHadATail: IDK I know Java, some kotlin and some Lua and I am completely lost on the subject lol
MSmits: clash of code?
firecraftgaming: won clash of code
MSmits: dont think you can see it, you can see how many clashes you played, your ranking and rating
MSmits: also, winning a clash means you're 1st right? But you also gain rating being 2nd, usually
firecraftgaming: yeah but i want to see my win rate if its possible
MSmits: or 3rd even
AntiSquid: you can probably code some bot that looks for specific pixels or icons on the screen to do a nes bot, just google it
MSmits: winrate is unclear when there's no clear definition of winning
firecraftgaming: came 1 place
MSmits: i dont think you can see that
firecraftgaming: ok thanks anyway
IfIHadATail: hmm okay I'll look into the pixel thing
AntiSquid: for browser game bots, there are other tutorials out there, involves a few api calls but not too difficult
MSmits: don't stare too hard into the pixel thing
MSmits: it might stare back...
**MSmits is laughing at his own joke
IfIHadATail: also is there terminology I should serch for for stuff like making the game window the active window and stuff like that?
Uljahn: also look into atari games in Openai gym
JBM: MSmits: now you get to explain it
MSmits: no no, that would be a double whammy
IfIHadATail: lol MSmits
MSmits: I already laughed at my own joke, if i explain it also, it would be really bad
IfIHadATail: XD
IfIHadATail: lol thanks guys I'll start my search again with this new info and motivation. thanks! : )
MSmits: have fun :)
AntiSquid: MSmits overlooking cellular automata
AntiSquid: reply to "msmits laughs at own joke"
MSmits: I miss the reference :(
AntiSquid: stuff like this:
https://youtu.be/1NYxII0HS9M?t=37
AntiSquid: pixels doing stuff
MSmits: ahh hright
AntiSquid: now MSmits feeling unsafe in front of the screen
MSmits: already was, there's mosquitos
MSmits: I have my little electrocution device near me though
AntiSquid: lol
MSmits: extremely hot today, left window open too long
MSmits: also I blame jacek
AntiSquid: had a bit of rain here
AntiSquid: jacek's rain dance failed you?
MSmits: I let my meta mcts too long to beat his bots and thats partially why it's hot
MSmits: havent tried the dance yet
MSmits: but it's supposed to rain tomorrow
MSmits: :fingers_crossed:
MSmits: I should finish my floodfill for samegame
DoxLee: can i share my solution on github ?
DoxLee: for puzzles
MSmits: preferably not
MSmits: people have done it before and not gotten banned, but you're not really supposed to
MSmits: it's worse if it's for multiplayer competitive bots, especially if they're good
MSmits: they lead to multiple players stealing your bot and submitting it
MSmits: if you do it during a contest you do get disqualified
DoxLee: i just wanto ask just because i know a guy who is sharing solutions for othersites
MSmits: yes it happens
MSmits: usually the best players dont do it
MSmits: what i find on google is usually pretty bad, but sure you'll find some easy puzzle solutions and some old bots
DoxLee: okey u right
DoxLee: im just braindead for today
DoxLee: how can i learn how fast my code
MSmits: how fast?
DoxLee: y
DoxLee: performance of code
DoxLee: sorry for bad english
MSmits: hmm
MSmits: you mean compared to other players?
DoxLee: i just want to know which way is better
MSmits: ohhh
MSmits: use timing functions
MSmits: do things in different ways and see which gives a shorter time
MSmits: each language has its own
MSmits: timing functions I mean
MSmits: python -> import time
MSmits: C# -> Stopwatch class
MSmits: etc.
DoxLee: javscipt :D
DoxLee: im actually too new for programing
DoxLee: just 3 month
DoxLee: sry for basic questions
MSmits: dont know what to do in js, but you can google it
MSmits: or someone here may tell you
MSmits: but its quiet time
DoxLee: thank you
DoxLee: may i ask one more questions
DoxLee: i actually asked :ASDSA
DoxLee: okey im gone ty :D
MSmits: you can always ask
DoxLee: thank you
JBM: ok, native anglophones, above <=> hereabove; under <=> hereunder; BENEATH <=> ???
JBM: strange how there's suddenly no american left despite it being their TZ
nopnop: hi, i'm new, how can i send a mp to someone ?
JBM: that's not going to help your newlyness
SPDene: what's mp?
nopnop: private message
JBM: military police
SPDene: click on their name to open a new tab
nopnop: yes but he doesn't speak in the chatroom
JBM: make him
SPDene: log on to facebook and message him there instead?
JBM: what's fb?
SPDene: foreign body?
iloveyii: Hi world !
JBM: Password:
SPDene: hunter2
JBM: oh, stars
JBM: the usual
dominggo: >?<
Andriamanitra: ahhhh why can't it show the title of the clash afterwards
Andriamanitra: just had another one of these where the test cases don't match validators and now it will forever bother me what i did wrong
JBM: 1-star rating
JBM: that'll show it
Andriamanitra: wdym
Fougere: Ok anybody know which JS do I kill to get rid of autocomplete please?
JBM: I wish I knew!
Gorbit99: there's a css trick apparently, but it didn't work for me specifically
Gorbit99: test injecting ".editor-widget { display: none; }" into the css
Gorbit99: Fougere
Fougere: Doesn’t work for me either, the autocomplete popup doesn’t show up but it does its thing anyway if I press Return.
Gorbit99: yup, just like me
Fougere: :(
Gorbit99: I'm sure there's a way to kill it, probably with an event or something
Gorbit99: the editor is called monaco if you want to do some tinkering
Gorbit99: seems like it uses vscode as the base
Gorbit99: hmm, apparently setTimeout(() => editor.trigger(, 'hideSuggestWidget', null)
Allis: Nice.
Gorbit99: I'm testing it
Gorbit99: just have to find out what the editor variable is called
Always_on_road: I meet a problem, I do not know how to make a security check when join the " clash of code ", is there anyone could help?
Andriamanitra: you've been exposed as a robot and i'd rather not help your kind to take over the world
Always_on_road: But why? I just don' t understand
tutubalin: Clash of Code is overtaken by bots like BitWolf, Tychkorg, BSoD and others.
brimonk: Woah, you mean I'm beating bots? Amazing.
tutubalin: In order to enter CoC you need to prove you are a bot.
brimonk: wait
brimonk: uh oh
jrke: hey you need to prove you are not a bot
tutubalin: Bots don't like strangers
tutubalin: So at least you need to pretend you're a bot until they accept you
tutubalin: https://www.codingame.com/leaderboards/clash/global?column=clashescount&value=DECREASING
Lvl 7 users with 40k+ clashes on top of leaderboard are bots.
zheheng: any idea why people dont share their codes?
alirezadigi2:
