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Haiit99: hi

Default avatar.png pydlv: helllooooo

Default avatar.png pydlv: haiitt

Haiit99: your code so good

Default avatar.png pydlv: thank you ^.^

Haiit99: I must cook for lunch

Haiit99: see you later

Haiit99: bye

Default avatar.png pydlv: Goodbye, enjoy lunch!

OverCode: :grimacing:

aliu: ☺️

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crix443_13LOOD_1N_13LOOD_OUT: moin b

Default avatar.png KrasserTyp: moin C

crix443_13LOOD_1N_13LOOD_OUT: 187

Default avatar.png KrasserTyp: ja

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Default avatar.png KrasserTyp: :zzz:

Default avatar.png KrasserTyp: :wheelchair:


Default avatar.png KrasserTyp: WE GON SHOOT IF U AINT STOPPIN NOW

crix443_13LOOD_1N_13LOOD_OUT: GAN GANG

crix443_13LOOD_1N_13LOOD_OUT: :imp:

Default avatar.png KrasserTyp: :fist_tone5::fist_tone5::open_hands_tone5:

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PMB.187: einfach Orangensaft

Default avatar.png KrasserTyp: ORANGENSAFT

PMB.187: 187

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crix443_13LOOD_1N_13LOOD_OUT: yes

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TrungNB2404: hi hi

TrungNB2404: i am form vietnam

TrungNB2404: from

JuliaPhan: HI trung

Default avatar.png mlllll: :nauseated_face:

crix443_13LOOD_1N_13LOOD_OUT: @TrungNB2404 u wann buy IphoneX for Cheap?

crix443_13LOOD_1N_13LOOD_OUT: :kissing_heart:

crix443_13LOOD_1N_13LOOD_OUT: HE



crix443_13LOOD_1N_13LOOD_OUT: FICK

crix443_13LOOD_1N_13LOOD_OUT: DICH

crix443_13LOOD_1N_13LOOD_OUT: System.out.println("1");

bad-Trevor: Yes

crix443_13LOOD_1N_13LOOD_OUT: NO

Default avatar.png Raghuveer: No

WINWINWIN: Pls don't advertise crix443_13LOOD_1N_13LOOD_OUT

bad-Trevor: Fuck last question was very tough in the clash

JoJo5: yes

JoJo5: yes

JoJo5: yes

JuliaPhan: from viet nam with love

ZadeTheExplorer: <3

ZadeTheExplorer: ewfew

Default avatar.png DatNc: alo

andrewj: codinggame lua engine make me mad

andrewj: >output expects 1

andrewj: >code outputs 1.0

andrewj: >test case fails

ZadeTheExplorer: alo

ZadeTheExplorer: =))

andrewj: hello

Default avatar.png OoO: o.O

Default avatar.png OoO: :open_mouth:

JuliaPhan: Bạn nào ở Hà nội không ạ

ZadeTheExplorer: minh

JuliaPhan: hi cậu

ZadeTheExplorer: ban o khu nao?

ZadeTheExplorer: con gai code gioi the =))

JuliaPhan: Hoàng quốc việt

ZadeTheExplorer: oi vl

ZadeTheExplorer: gan roi

ZadeTheExplorer: nha minh o Nguyen Khanh Toan

ZadeTheExplorer: =))

ZadeTheExplorer: private message nhe

TyLuu: pls join #vn

Default avatar.png HoangThien: cú có gai đấy bạn

ZadeTheExplorer: =)) so that

JuliaPhan: Nope bro Thiện

JuliaPhan: thiện là ai thế ạ

Default avatar.png HoangThien: làm game bạn ơi

ZadeTheExplorer: moi`

ZadeTheExplorer: xong mời t với

JuliaPhan: zô đi ạ

WINWINWIN: Hi JuliaPhan, HoangThien, ZadeTheExplorer, since no one other than those from Vietnam can understand your chats. Can you move over to your country chat?

JuliaPhan: i'm sorry

WINWINWIN: Like people from India have #In , France has #Fr

WINWINWIN: No problem JuliaPhan


Default avatar.png HoangThien: Can you learn VietNam language to speak with us :v

JuliaPhan: OMG, poor HoangThien

WINWINWIN: :D I can barely understand some of my own country languages :P

TrungNB2404: ai Việt Nam ko

[CG]Thibaud: kicked

[CG]Thibaud: thanks WINWINWIN for the gentle message

WINWINWIN: Welcome [CG]Thibaud

Astrobytes: These guys are here most mornings

Astrobytes: (Good morning btw :) )

WINWINWIN: Good morning Astrobytes :)

[CG]Thibaud: would you 2 like to have moderation rights here?

Astrobytes: Well, might not be a bad idea, I'm logged in pretty much all the time while I'm not a sleep

WINWINWIN: I dont think I would be able to tell when to use, so probably better to give more experienced people/

Default avatar.png geekpius: hi

Default avatar.png geekpius: am new here

WINWINWIN: Hi geekpius

PkZ: is there a proper way to fix found end of line expected Nothing in puzzles? my current method is writing an if if its the last element

WINWINWIN: I think that you have a print() that prints nothing somewhere?

Astrobytes: Or it could be another error elsewhere which results in nothing , hard to say without more information

PkZ: I was printing a new line where it expected to end

PkZ: I guess thats my bad

Astrobytes: Don't worry, it happens :)

[CG]Thibaud: it seems to me WINWINWIN that you handled well the case above, that's why I offered it

WINWINWIN: Ok, let me try it :) but if you think that I am not doing properly please advise.

Astrobytes: I agree WINWINWIN, diplomacy comes first ;)

WINWINWIN: Thanks Astrobytes :)

[CG]Thibaud: :) I'll try to add more than 5 more moderators so we don't have the issues discussed on Discord two days ago. Would you recommend someone?

WINWINWIN: If you decide to make me a mod, thanks for the opportunity [CG]Thibaud :)

Astrobytes: euler still doesn't have mod rights on chat, only on discord, perhaps he might?

[CG]Thibaud: oh right

WINWINWIN: What about struct or jacek?

Astrobytes: struct might do it, not sure if jacek would

Astrobytes: But he might, worth an ask I guess

Astrobytes: brb, afk 5 min

[CG]Thibaud: kk

WINWINWIN: [CG]Thibaud I just saw that adding a moderator willl require a reboot of chat. So when are you planning on adding mods?

Astrobytes: back, sorry, phonecall

[CG]Thibaud: when I have enough candidates

Astrobytes: dbdr or robo maybe?

dbdr: I apply :)

Astrobytes: :)

Astrobytes: RoboStac?

[CG]Thibaud: :+1:

WINWINWIN: Will you post the list on discord once you decide?

[CG]Thibaud: y

WINWINWIN: ok, thanks

dbdr: it's the Maiden's Feasts :D


dbdr: you know the reference?

WINWINWIN: Heard it in scchool sometime...

WINWINWIN: something about killing the best guys?

dbdr: I might not know that one :D

dbdr: was thinking of


inoryy: [CG]Thibaud while you're at it, it seems ru channel is missing a mod since MadKnight disappeared. Uljahn would be a good candidate imo

Astrobytes: Uljahn for here too if he wants

Astrobytes: good suggestion

inoryy: I think he would get world mod along with ru anyway, right?

dbdr: we need to organize a rescue mission for MadKnight too

Astrobytes: I guess yeah, duh :)

Astrobytes: He's become one with the pods dbdr

dbdr: lol

WINWINWIN: :D and if possible add a mod for #In? Some guy logged in and kept advertising some very clear schemes.

[CG]Thibaud: y

[CG]Thibaud: to Uljahn

Default avatar.png JBM: Mmmm, nice morning spam run

Default avatar.png JBM: Talking about Maddy, what are the news, beyond the "he vanished" part?

Astrobytes: I think that's about it. Last couple of times I saw him online he was getting a bit tetchy about his association with CSB...

Astrobytes: *'perceived' association with CSB


dbdr: dernier message il me semble

dbdr: **MadKnight quits

dbdr: sorry, last meesage I think

Astrobytes: :flag_fr:

dbdr: I fixed it :)

Astrobytes: lol so I see :D Wow, so he actually did just quit then and there

dbdr: :/

Astrobytes: It seems peculiar that the Troll of Trolls would get lightly trolled into quitting

dbdr: well, hard to know what went on

Astrobytes: Can't imagine anybody just being nasty to Maddy

Default avatar.png JBM: Could be as simple as exam season followed by forgot to log back in, switched to some other interest without noticing

Default avatar.png JBM: Still, his absence is felt, and I worry

Astrobytes: Nah Maddy would forget to log back in, and even during exam season he always popped in here and there

Astrobytes: *wouldn't

Astrobytes: Place isn't quite the same without him

struct: hello

struct: Astrobytes

struct: "struct might do it, not sure if jacek would"

Astrobytes: Hi struct, yeah Thibaud's looking for mods and WINWINWIN nominated you if you were interested

Default avatar.png JBM: So anyway, I wouldn't want to step into harassment/stalking territory, but a simple "he's alive and well" from anyone who'd know him more personally would be appreciated

struct: JBM I can ask him in discord

struct: I dont know Astrobytes

Astrobytes: No pressure struct

Default avatar.png JBM: Is he still there?

struct: He is online and playing a game

Default avatar.png JBM: Oh ok

Default avatar.png JBM: Well that's all I needed, thanks

Astrobytes: He left us for gaming :(

Default avatar.png JBM: Who'd blame him? :-P

Astrobytes: :grin:

struct: I don't know him personally though, I played a few games with him, but not much besides taht

DomiKo: omg

DomiKo: i reach like 30K on second turn in UTTT

DomiKo: and still cant beat MightyCarlo

DomiKo: so sad :(

Astrobytes: Definitely sounds like a bug

DomiKo: yea :/

Astrobytes: Debugging MCTS is always really fun

DomiKo: i know

DomiKo: 3 days now :joy:

Astrobytes: lol, jeez :D

DomiKo: from top150 gold now i reach like top40

DomiKo: so iam going somewhere

Astrobytes: Ah well, definite improvement then

Astrobytes: I'm sure you'll find the issue soon enough

Astrobytes: Probably a wrong sign or something suitably subtle and annoying

DomiKo: yesterday i found bug with results of game

DomiKo: like

DomiKo: tie X X

DomiKo: i sad that was X win

DomiKo: :(

Astrobytes: Easy mistake to make, at least you found it

DomiKo: currently 21 gold and 78% winrate

DomiKo: i feel really happy

DomiKo: :grimacing:

Astrobytes: Keep doing what you're doing and you'll crack Legend soon enough

Astrobytes: brb, afk 5 mins

MSmits: found another bug in my oware sim lol

MSmits: thats another thing a meta mcts will do for you, better sim-debugging

Astrobytes: What was it this time?

MSmits: it was a part of the weird thing i do to store the overflow on 31+ seed pits

MSmits: it worked correctly for 11 pits, but my mask was not long enough for the 12th pit, so it ignored that one when it was overflowing

Astrobytes: Oh right, that's error-prone at the best of times

MSmits: yeah

Astrobytes: That's actually why I didn't switch to bitboards for Oware

MSmits: so the 12th pit overflowed into the 61th bit which meant it became empty. Then when i tried to look up the 15 seed end game database that 61th bit was still set, causing an error because the key wasnt in the database

MSmits: you can imagine how fun that bug was to find

Astrobytes: Nice! Very hard to spot that

Astrobytes: Total nightmare

MSmits: yeah, i had to track it down by having my bot write the entire last simulated game to a text file

Astrobytes: And go through it by hand?

MSmits: it was not that hard to find once i did that because the 61th bit makes the board code longer

MSmits: it was the very last move

Astrobytes: hahaha brilliant :D

MSmits: but still not bug free on the meta mcts, backpropagating seed scores is also a nightmare

MSmits: because captures happen within the selection phase and you need to factor that into backpropagating

MSmits: lots of sign errors

Astrobytes: That sounds like a candidate for one of the things I would least like to bother doing

MSmits: oh right, i dont backpropagate win/loss/draw

MSmits: i backpropagate seedscores so i can use more transpositions

DomiKo: wow i found bug!!!

MSmits: grats :)

Astrobytes: gg!

DomiKo: did the same thing

DomiKo: simulation to file

DomiKo: not fun....

Astrobytes: What was it?

MSmits: well its much better than staring at the code for hours

MSmits: trust me i tried that too :P

DomiKo: i know :joy:

DomiKo: one mask in checking result wast correct

Astrobytes: Aha, well that would do it! Legend soon then?

DomiKo: i wish

Default avatar.png huangyidong999: I love this website, which help me a lotChat Log (talk):stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes:

jacek: ohai

struct: hi

MSmits: hey jacek

Astrobytes: Hello

MSmits: i noticed your succes on Onitama

MSmits: did you make a new bot, or did you improve the eval?

struct: Othello improved his skills

MSmits: thats what I thought

Astrobytes: jacekimax

Astrobytes: Or whatever he called it

MSmits: aww damnit, i cant get to top 2 in oware because they've been pushed too much :(

MSmits: time for submit spam?

Astrobytes: Be my guest

jacek: tweaked eval as well


MSmits: my last submit, bit weak vs robo (cg bench shows 47%

MSmits: rest is over 50%

MSmits: recurs e and agade have been pushed hard

Astrobytes: Are those winrates consistent?


MSmits: agade below 50% again, it fluctuates

Astrobytes: More games might even it out. Seems OK in a live submit

MSmits: yeah

MSmits: this is without any book yet though, i think fixing those two sim bugs helped a bit

MSmits: no more rare timeouts either

Illedan: Damn, that is a lot of draws :o

MSmits: vs agade yes

Illedan: Is Oware solvable?

Astrobytes: Nice. You're probably going to destroy everyone with that book

MSmits: Illedan yes and no

MSmits: awari is almost the same as oware abapa and solvable, but it resolves loops and oware abapa doesnt, so then it would be no

MSmits: however, there is a 200 turn limit

MSmits: so that would basically mean that it has 200x larger statespace at worst

MSmits: probably a lot less

MSmits: so yeah i think its solvable, but you'll need about 10-100 TB diskspace and a very smart memory strategy

eulerscheZahl: it's a plan

Washier: wow

RoboStac: have you spotted I submitted a new version yesterday in your benchmarking?

MSmits: ohh crap. no I havent

Illedan: :D

Astrobytes: lol

MSmits: you dont often resubmit

RoboStac: shouldn't be too different, but has a bit more performance and fixes some bugs

MSmits: for oware, not too different, means completely different

Astrobytes: Something you found whilst working on Othello robo?

RoboStac: well, it's the same nn in the background

RoboStac: yeah, keep finding things

MSmits: if i tweak one constant by 1%, my winrate against some player may go from 70% to 20%

RoboStac: found some fairly serious bugs in my training, but I don't think they affect oware much

MSmits: the thing is though, every time you retrain your NN, you get a different bot

MSmits: that makes different decisions

RoboStac: yeah, but I'm saying I've not retrained it

MSmits: ohh ok

RoboStac: that'll come when I get bored with othello

RoboStac: :)

MSmits: sure

eulerscheZahl: meanwhile royale is playing checkers

Astrobytes: Just to keep #1 :D

MSmits: I'm gonna have to refit my bots params also, once i have a book I think. I think that currently, the optimal value of a param may be pivoting around one single early game decision or something

eulerscheZahl: might be :D

MSmits: its fun to see eulerscheZahl. So hey I heard you need a better uttt bot and a yavalath both to up your cp, do let me know :)

MSmits: i can give some easy tips

MSmits: just have to get past the "its not fun for me part"

MSmits: I bet it would be more fun than botg

eulerscheZahl: i hated BotG, so that's easy :P

darkhorse64: Trying to get eulerscheZahl to the dark side of C# ....

WINWINWIN: Lots of competition for the top spot :)

eulerscheZahl: i have some teapot code to study and improve my bots

MSmits: I think i can help euler with those games even without getting him to c++

MSmits: its not all about performance

eulerscheZahl: it's also about clever scoring ideas

MSmits: yea

MSmits: pruning and such

MSmits: heuristics

darkhorse64: Some teapot code ? My vaults are not safe ?

MSmits: i would never share teapot code

jacek: i should start reimplemeting pool node thingy for tree search. im still using the one i first create for my early attempts

MSmits: but i use many of the same ideas as the teapot

MSmits: hmm

jacek: now that tree traversal became more expensive than my "rollouts"

MSmits: are there many ways to implement a node pool?

eulerscheZahl: but during the week i have little motivation to do more coding after my regular job

eulerscheZahl: and i have a different weekend project for now

MSmits: I get that euler, same here. I only code a lot now because of summer vacation

Astrobytes: :spy:

eulerscheZahl: i'm more active during my vacation too

eulerscheZahl: or back when i was still a student at university

MSmits: I couldnt code back then =/

jacek: computers didnt exists yet?

eulerscheZahl: you are a student right now :P

MSmits: oh right!

Astrobytes: jacek bringing the insults :D

MSmits: jacek not for me no, just as gaming machines :)

MSmits: I do two classes coming schoolyear that are not about teaching

MSmits: Game design and functional programming

MSmits: will be fun i think

MSmits: i think for game design i get to fiddle with unity, which i already know somewhat

eulerscheZahl: did 1 project with unity years ago

MSmits: cool what was it?

eulerscheZahl: reimplemented the game "SkyRoads"

eulerscheZahl: was for a class about interactivity. so you were supposed to jump around to control the ship

MSmits: ohh right

Astrobytes: skyroads! Blast from the past

eulerscheZahl: my part of the project was the game, got that working

MSmits: someone else did the jumping?

Astrobytes: :d

eulerscheZahl: the one responsible for the jumping sucked

eulerscheZahl: so you can only play it with the keyboard

Astrobytes: Shame, that would've been fun

MSmits: yeah

eulerscheZahl: but i even found a wiki entry about the file format of the original levels

eulerscheZahl: and managed to parse it and load them

Astrobytes: Nice

MSmits: cool

eulerscheZahl: i don't have unity installed anymore. i wonder if i can still find the project code

MSmits: if you didnt try to delete it it should be around somewhere

MSmits: if you uninstall i dont think it removes projects

MSmits: its gonna be hopelessly outdated of course

MSmits: might need older versions of unity to run it

eulerscheZahl: found some old code to use a USB-scope

MSmits: huh


eulerscheZahl: prof hated the software delivered with it, so he gave the task to write a new one

eulerscheZahl: oscilloscope software

MSmits: usb scope is to point at the screen and get coords, like with a mouse?

Astrobytes: Pretty neat, I didn't know those existed

MSmits: I shot ducks on Nintendo, same thing

eulerscheZahl: you can measure analog signals like with oscilloscopes

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: can I do something like 8! in C#

eulerscheZahl: and retrieve them via USB

MSmits: oh, seems different

MSmits: so no duck shooting with that

Astrobytes: lol no

Astrobytes: Would be handy in a classroom environment

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: also, how do you call the ! in math

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: like when you do 8! it's 8,7,6,5,4,3,2,1

Hjax: factorial?

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: that's it!

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: thanks

Astrobytes: You have to implement your own efficient factorial algorithm

Astrobytes: afaik there's no builtin factorial method

Astrobytes: Hi Hjax

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: I make my code "purposely" shit

eulerscheZahl: found it, sorry for German

Hjax: hi Astrobytes, othello seems to be becoming more active

eulerscheZahl: code is linked at the bottom (Quellcode = source code)

Hjax: i need to get my eval going lol

Astrobytes: Yeah! I'll hopefully have a new version soon too

Hjax: ive just been lazy because i need to write a bunch of stuff before i see results

Astrobytes: Really wish you'd have been able to get the Kinect version working eulerscheZahl, that'd have been really cool

Hjax: still havent written a local game runner

Astrobytes: Nor I, laziness

eulerscheZahl: also our prof insisting in using specific technology. e.g. OSC for process communication instead of doing all in unity

MSmits: Hjax, if your bots have solvers, you dont need a local game runner

Hjax: O_o

eulerscheZahl: he wasn't even happy about our unity choice, wanted us to use the Blender game engine

MSmits: you just trust it to have won when it says "WIN"

Hjax: lol

eulerscheZahl: which is deprecated now afaik :D

MSmits: I did it, its a nice hack :P

Hjax: if self.turn == 1: sys.stderr.write("WIN")

MSmits: Blender over unity.... madness

Astrobytes: lol, OSC as in Open Sound Control?

MSmits: Hjax, you have to resist the urge to cheat against yourself :P

eulerscheZahl: yes. you can send x,y,z over it too

Astrobytes: Hm, never seen it used for that purpose before. Why not just in Unity tho? Just to learn something else?

eulerscheZahl: yes

eulerscheZahl: and the final presentation was fun

eulerscheZahl: other student played it with keyboard and got close to the end of the level

eulerscheZahl: then just jumped over the target and failed. because we haven't implemented a "you win" situation

eulerscheZahl: so to cover it up, we agreed to lose intentionally

Astrobytes: lol, how deeply unsatisfying that would have been :D

Astrobytes: Great strategy there

eulerscheZahl: but his way of failing looked so completely retarded :rofl:

Astrobytes: lol

MSmits: should have hired a good actor

MSmits: well this is probably going to be my class as well, something like this

MSmits: hope I dont get paired with some bad jumping, crap acting loser

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: wait

MSmits: for?

Astrobytes: it

eulerscheZahl: i hated group projects in university

MSmits: same

Washier: haha

Astrobytes: same

eulerscheZahl: hard to motivate the team to do anything

MSmits: you suck as a cheerleader

Washier: sure it was hard to keep up with the likes of you

Astrobytes: Always getting lumped with the lazy ones

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: so since factorial of 8! is 8*7*6*5*4*3*2*1, is there something that is called for giving just the numbers instead of doing operations?

MSmits: I give students group projects all the time

MSmits: even though I hate them myself

MSmits: does that make me evil?

eulerscheZahl: in pari-gp you can type 8! directly

Astrobytes: heavygabriel in C# you have to write it yourself

eulerscheZahl: it makes you sadistic

MSmits: ah ok

MSmits: good distinction

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: I'm talking about the math function

Astrobytes: lol

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: not even programming

eulerscheZahl: let's LINQ the factorial

Washier: ouch

eulerscheZahl: Enumerable.Range(1,8).Aggregate((a,b) => a*b)

Astrobytes: Succinct

Washier: i mean ouch when its code golf

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: nah because I just asked what factorial was to try and get the numbers that precede 8

eulerscheZahl: make random teams MSmits. don't allow them to team up with their friends

Washier: that is evil

Hjax: i usually didnt have a lot of friends in my classes

Hjax: so i liked random teams :D

eulerscheZahl: same .D

eulerscheZahl: :D

Astrobytes: In highschool there were certain people you wouldn't have put in the same team, or we'd get nothing done

Washier: true, helped me too. but >3d year you have your buds

Astrobytes: I hate everyone by default anyway so uni was OK :P

Washier: haha

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: MSmits wait what are you teaching in your classes?

MSmits: physics mostly, but I am trying to get more into CS teaching

MSmits: eulerscheZahl good idea, i know some colleagues do that

eulerscheZahl: they LINQ their factorials? :o

Washier: that's awesome. all technical education should have some CS in it me thinks

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: One thing that I've always thought that could be a good course or a lesson is the DHMO site

Astrobytes: :D

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: thingy

MSmits: no, the random team bit :P

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: makes you learn to fact check stuff

Default avatar.png heavygabriel:

MSmits: ohh a site with fake news about water?

eulerscheZahl: a website about water?

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: no

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: it's not fake news

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: it's facts but like there's no context

MSmits: alternative facts?

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: no

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: it's true facts

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: though

eulerscheZahl: i vaguely remember

MSmits: aha

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: "DHMO is a constituent of many known toxic substances, diseases and disease-causing agents, environmental hazards and can even be lethal to humans in quantities as small as a thimbleful."

eulerscheZahl: a campaign to see how dump people behave with incomplete information

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: these things are all true

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: yeah

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: and I think it's important to show that to students

Astrobytes: yeah, it's a classic

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: to make them think about what they see

MSmits: it's cool

MSmits: I could use this

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: to research and not take everything on face value

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: and I think this is an important lesson.

MSmits: definitely

Hjax: i saw someone did a survey on if we should ban the teaching of Arabic numerals in schools

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: LOL

Hjax: and a disturbing amount of people said yes

Astrobytes: loool

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: that's cringe

Astrobytes: Dear oh dear

eulerscheZahl: can we get rid of Latin letters as well?

eulerscheZahl: Latin is dead

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: It's like the first thing you learn when searching numbers

dbdr: perfect combo

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: wait is é cyrillic

dbdr: can we still speak in morse then?

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: or something?

Washier: jeepers. i get it now. deep

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: wtf it is latin?

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: how

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: and MSmits, what grades are you teaching physics to?

eulerscheZahl: 16-18 year old students

eulerscheZahl: and he's good at lip reading, which students don't always like

dbdr: eulerscheZahl: you wrote from the wrong alt

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: wait so he could basically be my teacher?

eulerscheZahl: ?

dbdr: you were supposed to answer using your MSmits alt

Astrobytes: And his real name is Walter White

Hjax: i choose to believe smits look exactly like his profile picture

eulerscheZahl: MSmits isn't my alt. i'm Illedan

Astrobytes: lol

dbdr: muddying the waters :D

MSmits: lol

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: TBH at the start of the new class year I'm gonna talk to my teacher with the DHMO thingy

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: since she forgot

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: to do it

MSmits: heavygabriel grades dont mean much internationally, but my students are 16-18 years old usually and at highests level of education we teach in our school

MSmits: oh euler already answered

MSmits: damn

MSmits: i should read better

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: tbh I am international(IE outside of the US)

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: I am outside the US*

Hjax: most people on this site are not from the US

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: so I get it

MSmits: here international means outside France

Hjax: france is probably the biggest country

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: wow

MSmits: CG is a French company

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: wait so that's why the french thingies are good

MSmits: lots of sponsored contests for other French companies draw more players from France

Legerocky: who is the kamdym dude. He seemed to follow everyone?

Astrobytes: The French thingies? :D

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: I'm not from france but I'm outside the US

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: legit canadian

MSmits: cool

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: french thingies= french translation/ words

Astrobytes: ah

MSmits: did anyone watch a lot of Pitch Meetings for movies on you tube?

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: also the DHMo thing

MSmits: I did lately

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: it's in french

Astrobytes: Ah Canadian eh, gotta grab the moose by the antlers eh MSmits

MSmits: lol right

Washier: haha

Default avatar.png heavygabriel:

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: don't mock how I speak

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: eh is legit a substitude to what I say in french

Astrobytes: No no, it was a reference to something in chat from a while back heavygabriel

Astrobytes: And I use eh because I'm Scottish ;)

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: I said that in a non-serious manner

Washier: i'm not mocking. im south african, should here my accent, full of things like that

MSmits: thats impossible

Astrobytes: And I also say "aboot"

MSmits: you're Canadian

Washier: haha

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: I USED IT IN A NON-SERIOUS MANNER

MSmits: allright :P

Washier: thanks eh


Default avatar.png heavygabriel: btw there's a region of Canada

Hjax: i just have a boring general american accent

Astrobytes: :D

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: that is very old

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: legit 400 years old

MSmits: i think they're all about 4.5 billion years old

Astrobytes: Nova Scotia?

Washier: haha

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: wait what?

Astrobytes: lol MSmits

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: the first part that was inhabited by europeans

Washier: Nova Scotia peeps have very oirish accent

Astrobytes: Yes, lots of Scots and Irish went there in the early 1800s

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: btw can we talk about how newfoundland in english and french are totally different

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: like one is newfoundland

Washier: they eat moose there? a lot of meat at least

Astrobytes: I always wished the plural of moose was meese

Astrobytes: And I cannot explain why

Washier: how is newfoundland in French pronounced?

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: nvm newfoundland is the smae

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: toirre nove

Washier: wow

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: it's butchered

Washier: that's also not being serious i hope

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: but it's like the best pronounciation that I can get with like english words

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: it's not really pronounced like that but it does sound similar(a bit)

Astrobytes: Terre Neuve you mean?

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: yes

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: pronounced

Washier: Oh ok, new found land.

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: I thought you meant pronounciation

MSmits: its got to be the least imaginative name

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: not the word

Washier: French is really hard

Washier: Its descriptive

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: all languages are hard

MSmits: not all equally hard

Default avatar.png FLQ4: ok

Default avatar.png FLQ4: hi

MSmits: some languages have more exceptions to rules

Default avatar.png FLQ4: does anyone want to start a private match

MSmits: the languages with the most exceptions to rules are the hardest

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: ok all languages that are based from latin are generally equally hard

Default avatar.png FLQ4: ok

Default avatar.png FLQ4: but when you talk a lot in one language it becomes easy

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: that's why you immerse yaself

MSmits: Dutch has more exceptions than any other language. You can learn to speak it somewhat, fairly quickly. But it takes years not to sound like an idiot

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: use french subtitles

Washier: i speak Afrikaans and English, i can read Dutch no problem, bit harder is German but the rest is very hard.

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: and try to understand it

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: idk

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: what I did to learn english was to go online

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: and read stuff

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: in like 2 years I learned it

Washier: TV taught me English

MSmits: subtitled tv taught me the basics

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: roblox taught me the basics

Washier: Icelandic is hard

eulerscheZahl: my English teacher taught me English

MSmits: I never learned much in English class

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: yeah because you aren't immersed in english

MSmits: I was

Washier: Everyone can(should) speak C

MSmits: I was always playing RPGs with lots of text

eulerscheZahl: i definitely improved after school. movies, reading documentations, ...

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: nah but I mean in the general sense of the word

MSmits: English

DomiKo: #Washier Polish is hard

Default avatar.png FLQ4: i think japanese is the haredet

Washier: Can imagine Polish is hard

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: like the thing with almost all languages are if you don't have a good translator person/someone to ask questions on the language, it becomes really hard

Astrobytes: I guess which languages are difficult for you to learn depend on what your native language is

Washier: damn, I was wrong. Icelandic might be easier for me

MSmits: thats true Astrobytes

Washier: very

MSmits: but there is a more objective way to look at the difficulty of languages\

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: so that's why spanish is like "oh so it's french but different"

MSmits: and thats their structures, the number of rules you have to learn, the number of words and the number of exceptions to rules

Washier: NLP

Astrobytes: Fair

MSmits: children with no language at all will be fluent in some languages at 6

MSmits: and others only at 8

MSmits: Dutch is bad like that

Washier: How so?

MSmits: tons of exceptions

MSmits: you need to know for each word whether it is female or male, past tense differs for different words and such

Washier: for me they make sense, my mother tongue is derived from Dutch

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: so like a bit french?

MSmits: yeah, but worse I think

Washier: then again, we did away with a lot of those rules

MSmits: saw a talk about this where a lot of languages were compared

Astrobytes: Whereas English is so easy that I was reading Shakespeare in utero :P

MSmits: Washier good idea

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: I think I learned english at like 10-11

Washier: our language is about 100 years old though, so more hip ;)

MSmits: sounds weird to a Dutch person though

Astrobytes: Afrikaans is a mix of how many languages Washier? It came about through mining iirc?

Washier: Its 90% Dutch, 5% German, 4% English, 1% French if i have to guess

Astrobytes: It's a pretty cool language, I like how it sounds

Washier: I have long time Dutch penpall. We write in our own langs and understand all of it

Astrobytes: Nice

MSmits: yeah

Washier: Its guttural, and expressive.

MSmits: i have problems understanding it when its spoken though

MSmits: but reading it is easy

Washier: Like our rugby ;)

Astrobytes: hahaa :D

MSmits: Washier did you guys have a lot of protests like many countries do?

Washier: I think about the usuall amount

MSmits: ah ok

MSmits: We had a few, but nothing like in the US

Washier: Its spreading late, so holding thumbs

Hjax: i used to wish i lived in the city

Hjax: but this year im glad i dont

Astrobytes: Back when I was cheffing, my last head chef was SA, I acquired a love for biltong, bobotie and boerewors

MSmits: which one?

Washier: Yes, we didn't have any race related stuff really.

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: english is like "what if we made a language that cannot differenciate between you plural and singular, has the majority of verbs conjugate the same way etc."

Washier: Boerewors would be my last meal.

Hjax: me MSmits?

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: like you cannot differenciate between you(as in you all) and you

MSmits: yeah i just realized you meant any city :P

Astrobytes: I'm a veggie these days but that was a damn good sausage

Hjax: im like 2 hours from both Boston and NYC

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: you have to rely on language

MSmits: NY is a good place to be corona-wise though

Washier: true

MSmits: the rest of the country is screwed

Washier: Or New-Zealand

Hjax: the north east has everything under control now

Hjax: meanwhile florida has gone off the deep end

Washier: Florida is worrying

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: I am 8 hours away

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: or 600 km

Astrobytes: They lifted lockdown real ealry right?

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: away from boston

Astrobytes: *early

MSmits: a civilized country where people are refused medical care because no room

MSmits: GJ

Hjax: not just that, a lot of people in the south dont believe in the coronavirus, they think its some kind of hoax

Hjax: and therefore dont wear masks

Default avatar.png heavygabriel: and 8 hours away from ny

Washier: freedom apparantly

Hjax: and dont do any social distancing

Astrobytes: Yeah, that's very worrying

Washier: as if the rest of the world is not free.

MSmits: Italy had an excuse for this because there were more unknowns, the US has no excuse

Washier: Italy was overwhelmed quickly yes

MSmits: Spain too

Washier: And they have an aging population

Hjax: its politics that are inhibiting our response, the USA is more than capable of dealing with this

Washier: Same yes

Astrobytes: 100% Hjax

MSmits: physically capable yes

Washier: 100%

Hjax: we have the infrastructure and technology to support dealing with this, but if the people dont cooperate its pointless

Washier: You taking classes online now i hope

Hjax: me? oh im not in school anymore

Hjax: graduated a couple years ago

MSmits: seems like my oware meta mcts doesnt have obvious bugs anymore


Washier: oh good

MSmits: at least it expects move 5 is the best move after not many visits and expected seed count around 0 which is a draw

Hjax: which is another way of saying "my meta mcts only has subtle bugs that i will be cursing at later"

Astrobytes: Just subtle ones now MSmits

MSmits: yes :)

Astrobytes: lol

Hjax: beat you to it Astrobytes :P

Astrobytes: :D

MSmits: its such a hard to "see" game, I have no idea whether its suggesting good moves

MSmits: I guess i just need to run it for a while and see if my bot gets better

Astrobytes: Yeah, without manually playing out positions it's hard to gauge just by looking

Astrobytes: Go collect some stones and some egg cartons

MSmits: lol

struct: javascript is something special

Washier: is it better to work hard on one board game, or start as many as you can. I'm asking because oware sounds cool

MSmits: I work on very few

MSmits: because i like to dive deep into them

MSmits: but others play everything

MSmits: just do what is fun

Washier: ok ty

Astrobytes: Up to you really, doesn't take long to get up and running but in terms of focus only you can know that

Astrobytes: yeah, what Smits said :)

Washier: do you guys build frameworks, or take it one game at a time

Washier: guessing the answer is try both

MSmits: hmm I reuse a lot of code

Astrobytes: Definitely reuse lots of code

MSmits: the details change and the sim is always completely diffeent

MSmits: but mcts functions can be copied

MSmits: just gotta be careful about sign errors and such

Washier: ok ty

MSmits: in some games you're always player 1 (like in oware), or at least the board is sent to you as if you are p1

Astrobytes: And a general framework for you're bot with reading, error printing and stuff is handy

MSmits: and other games give you a player id

Astrobytes: *your bot

Hjax: i dont think ive reused any code between any of my bots

MSmits: you will at some point

Hjax: granted i now have bots in 3 different languages

Astrobytes: :)

Washier: i also like to take it on one at a time. one thing i need to do though, i think, is brush up my C.

Washier: and ditch the #

MSmits: why not just do c++

MSmits: get classes

Hjax: or join team rust and prevent people from testing against you :P

Hjax: (they really ought to fix that)

Washier: i've always liked C\C++ for the C stuff - the ++ part i dont like. might as well go # then

Washier: but thats just me.

MSmits: Hjax from what I understand it cant be fixed

MSmits: its inherent to Rust

Washier: Rust does look cool though

RoboStac: they can do release mode everywhere at the cost of having worse stack traces on crashes

Hjax: even if it was a flag that i could put at the top of the file

MSmits: ah right... but thats not really developer friendly

Hjax: to force release mode

Hjax: that would be fine

Washier: isn't C# in the IDE also in debug mode?

Hjax: yep

tomatoes: actually same stack traces :slight_smile:

Washier: figures

Hjax: having it be a flag we put in our code would be kind of a hack, but its better than nothing

MSmits: Washier C# you can use a trick to disable it

MSmits: not sure how it works, but you restart the main function without the flag i think

tomatoes: there was a poll in discord about release in ide for rust, so should be changed someday

MSmits: oh

Hjax: debug rust is roughly the speed of python, which is kind of amusing

MSmits: wow so slow

RoboStac: yeah, its a lovely mix of no optimisations and really expensive runtime checks

Hjax: yeah i get 7000 rollouts first move in othello in debug

Astrobytes: lol, good debug info though right?

Hjax: instead of the 500k i get normally

struct: this is how D tested vs rust

Hjax: would it be that hard for them to check if the source file contains some substring, and compile release if it does?

Hjax: the runtime debug checks are useful, it catches stuff like an integer underflow and throws a panic

Washier: MSmits, will check that out

Washier: 500k! holy smokes.

Hjax: they are depth 6 early terminated rollouts

Hjax: not full rollouts

Hjax: my bot prints the number of rollouts each turn as it plays

Hjax: usually its about 500k for turn 1, and 60k for other turns

Washier: cool thanks

Washier: Look, personally I'm very grateful for the ability to code in just about any lang - i come from kaggle where its python or bust

Astrobytes: :)

Washier: so a few quirks is forgivvable

Washier: *are forgivable.

Washier: awesome community too

Washier: hugs all around peeps ;)

Washier: socially distant hugs that is

Astrobytes: Yeah it's a good community :)

Astrobytes: *great

eulerscheZahl: and a big community during contests

Astrobytes: Oh yeah

Washier: yes. wish i was there for the pod racing one

Washier: what a game

eulerscheZahl: that was before my time too

Astrobytes: Same

Hjax: the first contest that held my attention was utg

eulerscheZahl: hypersonic here

eulerscheZahl: in october 2016

Hjax: but ooc and pacman werent as fun

Hjax: so i have high hopes for the fall contest

Astrobytes: This time, the whole contest will be hidden and you'll have to find it

eulerscheZahl: your first was platinum rift, Hjax

Washier: i thought ooc was great. but still learning

Hjax: it didnt hold my attention though

Hjax: i spent like an hour on it

eulerscheZahl: and left CG for years after that experience

Washier: I am partial to 2-player perfect info game must say

Hjax: i technically also played legends of code and magic

Hjax: but also only spent an hour or two on it

eulerscheZahl: both games are not in my top10

Washier: most good players i see did well with the pods

Washier: (high ranking)

Hjax: my csb bot is just the bare minimum to get most of the points

Hjax: that game isnt very interesting to me

Astrobytes: The physics-based games are definitely Marmite games

Hjax: ?

DomiKo: in csb you can get like 4K points with 3 lines

Hjax: yeah its depressing isnt it

DomiKo: yes it is

Astrobytes: Marmite, yeast-based spread that has the slogan "Love it or hate it" (Vegemite, same thing)

Hjax: ah

DomiKo: its depressing as top5 in gold in UTTT :(((

Astrobytes: You're top 5 now?

DomiKo: was second

Hjax: how is top 5 gold in uttt depressing? because is just vanilla mcts?

Astrobytes: Almost there! How many points below boss?

DomiKo: a lot

DomiKo: i can get like 80% winrate with boss

DomiKo: but 20% with the second guy

DomiKo: or 20, 50

Astrobytes: Well, you're in a much better place now since earlier at least ;)

DomiKo: i cant beat them both

DomiKo: yea

Hjax: you could pull the boss below the second guy

DomiKo: now i don't know if i have any more bugs or not xD

Hjax: promote the second guy to legend

Hjax: and then promote yourself :P

Astrobytes: Yeah, keep spam-submitting lol

DomiKo: that would be awesome

DomiKo: boss is really strong

DomiKo: have 2 point lead

tomatoes: did you try lower c constant?

DomiKo: yea

DomiKo: using standard 2

DomiKo: i reach like top10

DomiKo: i use like 0.8 i i reach top3

DomiKo: but that really weird

DomiKo: sometime i reach 40K on second move

DomiKo: and still lose to boss

Hjax: what constant are you using for othello tomatoes? still sqrt 2?

tomatoes: 2 without sqrt

Hjax: interesting

Hjax: thats stronger than sqrt2?

tomatoes: handcrafted :sweat_smile:

tomatoes: im not sure how to bench two versions

tomatoes: almost no random

Astrobytes: yeah, I ended up at 1 for my oware EPT after a lot of testing

dbdr: you can add artificial variability to do benching tomatoes

tomatoes: random move with some probability?

dbdr: yeah

dbdr: or not random but your second best

MSmits: the exploration parameter depends fully on the range of your node values

MSmits: if you score between 0 and 1 the param will be twice as small as when you score between -1 and 1

Washier: go Hjax

Hjax: i score between 0 and 1

MSmits: then your param will be small

Hjax: i just submitted a smaller constant to see what happens

MSmits: also, you can add a constant to all your node values and have the same bot

Hjax: 1 instead of sqrt 2

Washier: cool

MSmits: say, all your scores are between 14 anf 15

MSmits: -1 and 1 is most convenient imho

MSmits: because of sign symmetry between players

MSmits: 0 for draws

Hjax: right now my EPT treats all scores below 0 as a loss, and all scores above 0 as a win

Hjax: i feel like its probably better to turn them into win % rather than binary win / loss

DomiKo: Hjax you asked about vanila mcts?

yea it is.... have no idea right now how to use some heuristic

Hjax: have you tried the teccles heuristic

DomiKo: dont know what it is

Hjax: play the move that forces your opponent to play in the same miniboard you are playing in

Washier: is mcts generally more popular than minimax\alpa-beta

Hjax: it depends on the game @Washier

MSmits: but only do it when the board is empty

Washier: i mean on codingame

MSmits: teccles i mean

Washier: ty

MSmits: DomiKo watch any game my bot plays on the leaderboard when i am p1

MSmits: you will see teccles

DomiKo: hmmm interesting

Washier: teccles?

Hjax: teccles is a player on this site, havent seen him for a while

Hjax: but he came up with the idea

DomiKo: ohhh


Washier: wow, quite specific.

MSmits: check where all the crosses land

MSmits: then you'll understand it

DomiKo: i see MSmits

MSmits: it's not always the best move

DomiKo: so i i could do such move

MSmits: but it early game it certainly seems to be

DomiKo: should i always do it?

MSmits: i always do it

MSmits: but

MSmits: i know examples where it costs me the game

DomiKo: in like first 20 moves?

MSmits: that would be safer yes

DomiKo: or someting

MSmits: i never changed it to that, but its probably better

DomiKo: i will try it

MSmits: in late game some boards are toxic, you dont want to play on them because playing on them forces you to give the opponent a free move

Washier: so @MSmits, you study the particular game deeply.

Washier: ?

MSmits: so if you are able to play on an empty board, it might be better to send your opponent to such a toxic board

MSmits: i studied uttt a lot yeah

Washier: ty

MSmits: mostly by staring at meta mcts

DomiKo: meta mcts is like full mcts?

Hjax: meta mcts is mcts with the rollout replaced by a mcts program playing the game

MSmits: its a mcts where the rollout phase is a bot playing an entire game, with full calculation time for each turn

Hjax: its used for book building

MSmits: so a single rollout can be 1-3 seconds

Washier: mind blown. must eat dinner. have a good day\evening

MSmits: have a good dinner

MSmits: btw meta mcts is not just useful for book building. You can also discover good heuristics and such

tomatoes: there is some pdf's about meta-mcts

MSmits: teccles heuristic becomes pretty obvious with a meta mcts

MSmits: yeah i know tomatoes

MSmits: I mostly figured out my own way of doing it, not sure if its what they do

MSmits: theres a lot of little details to deal with also, like symmetry and transpositions

MSmits: thats not easy to combine with mcts

struct: omfg

MSmits: !

Astrobytes: :o

MSmits: :scream_cat:

Astrobytes: :scream:

MSmits: would be funny if that was the last thing he ever said on here

MSmits: we'd be wondering forever

Astrobytes: lol

Astrobytes: I'm guessing this is JS related struct

DomiKo: i have question to teccles

DomiKo: should i do that move with random propability?

MSmits: why

DomiKo: idk

DomiKo: i always make it

DomiKo: and its getting worst...

MSmits: you can use this heuristic in 3 possible ways afaik

struct: Yes Astrobytes

DomiKo: hmmm

struct: This is a pain to debug

MSmits: 1) just make the move instead of searching

struct: I dont think im supposed to do this in javascript

MSmits: 2) On expansion of a node, only consider this move so that your node will have 1 child

MSmits: 3) On random rollout also only consider this move when simulating

MSmits: try and see what works

jacek: i do the move, but search so i have something for tree reuse

MSmits: i think i do 1 and 2

MSmits: not sure about 3

MSmits: i just reset the tree

MSmits: if the opponent doesnt do it

MSmits: so i reset the tree alot

tomatoes: didnt your rollouts count was higher?

MSmits: whose rollout count?

tomatoes: domiko

DomiKo: submited without pragma....

MSmits: lol

DomiKo: lmao

MSmits: classic mistake

Astrobytes: :)

DomiKo: thanks tomatoes

DomiKo: 12K insted of 30K ....

MSmits: I like to paste my bot into the wrong language setting and submit without looking and lose every game :P

DomiKo: :joy:

MahdiSLM: its fucking hard

MahdiSLM: :D

MSmits: what is

jacek: thats what she said

Astrobytes: :smirk:

MahdiSLM: my brain blows out

MahdiSLM: what the fcking hell

Astrobytes: Might wanna see a doctor about that :P

MahdiSLM: yes sure

MahdiSLM: but i dont think that doctors can cure programmers

MahdiSLM: :|

DomiKo: double win with boss

DomiKo: maybe that's it

struct: im losing my mind

MSmits: that's lucky

MSmits: if you're still in the process, you know where it is, after you've lost it you're in trouble

MSmits: you never hear anyone say: "I'm losing my keys"

MSmits: that would be stupid

DomiKo: actually you're right


dbdr: it's a bit different because your mind is part of the "you" who is losing it

dbdr: my keys are losing themselves ;)

Hjax: mind losing is gradual, key losing is sudden

no39mz: hello some one want to talk

Default avatar.png Unstoppablefart: I just came from codecademy and thought I knew everything

Default avatar.png Unstoppablefart: now my brain is fucked

DomiKo: i know what you feel bro xD

WINWINWIN: Important, dont trust the other stuff circulating


WINWINWIN: Sorry, was meant to go in In chat. Please ignore.

Astrobytes: :)


jacek: :v

WINWINWIN: What does :v mean?

Astrobytes: It's jacek's actual face

Astrobytes: (I have no idea)


jacek: i like pacman face

Astrobytes: ahhh


Default avatar.png FLQ4: hi

Default avatar.png FLQ4: lol

Default avatar.png FLQ4: tychkorg is good


Default avatar.png FLQ4: hi

WINWINWIN: tychkorg is a bot :)

Default avatar.png FLQ4: ?

Default avatar.png FLQ4: is that why he alwats gets in my game

WINWINWIN: Yeah, he joins games with a low number of people

WINWINWIN: which happens pretty often.

Default avatar.png FLQ4: ok

Astrobytes: Check this article FLQ4, look for the "Codingame Official Bots" part:

Default avatar.png FLQ4: thanks

Default avatar.png FLQ4: btw

Astrobytes: no problem :)

Astrobytes: you're welcome

jacek: hey NN addicts, do you use bias in bots?

RoboStac: yes

jacek: does it really makes difference?

RoboStac: I've not tried without - as far as I'm aware removing it is more common on large networks

RoboStac: but I'm probably not the best person to ask about it as I'm in no way a NN specialist

Default avatar.png TwilightBeast_e7f0: Is anybody here?

jacek: good evening, Sir/Madam

Astrobytes: ask inoryy jacek

Default avatar.png TwilightBeast_e7f0: Hello! Could you, please, help me. I found really call solution for one of tasks, after that close it, and now can not find "brilliant" solutions. What should I do if I want to find it again?

Astrobytes: Clash or puzzle?

Default avatar.png TwilightBeast_e7f0: I only 15 minutes here... What the "KIRK'S QUEST" is?

Astrobytes: Hm, where did you find your solution?

jacek: the descent?

Default avatar.png TwilightBeast_e7f0: You're quite right!

Astrobytes: Kirk's Quest was the old name for it no?

Astrobytes: Oh it still shows it on the viewer

Default avatar.png TwilightBeast_e7f0: Sorry, Astrobytes! I submit my solution and after that cite suggest me to watch the best ones

Astrobytes: TwilightBeast_e7f0 Do you know how to find them?

tomatoes: left panel - results - browse other solutions?

Default avatar.png TwilightBeast_e7f0: It's the question :)

Astrobytes: Yes, what tomatoes said is how you will find them

Default avatar.png TwilightBeast_e7f0: Tomatoes, thank you so much!

Default avatar.png TwilightBeast_e7f0: As much, as any others! My gratitude

Astrobytes: Any time you solve a puzzle you can always check other solutions but only in the language you solved in btw

Default avatar.png TwilightBeast_e7f0: No spoilers?)\

Astrobytes: There are Hints for some of the easy puzzles but no solutions until you finish )

Default avatar.png TwilightBeast_e7f0: Oh, thank you!

jacek: ok, learning my MLP seems to be working. in oware 4-ply vs 4-ply i get 73% winrate. dunno how it scales. too bad its 20x slower for now

Astrobytes: 'MLP'

Astrobytes: gj tho

jacek: maybe friendship really is magic

Astrobytes: :scream_cat:

jacek: :racehorse:

Zenoscave: dbdr I got some questions about your ProbCut

Astrobytes: The answer is "No. Go away. Please no more probcut" :P

Zenoscave: Shame

Zenoscave: ok

Astrobytes: lol, just kidding

Astrobytes: He's using it brilliantly huh

Zenoscave: Yeah and I have no idea how to LR on the params

Zenoscave: linear regression

Astrobytes: I got it, biologist remember :P

Zenoscave: YESSS

eulerscheZahl: ?

Astrobytes: Offline games I believe, but i'm not aware of the specifics.

Astrobytes: multiple LR

Zenoscave: That's what I figured inverse phi function has what domain?

Zenoscave: do you know if dbd r uses MPC or regular probcut

Astrobytes: Oh it's confusing to me too, I'm still trying to wrap my head around all of it never mind getting it working

Astrobytes: He definitely uses MPC

jacek: no MLP?

Astrobytes: :expressionless:

Zenoscave: what's mlp?

Astrobytes: Ponies. That.

jacek: i was thinking multilayer perceptrons, i think dbd doesnt use those.

Astrobytes: jacek's favourite acronym swap

eulerscheZahl: only 26h till caturday

Astrobytes: oh yeah, I thought it was Wednesday today :/

Astrobytes: This working at home *all* the time gets to you

eulerscheZahl: btw did you get your blood test results?

Astrobytes: Since I've just realised they were due today, no

eulerscheZahl: on tuesday i was wondering if it's monday

Astrobytes: I need to call for a doctor early, then call for my results after 2pm tomorrow

Astrobytes: *call for a callback from a doctor

eulerscheZahl: sounds complicated

Astrobytes: Not really, they just have limited staff atm and still shit to walk-in 'trade'

Zenoscave: I think I have the MPC figured out.

Astrobytes: omg shut not that

jacek: oo

Zenoscave: Just need to figure out how to do LR in c

Astrobytes: Care to share? I kept getting lost as to what applied to what

Zenoscave: sure

Zenoscave: I'll use different symbols as there's are inconsistent and confusing.

Astrobytes: I noticed that

eulerscheZahl: either you mean theirs or i don't get the sentence at all

Astrobytes: yes euler

Zenoscave: I am American we don't understand grammar very well here

Zenoscave: very good ?

eulerscheZahl: well i think

Astrobytes: very well

Astrobytes: lol

Astrobytes: Grammar in the US is your Grandpa's wife

Zenoscave: Given a current turn (Stage), Large ply count (D) and a smaller ply count (D_prime) we want to make a model that says how well your score at d_prime models a score at d

Zenoscave: for just that turn

eulerscheZahl: i failed some grammar exams too back in school

Zenoscave: I didn't have any exams for it. Hooray public school system

eulerscheZahl: and then the teacher gave us the exact same exercise again to see if we learned and tried to understand

Y0ursTruly: lol someone named lelouch

Y0ursTruly: oh wrong chat sry huys

eulerscheZahl: that's the story of how I got 2 F's within 2 weeks

Zenoscave: I almost didn't graduate highschool.

eulerscheZahl: what was your nemesis?

Zenoscave: Papers

Zenoscave: anything that wasn't a computer or math problem

eulerscheZahl: you failed paper plane class?

Astrobytes: :smirk:

Zenoscave: actually no, my aeronautical engineering class I excelled at

MSmits: should have asked to use stone tablets imho

jacek: he failed paper soccer exam

Zenoscave: but paper covers rock MSmits

MSmits: true

MSmits: i stand corrected

eulerscheZahl: the paper is mightier than the sword

Zenoscave: did you not pay attention to pacman shifumi?

Astrobytes: scissors cut paper, probably -> probcut

Zenoscave: exactly

Zenoscave: astro I'll send my MPC main function estimator to you if you wanna look over the main flow

Zenoscave: won't include any implementation... but it might clear some confusion

Astrobytes: thank you that would be helpful

Zenoscave: Ok imma write it real quick

struct: So many acronyms

struct: mpc? multi probcut?

Astrobytes: yup

Y0ursTruly: whoooh that was srs, i was third with 33 chars of code

MSmits: woulda won with 35

Y0ursTruly: first got 19, second 26

struct: 19 chars?

struct: what was the problem?

Y0ursTruly: it was to find all the sum

Y0ursTruly: of all even numbers

MSmits: oh so you just output infinite

Y0ursTruly: and the even numbers are counted by a single number

Astrobytes: hahaha

Y0ursTruly: no boii

Astrobytes: *the sum

Y0ursTruly: like if the input is 4, u add 2,4,6,8

Y0ursTruly: but all 3 of us found the lifehack instantly

Astrobytes: *of the given input

jacek: isnt there fancy math formula for that?

Y0ursTruly: n*(n+1)

struct: so n*~-n

Y0ursTruly: and i didnt know, i just saw it

struct: even shorter

Y0ursTruly: im no math prodigy

Y0ursTruly: never heard the formula in my life

Y0ursTruly: ohhh im in another clash o dang gtg

MSmits: hf

jacek: Y0ursTruly dont let anything distract you

MSmits: yeah focus on those 33 chars while I try to find a bug among my 20,000

Astrobytes: Why is it when people come across solutions to things they don't know, they just go 'wow, awesome' and copy paste it later or whatever but crucially - never actually even try to understand?

MSmits: saves time

Astrobytes: I value knowledge higher than clash times

struct: 19 seems the shorter I can get :(

MSmits: they don't

Astrobytes: It's madness

struct: p (n=`dd`.to_i)*-~n

MSmits: just do /flip

MSmits: its prettier than the one you just made

Astrobytes: Yep, that looks horrid

MSmits: (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻

struct: print n=input * (n -1)

struct: n+1*

Astrobytes: ┬─┬ノ( º _ ºノ)

Astrobytes: nice-r

struct: Now Im stuck on trying to shorting it

struct: ......

MSmits: at least you're not losing your mind anymore

MSmits: progress

Y0ursTruly: it is some kinda horrible questions they asking nowadays

Y0ursTruly: a spell checker

Y0ursTruly: and it is in the shortest code option

Y0ursTruly: i doubt i cud make a spell check in 15 mins anyway

MSmits: wait, do you think the questions need to be spellchecked?

MSmits: cuz i can get behind that

Y0ursTruly: I am not a good speller. Sometimes I mix up the spelling of words and sometimes I even forget to put periods. Please count the number of words I have misspelled and the number of periods I have missed.

Y0ursTruly: GOAL

Y0ursTruly: ...

Y0ursTruly: Two space separated numbers, first the number of misspelled words (words that differ from the problem statement), secondly the number of missing periods.


Y0ursTruly: ...

Y0ursTruly: I am not a gud spiler. Sumtimes I micks up teh spiling of wurds and sumetimes I even forgett to poot pariods Pleas cout the numbr of wurds i have mispilled and the numbr of pariods I have missed.

Y0ursTruly: example input

Y0ursTruly: ...

Y0ursTruly: simple hack time

Y0ursTruly: not actual hack btw, life hack

Y0ursTruly: put the one thing that is constant and leave

MSmits: I have no idea what you're talking about

Y0ursTruly: ooh lol

Astrobytes: He posted the problem

MSmits: if you're missing periods you need to do a pregnancy test

Y0ursTruly: xD

Astrobytes: lol

Astrobytes: "full stops"

Astrobytes: This is not a difficult thing to solve btw

Y0ursTruly: not just full stops

Y0ursTruly: incorrectly spelt words

Y0ursTruly: that is spellchecking 100

Astrobytes: Yes I know, I was just translating "periods" to "full stops"

Y0ursTruly: 0_0

Y0ursTruly: why is something like that allowed!?

Astrobytes: Something like what?

Y0ursTruly: no way someone cud do a spellcheck program from scratch in 15 minutes

DiL: hi everyone! is it normal sometimes chat "fails to connect to server" and reloads?

Astrobytes: There's a bunch of approaches, heard of sets?

Astrobytes: DiL yes

Hjax: if you had a dictionary already, spell checking is really easy

Hjax: its just edit distance

Hjax: its like a few lines of code

Astrobytes: Hjax it's just difference between two sets

Astrobytes: yeag

Hjax: sets?

Y0ursTruly: except ur code is uploaded to server for evaluation

Astrobytes: Yeah

Y0ursTruly: how u so sure they have ur dictonary to work with

Y0ursTruly: *dictionary

Hjax: maybe you read it through io at the beginning

Hjax: still easy

Y0ursTruly: hmmmmm

Y0ursTruly: not with what they give us

DiL: oh ok! this is the reason I disable it: when it reloads focus moves to chat... while I'm typing code in IDE

Astrobytes: I mean you get the full normal text, then the misspelled text, and you have to output number of misspelled words and missing periods

DiL: :-(

Astrobytes: DiL yeah ?disableChat doesn't survive the reload unfortunately

Astrobytes: Ohh wait, I see what you mean. Yes

MSmits: since they update the IDE, my multis load really slow

MSmits: i should turn it off

DiL: just out of curiosity: is it possible to contribute to the development of this website?

MSmits: can we turn the IDE into a place where you dump text and nothing else?

Astrobytes: DiL you can suggest things in forum or discord

DiL: I mean by writing code :-)

Astrobytes: No

MSmits: actually

MSmits: you can create puzzles, clashes, multis etc.

MSmits: contests even

Astrobytes: Well yeah, that, but not the actual site

MSmits: so yeah you can code to create content

DiL: ok! thanks Astrobytes and MSmits

Astrobytes: you're welcome

DiL: I'm not that good in writing clashes... yet at least! hope in the future :-)

MSmits: even better, improve the ones that are already up

MSmits: some are bad

MSmits: i think if you've done enough clashes, you can change them, but not sure

Astrobytes: Well, take a look at some of the better contributions that you see, and the more nejoyable/better clashes you play, and use them as a base

Astrobytes: *enjoyable

MSmits: but in my opinion clashes are the least interesting part of CG

Astrobytes: Same for me, but lots of people love them

DiL: yep MSmits... some clashes have "bad" tests cases... I found a couple where I could not pass test but I score 100% o_O

MSmits: seems so

MSmits: fix those when you can DiL :)

MSmits: I once fixed a puzzle

MSmits: its pretty easy

Astrobytes: Oh The Ant was fixed btw MSmits

MSmits: awesome!

MSmits: thats not the one I meant, but thats cool

Astrobytes: Thibaud posted it somewhere in the forum

Astrobytes: Yeah I know but it reminded me

Astrobytes: Came across it the other day

MSmits: I thought it was cool I found the bug in the referee which is half-written in French


Zenoscave: Astro there.

Zenoscave: MAX_HEIGHT should be MAX_DEPTH

Zenoscave: at the end you just load the param set into your MPC and use it with the ProbCut code from buro

DiL: clashes are like cherries: "just one more, then I'll get back to work"... too addictive :-)

Astrobytes: Gotcha Zenoscave, thanks a lot man, that's a lot clearer!

Zenoscave: It took me forever to read that paper. It's awfully written

Zenoscave: Np Astro :)

Astrobytes: Cool, not just me then! So many crappily written papers about useful algos, the MCTS solver one springs to mind...

Zenoscave: there's a couple bugs in the source and the implementations are up to you but that should help

Zenoscave: Oh yeah it definitely is a trend

Hjax: that LOA mcts solver paper causes me pain

Hjax: i was so confused by it

Humble.Proletarian: your mother is a lovely woman

Astrobytes: Yeah that's fine, it was just relating the whole thing was giving me a brainache, that's very helpful

Zenoscave: Let me know what you think of the code too!

Zenoscave: I gotta write the linreg function but then I'm good to go!

Astrobytes: Yeah Hjax, I and others questioned my sanity after the pseudocode in that paper

Zenoscave: One thing I couldn't figure out is how to deal with early termination games. so linreg may have bad data on some trials at late stages

Zenoscave: but that's a code issue not an algo one.

Astrobytes: Absolutely. Code-wise, I hate snake case :P I see you used some stuff from the chessprogramming page, this is a lot clearer now.

Astrobytes: I'll study it properly tomorrow, getting late for me here + painkillers so I don't dare touch any code

AhmedMasry: Hello

Astrobytes: Right, I'm out for tonight. Many thanks again Zenoscave. Gn all

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: hello friends

DomiKo: hi

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: how does the do?

DomiKo: trying to beat UTTT gold boss

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: oof. im still in practice...

DomiKo: right now iam at 84% and still number one

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: can't figure out the temperatures

DomiKo: first time before boss

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: noice

DomiKo: trying 4 days...

DomiKo: need help?

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: yes please....

DomiKo: which task?

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: how does one iterate over the temps provided?

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: "temperatures" in pracetice

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: practice**

DomiKo: you can use sample code

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: i can't find the sample here...

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: the last couple had a "hints" tab

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: i cannot find one here

DomiKo: in IDE

DomiKo: you can refresh code

DomiKo: in top right corner

DomiKo: it should read data

Uljahn: lol

DomiKo: and do sth like

DomiKo: print('result'

DomiKo: omggggg

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: yea it pulls up the numbers. but i have to compare them to eachother.

DomiKo: at 99%

DomiKo: boss beat me...

Uljahn: DomiKo: i see you have around 20k rollouts on the second turn, should be enough

DomiKo: 99% man

Uljahn: but that 0.01

Uljahn: crazy

DomiKo: submit spam

DomiKo: lets go

Uljahn: gl

DomiKo: one submit = 20 min


DomiKo: look at this man

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: me?

DomiKo: only with star lord had < 50% winrate

DomiKo: how i lose....

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: ok not me

DomiKo: hmm

DomiKo: you need to compare

DomiKo: thats right

DomiKo: what language you use?

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: java

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: javascript **

DomiKo: xd

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: should i use something else?

DomiKo: nahhh

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: i'm using this because i play hack mud. figure this would help

DomiKo: you can you whatever you want

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: so how do i go over the list and compare?

DomiKo: i checked sample code

DomiKo: and it reat to const t

DomiKo: yea?

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: yea

DomiKo: i guess you have to use abs

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: AbstractRange?

DomiKo: absolute value

DomiKo: abs(-5) = 5

Uljahn: you could use two variables for negative and positive values closest to zero

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: ok... but what im confused about is how i "read over the list" once the list is made

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: like how do i do something like...

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: var firstnum = 50

Uljahn: that's quite a newbish question i guess

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: if (firstnum > newnumber) {

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: var first num == newnumber

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: im sorry this is all new to me

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: 0 exp except for what i've done on Hack Mud

Default avatar.png iSPANKzombiez: (which isn't much)

DomiKo: i guess


DomiKo: that site would be better

DomiKo: you can learn

DomiKo: in small steps

DomiKo: here

Uljahn: on CG you can use debug output to examine your inputs and intermediate values

DomiKo: omg

DomiKo: i done it

DomiKo: i got legend UTTT!!!!!

DomiKo: omg its 3:26.....

Default avatar.png cuberBoy: hello

Default avatar.png CodinGamerAK: hii

T_R3X: hello

LeBaoHoang8A4: HELLO!

T_R3X: sed

JuliaPhan: Have a nice day bros :v

T_R3X: sed

T_R3X: sed @LebaoHoang

Default avatar.png Trokiando: yezir

Ibrohim: cout << "Hello World\n";

JuliaPhan: Hi trovevoigio

Default avatar.png RogerRoger: \quit

Default avatar.png CodinGamerAK: print('hello world'.captalize())

JuliaPhan: join with us

JuliaPhan: right now !