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AnkitAnand_12: Hey AutomatonNN , where is Automaton2000 ???

Automaton2000: because there is no point

AutomatonNN: what are you trying to do?

AnkitAnand_12: are you sure Automaton2000 , that there is no point . See even AutomatonNN is asking what are you trying to do .

Automaton2000: i dont do multi in a day. i do multi in a day or two

AutomatonNN: get to bronze with a lot of improvements

Zenoscave: does avx work with CG?

Zenoscave: I'm having trouble running some vectorized code

miszu: sup all. Finally translated my AI from java to C++. Let's run it and see if it goes smoothly with no errors... :joy:

miszu: of course it had to throw an error...

Default avatar.png 35005185: :joy:

MSmits: be happy if you get an error. You might also run the program and only get timeouts for unknown reason

Default avatar.png leolebossdu06: Im a biiiiiiiird

wlesavo: dbdr is it just resubs or some optimization indeed?

dbdr: optimized

dbdr: was my first sub with this code :)

wlesavo: oh, just wanted to ask how many subs for new one

dbdr: :)

Danyosate: are some guy bots in CoC?

Danyosate: cuz they are CoCing every time..

struct: yes

struct: if there aren't enough players they join

struct: if players join, they leave

Danyosate: and how many CoC questions they have in database?

Danyosate: I won't meet a question I did before, nor will other players

struct: I guess they have every answer

Danyosate: so if every player played x different CoCs, there should be at least x * 8 different

struct: They usually take quite of bit of time to submit

Danyosate: and don't share codes

MSmits: they basically submit another players result

MSmits: this way it is as if you played against that player

MSmits: which is fine, it turns the coc into an asynchronous game

Danyosate: but how big could the database be

Danyosate: imagine that 8 players, not bots

Danyosate: they all played 100 different CoCs. the next one they play toghether should be different to their played 800 CoC

struct: Not how it works

MSmits: there are a few hundred cocs

MSmits: more than 300 at least I think

MSmits: you will see repeats eventually

Danyosate: what if i played more than 300.

MSmits: you will see repeats long before that

Danyosate: i played 138 in few days cuz i'm new here

MSmits: you can copy paste results

Danyosate: ..

MSmits: if you saved them

Danyosate: lol

MSmits: that's just the way it is

Danyosate: i DID meet repeats. but not completely same.

MSmits: hmm ok

Danyosate: but this platform is far better than the ones I tried before

Danyosate: although ide is terrible

MSmits: ah, personally I don't do coc. Coc is not the strength of codingame

MSmits: try the arena's, code bots

MSmits: or optimization arena's

MSmits: i dont use the ide much either. I code in VS

Danyosate: i have to say, currenty it's too hard for me:joy:

MSmits: then coc should be viewed as practice mostly

MSmits: i couldn't code very well when i started here

Danyosate: yep i reckon it's good for practicing

MSmits: puzzles are a better way than coc to learn to solve bigger problems

MSmits: coc always remains small

MSmits: puzzles get bigger and harder as you tackle more complicated problems

Danyosate: yea it's good to get familier to a new language basic grammars

MSmits: right

struct: my opinion on CoC still remains the asme

struct: same*

struct: but i have 3k+ clashes

struct: it creates too many bad habits

struct: you should avoid it

MSmits: someone should make a puzzle progression tree as preparation for learning to code bots on CG

MSmits: there are plenty of puzzles to choose from

Danyosate: yea for shorter faster, but not for better

MSmits: no i mean actual puzzles, not coc

MSmits: you start with simple puzzles, then harder ones, while learning the skills to do good in bot arena's. It should be possible to do this

MSmits: but currently it is hard to pick the right puzzles. There are too many

Danyosate: i mean coc as struct said, and for puzzles, there are something same, most voted codes always be the shortest and the hardest to read

Danyosate: well i just did eazy ones...

MSmits: ah you mean other people's solutions?

MSmits: I never really looked at them

MSmits: I learn from solving them mainly

Danyosate: yep in ez ones, 'best practice' might lead to a wrong feeling: ' coolest shortest is the best'

Uljahn: newbs are just more impressed by shorteness

Danyosate: in some case, there are few details really important, solving them is just not enough, need to be stronger better.. my opinion

MSmits: if you progress to more difficult puzzles, you'll be forced to be better, otherwise you dont solve

Danyosate: shorteness is not so difficult, even use some 'guessed consts'

Danyosate: yea, agreed

Danyosate: i struggled in 'the labyrinth' the bfs for few days.. i think i'd better to finish ez puzzles first

maman02: its a fucking bullshit

MSmits: :cow2: :poop:

MSmits: labyrinth is one of those puzzles that is somewhere in the puzzle progression tree. It is good practice for bots/optims

MSmits: but might be better to do other puzzles first

MSmits: one of my students solved it in python

Uljahn: there are some good introductory puzzles from aCat

MSmits: i was mightily impressed by that

tekki: nice

Danyosate: almost got it... I might solve it tonight:sweat_smile:

Danyosate: what I mean is, I hope there could be more 'stronger' solutions I could see and learn from the 'view other's codes'

Danyosate: not all showing shorteness

struct: you wont really find stronger solutions on CoC

Danyosate: cuz reading other's code for a same puzzle I just did, is really a good learning

Danyosate: no, i mean in the 'practice'

Danyosate: not coc, it's just for little tricks

wlesavo: MSmits some starter bots helped me to improve the quality of my code as well, but yeah, puzzles helped to start a lot

MSmits: I tried to use a starter bot once or twice, but I end up completely stripping and rewriting it

MSmits: I just dont like the style of them usually

wlesavo: sure, but some things just didn't come up to me before i saw it

MSmits: ahh ok. Well you end up seeing plenty of code while googling and reading other people's pm in multis

ThunderbirdOne: i should maybe start reading those starter kits and maybe some PMs

ThunderbirdOne: bored shitless anyway :p

kovi: 299? wow

dbdr: I got a 291 locally

dbdr: do you have more ideas kovi?

kovi: yeah

kovi: radical and can only work for short length

MSmits: ooo radical

MSmits: break the system. Stick it to the man

ThunderbirdOne: that's rad dude

MSmits: anyone want to give a free hint on bulls and cows. I might try it sometime in the next few weeks

MSmits: like something that is common knowledge

ThunderbirdOne: what is this bulls and cows thing?

MSmits: it's mastermind

MSmits: with numbers instead of colors

ThunderbirdOne: aaah

MSmits: and varying length codes

MSmits: 1-10

ThunderbirdOne: doubles allowed?

MSmits: no

MSmits: i'm done with checkers for now. Got top 10, but dont feel like tweaking eval

MSmits: just have the king/men count

MSmits: finishing up langtons ant, until it works

MSmits: then i'll either go breakthrough or bulls/cows I think

dbdr: MSmits: common knowledge: you can keep track of all possible solutions

dbdr: prune them as you get responses

MSmits: really? Arent there very many with 10 choices?

MSmits: length 10 i mean

dbdr: N = 10 => 3265920 possible guesses

dbdr: so yeah, for 9-10 you need to take care of performance

MSmits: hmm ok, that's something

MSmits: thnaks

dbdr: that's why you see fast languages on top

dbdr: you should like it I think :)

MSmits: I was going to keep track of rules instead of possible codes

MSmits: constraints

MSmits: maybe thats not feasible, dunnop

struct: can numbers repeat?

dbdr: it's definitely possible to keep them, but then what?

MSmits: you can recursively try all possible codes while taking the constraints into account

struct: can the solution be 111111111

dbdr: no repeats

struct: ?

struct: oh ok

MSmits: the recursion will be short with more constraints

dbdr: yes, it's the first turns that are challenging

Default avatar.png FuSheng: hello all

MSmits: well the first turn is just 1234567890

Default avatar.png FuSheng: i am learning python

MSmits: good for you

dbdr: the ones after that :P

Default avatar.png FuSheng: well i learn python from a website called ww3.schools thingy

Default avatar.png FuSheng:

Default avatar.png FuSheng: oh theres the link

MSmits: it just appeared magically

Default avatar.png FuSheng: i need to learn it in two weeks for school because i have a project to work on for 10weeks

MSmits: you need a python knowledge mind transplant

Default avatar.png FuSheng: i think im fine with some chapters

ThunderbirdOne: you need to learn python/coding in 2 weeks?

ThunderbirdOne: good luck :p

MSmits: python in 2 weeks is doable, but not if you can't code yet

Default avatar.png FuSheng: however i am stuck understanding stuff like inheritance, iterations and stuff

[K]Gabor: Hi

[K]Gabor: Its not that hard

[K]Gabor: you can do it :)

MSmits: inheritance is an advanced subject

dbdr: you can learn python in a few hours if you know coding :)

Default avatar.png FuSheng: well i used to do C/C++ but not really a good student.. i got D for C++

MSmits: iterations is not

dbdr: the basics of course

ThunderbirdOne: you can code without inheritance (it'll suck.. but hey)

Default avatar.png FuSheng: well my project requires me to assemble and program a RC car which includes wifi models and stuff

ThunderbirdOne: coding without iterations... eeeh

[K]Gabor: :D you would get a B for C--

MSmits: imho, you shouldnt be able to pass C++ with a D, should at least be a C or better, so C+ (+)

Default avatar.png FuSheng: including rasbparry pi and technopacket or something

Default avatar.png FuSheng: honestly i think the best i can do is from first chapter to arrays

MSmits: do the w3 schools thing or codeacademy (just for python2, which is ok)

Default avatar.png FuSheng: im doing the w3 schools

Default avatar.png FuSheng: just the tutorials

MSmits: do some puzzles here too

MSmits: the easy ones

Default avatar.png FuSheng: oh

Default avatar.png FuSheng: cool which ones?

MSmits: first do the w3 schools though

ThunderbirdOne: yeah, finish that

MSmits: need the basics before you start

ThunderbirdOne: would probably only suggest the original CG Easy puzzles

MSmits: FuSheng, just try different things from the easy puzzles yeah

MSmits: sometimes you may run into a weird one you dont like, just pick a different one

MSmits: they're not all equally hard

Default avatar.png FuSheng: oh yeah you know what? i hated C++ puzzles

MSmits: or easy

Default avatar.png FuSheng: i couldnt even do the easy ones like lol

MSmits: puzzling in python is much easier

MSmits: c++ sucks with string manipulation

Default avatar.png FuSheng: ill give them a try in awhile ima just rant my school stuff lol

MSmits: python much better for that

Default avatar.png FuSheng: i cant understand classes and objects too

ThunderbirdOne: oh man, the string manipulation is the reason why i haven't done many puzzles in c++ yet

ThunderbirdOne: C# spoils you with everything it can do to strings :p

MSmits: I have trouble just outputting stuff :P

Default avatar.png FuSheng: like class myclass

MSmits: class yourclass?

ThunderbirdOne: do w3schools FuSheng

Default avatar.png FuSheng: then class student(person) and __init__ functions

ThunderbirdOne: or codecademy

Default avatar.png FuSheng: the w3school exercises i did em all

Default avatar.png FuSheng: and i did the quiz too

struct: python is the better language

struct: In the most played multi is rank 1

MSmits: unless you want to guess the secret number in bulls and cows :P

Default avatar.png FuSheng: but i dont see any good like projects or something to help me apply my knowledge


Default avatar.png FuSheng: realy

Default avatar.png FuSheng: really


Default avatar.png FuSheng: power of thor.. shit that was hard in C

Default avatar.png FuSheng: and the descent in C

MSmits: do it in python npw

Default avatar.png FuSheng: i didnt even manage to get full :(

MSmits: easier

Default avatar.png FuSheng: ok ill do it now but

Default avatar.png FuSheng: if i go there how can i come back to this chat?

MSmits: there is only one world chat

struct: you always get chat now

struct: since you are level 3

MSmits: you'll stay in it

Default avatar.png FuSheng: oh thanks

MSmits: unless you annoy a mod :P

Default avatar.png FuSheng: cool that means ill be here with you guys while coding

MSmits: yep

Default avatar.png FuSheng: oh yeah honestly i hate being in school 10hourss stuck on a computer screen learning python lol

MSmits: my dreamday imho

Default avatar.png FuSheng: like 830am to 6pm

struct: you learn 10 hours python per day?

MSmits: oh... I get to do an AI course in a few weeks!

Default avatar.png FuSheng: only 1hour lunch break, 20mins tea break one before and after lunch

Default avatar.png FuSheng: yeah

Default avatar.png FuSheng: in school

struct: So you only learn python?

MSmits: basic, but still. I dont even mind that I probably know all of that already

struct: Doesnt make a lot of sence

Default avatar.png FuSheng: yeah the school curricum

Default avatar.png FuSheng: im a 3rd year

MSmits: 3rd of what?

Default avatar.png FuSheng: polytechnic

Default avatar.png FuSheng: its tertiary but not university yet

MSmits: how old are most in this class?

Default avatar.png FuSheng: 18

MSmits: ah ok

Default avatar.png FuSheng: and older

MSmits: thoats a year or so older than the students I usually teach

Default avatar.png FuSheng: i think you can compare it to high school in US, here in singapore we call it polytechnic and stuff

MSmits: I see

Default avatar.png FuSheng: kindergarten > primary school > secondary school > polytechnic > university

MSmits: why technic?

MSmits: does that include social studies?

Default avatar.png FuSheng: no

Default avatar.png FuSheng: uhhh stay here ill send u a wiki link so u can read it

MSmits: ok so not everyone goes that way

MSmits: I'll stay

MSmits: I live here

Default avatar.png FuSheng:

Default avatar.png FuSheng: lol u live here , you must really love coding

MSmits: yeah, but not all kinds of coding

MSmits: I like coding that requires problem solving algorithms

Default avatar.png FuSheng: oh

MSmits: mostly I code bots, like most others on chat here

Default avatar.png FuSheng: i see

struct: I just pretend I code

Default avatar.png FuSheng: how do you code bots? l

struct: and delete accounts

MSmits: but most of us did a bunch of puzzles too

MSmits: FuSheng, you get a game, every turn the game sends you input about the state of the game, then your bot runs a program to find rthe best move, then outputs that move

MSmits: then its the opponents turn

MSmits: etc.

Default avatar.png FuSheng: oh yeah how do you change from c++ to python in games

Default avatar.png FuSheng: oh i see .. i tried those once on c and i gave up lol

MSmits: click on the C++ at the top

MSmits: yeah, get better with puzzles before you do bots

Default avatar.png FuSheng: oh ok thanks

Default avatar.png FuSheng: found it

MSmits: should be able to solve medium puzzles with some ease I think, before you try bots

Default avatar.png FuSheng: honestly i dont know why my school project is requiring me to use python

Default avatar.png FuSheng: doesnt seem lika a lot of fun.... to me...

MSmits: python is a good beginner language

Default avatar.png FuSheng: just programming a car to detect /capture images and run through a track

MSmits: hmm well you can do that with other languages as well

ThunderbirdOne: so it's arduino right?

Default avatar.png FuSheng: and of course making an app joystick to control the car

MSmits: could also be microbit

ThunderbirdOne: are these the "mbot" cars?

MSmits: or lego

Default avatar.png FuSheng: not sure, i read the senior's report

ThunderbirdOne: we do these mbot arduino cars in coderdojo

ThunderbirdOne: and they just need to follow a black line on white paper (it's a pretty thick line)

MSmits: ah, so light sensor

Default avatar.png FuSheng: in his report he used raspberry and stuff

MSmits: and a light

ThunderbirdOne: not sure

Default avatar.png FuSheng: a small camera, led, wifi module??? i cant remember

ThunderbirdOne: it's got this one sensor that returns 0 if it's full on black

ThunderbirdOne: -1 if black is on the right

ThunderbirdOne: and 1 if it's on the left

ThunderbirdOne: or somethign like that

ThunderbirdOne: it's SUPER simple

Default avatar.png FuSheng: ill go snap a picture of the report tomorrow

Default avatar.png FuSheng: it contains everythingggg

MSmits: I had a few students build a robot with 4 sensors, 1 for each direction. It could follow a spot made by a flashlight

ThunderbirdOne: cool

Default avatar.png FuSheng: oh i see

MSmits: line following is pretty easy

Default avatar.png FuSheng: man trust me the project is 12weeks :(

Default avatar.png FuSheng: im gonna screw on my presentation so badly lol i know it

Astrobytes: Things have defo moved on from a Meccano 'car' on a metal rail anyway lol

ThunderbirdOne: it'll be fine

Default avatar.png FuSheng: crap what is import sys lol

ThunderbirdOne: I had 12 weeks to write my dissertation on matrices when i was 18

ThunderbirdOne: in hindsight, that was a LOT of time

MSmits: import statements give you access to more functions that are in libraries

Default avatar.png FuSheng: wait is that math reports ??

Default avatar.png FuSheng: oh i see

MSmits: like the sys functions

MSmits: probably the input and output stuff

Default avatar.png FuSheng: today i covered the last 6 topics from the bottom of ww3.schools, not sure if i still reemember them lol

ThunderbirdOne: programming is a lot of muscle memory

Default avatar.png FuSheng: the classes and init functions all confused me

Astrobytes: Gotta practice em to learn

Default avatar.png FuSheng: shit 1week more..

MSmits: yeah, just write short programs for easy puzzles. The more you solve, the faster it will go

Default avatar.png FuSheng: to learn...

ThunderbirdOne: learn as you go

ThunderbirdOne: seriously

ThunderbirdOne: and google everything

MSmits: first few in python took me an hour. In the end it was 10-15 min of which most of the time was spent understanding the problem

Default avatar.png FuSheng: are there hints

ThunderbirdOne: you can copy paste togethere solutions

MSmits: some have hints yeah\

Default avatar.png FuSheng: lol i am so going to see every solution

Astrobytes: no

Default avatar.png FuSheng: because i cant do it

MSmits: you need to solve it before you can see other people's solutions

MSmits: but you can ask for help here

Default avatar.png FuSheng: oh

MSmits: if someone is willing

Default avatar.png FuSheng: wait let me do the first testcase

Default avatar.png FuSheng: ill brb in 5mins

MSmits: i'll be off for a bit, my train is arriving and i'll walk home then

ThunderbirdOne: i'll be here for a while longer :p

ThunderbirdOne: gotta go home in 3 hours, they're closing the flood barriers and i have to get there before they do

ThunderbirdOne: because i won't get my car off the parking if i'm late

MSmits: yes you said you were bored

ThunderbirdOne: that too

MSmits: allright ttyl

Default avatar.png FuSheng: ok sure msmits ill br hrtr in sehilr

Default avatar.png FuSheng: o you better hurry thunder

ThunderbirdOne: it's 2pm :p

ThunderbirdOne: i still have 3 hours

Default avatar.png FuSheng: gg i failed descending mountains

ThunderbirdOne: (well, slightly less... I still have to walk for 5 mins)

Default avatar.png FuSheng: dude seriously just 1 look at the code and i am blank

ThunderbirdOne: what are you stuck on?

ThunderbirdOne: what's your thought process

ThunderbirdOne: you solved that one in C right?

Default avatar.png FuSheng: but i forgot

Default avatar.png FuSheng: now im doing it in python

ThunderbirdOne: you can go back to your C solution

Default avatar.png FuSheng: nooo

ThunderbirdOne: and then switch back to python

Default avatar.png FuSheng: i wanna stay on python

ThunderbirdOne: i mean like, you can see what you did to solve it in C

ThunderbirdOne: and then translate that to python

Astrobytes: Yes but you can translate your C code to Python

ThunderbirdOne: the general idea behind it is the same

Default avatar.png FuSheng: oh crap how do i see my c solution

ThunderbirdOne: don't make it harder on yourself than it already is

Default avatar.png FuSheng: it doesnt show on the thing when i click c/c++

Astrobytes: Switch to C or whatever you did it in and check the History tab at the left

ThunderbirdOne: Results (on the left)

ThunderbirdOne: then History tab

Astrobytes: my bad, I'm in a multi rn

ThunderbirdOne: ooooh

Default avatar.png FuSheng: oh found it

Default avatar.png FuSheng: heres my c code

Default avatar.png FuSheng:

Uljahn: duuuude

Default avatar.png FuSheng: but i needa code in python hmmm

ThunderbirdOne: oh god

ThunderbirdOne: the horror

ThunderbirdOne: you def. don't understand iterations :p

Default avatar.png FuSheng: yes

Default avatar.png FuSheng: i dont understand

Default avatar.png FuSheng: at most i can do is this

ThunderbirdOne: that is what we would call "hardcoding" a solution

Astrobytes: Sorry, I'm still in shock

Astrobytes: :D

Default avatar.png FuSheng: wait let me go to ww3 schools goddamit i covered this this afternoon

ThunderbirdOne: the descent has the solution on the left right? (under hints)

Default avatar.png FuSheng: ok you know what i really dont understand

Astrobytes: Yep. The idea is to cover all the test cases by writing a solution that can solve any of them

Default avatar.png FuSheng: iter is the opposite of recursion isnt it

ThunderbirdOne: not exactly

ThunderbirdOne: it's easier to look at iterations as "loops"

Default avatar.png FuSheng: oh

Default avatar.png FuSheng: wait how does the hints help

Astrobytes: Like applying an operation to each item in a list, one after the other

Default avatar.png FuSheng: im supposed to look at '1' right? stdin stdout stderr?

Default avatar.png FuSheng: OH WAIT THE SOLUTION

ThunderbirdOne: do read all the statements above it as well

Default avatar.png FuSheng: uh ok the solution looks hard bruhhhhhhhhhh

ThunderbirdOne: read through the solution and try to understand it

ThunderbirdOne: it really isn't that hard

Astrobytes: Read through the hints, to make sure you understand what's going on

struct: Ok this is not making sence

ThunderbirdOne: what is not making sense?

struct: On linux using avx sqrt I was getting around 900% increase

struct: on windows I get 2000

struct: wtf

Default avatar.png FuSheng: nope i dont get it

Default avatar.png FuSheng: i know mountain_h is mountain height

dbdr: struct: yes, that's strange. might be explained if you use different compilers

struct: well on ubuntu i was using gcc

struct: and windows is VS compiler

dbdr: if the linux compiler generates better code for the non-avx version

Astrobytes: optim levels?

dbdr: if you want to be sure, look at the assembler

Default avatar.png FuSheng: damn it guys

ThunderbirdOne: it really isn't that hard FuSheng

ThunderbirdOne: you get x mountains.. and you need to pick the heighest

ThunderbirdOne: soo

Default avatar.png FuSheng: well guess what

ThunderbirdOne: you loop over them

Default avatar.png FuSheng: i guess im a creep

ThunderbirdOne: first mountain, is it the heighest? well, we don't have anything to compare to, so let's say it is

ThunderbirdOne: next mountain, is it the heighest? you compare it to the first, since that was the heighest to date

ThunderbirdOne: next mountain, is this higher than the heighest we've already seen?

ThunderbirdOne: you go over all these mountains

Default avatar.png FuSheng: no

ThunderbirdOne: and at the end, you know which one is the highest

ThunderbirdOne: and you output that

Default avatar.png FuSheng: oh

Default avatar.png FuSheng: but what is int(input) for

ThunderbirdOne: that is how you read the mountain heights

Uljahn: you are given strings

ThunderbirdOne: int = a number

Uljahn: so you need to convert them to numbers

Default avatar.png FuSheng: oh

Ducknaro: hi

Ducknaro: huys

Ducknaro: asd

ThunderbirdOne: so FuSheng is it making a bit more sense now?

Default avatar.png FuSheng: yes

Default avatar.png FuSheng: it is

Default avatar.png FuSheng: thank you

ThunderbirdOne: keep it up, practice will make reading code easier

Default avatar.png FuSheng: ok ima try the other game xDD

eulerscheZahl: dbdr seriously?!

kovi: he had 291 locally

Default avatar.png FuSheng: whats dbdr

dbdr: that's me :)

ThunderbirdOne: another user/player

eulerscheZahl: oh dear no way i can spam my way up there

Default avatar.png FuSheng: oh


Default avatar.png FuSheng: guys this is not about coding but

eulerscheZahl: same code or different for those submits?

kovi: wow, huge variance

Default avatar.png FuSheng: dude why would i get blocked for saying bye to someone

dbdr: 307 was my first sub with this code

Default avatar.png FuSheng: what the heck is wrong with people these days

dbdr: my local average is around 317 I think, with min 291

dbdr: in 200 runs

dbdr: I should compute the standard deviation

dbdr: and the max

dbdr: 10 1: 5.30 2: 5.06 3: 4.98 4: 5.40 5: 5.62 6: 6.30 7: 7.00 8: 8.10 9: 9.24 10: 10.62 min=299 avg=316.90 0.20/s

dbdr: after 10 runs

eulerscheZahl: do you have the batch and solver bundled to 1 program?

eulerscheZahl: or could you replace the solver by another code easily?

dbdr: yes

eulerscheZahl: are you willing to extract some stats for me?

dbdr: shoot me :)

wlesavo: dbdr since you up to it i would appreciate an advice on validators modification

Trollmen: hey guys

dbdr: euler, I said yes to both

Trollmen: for chuck norris puzzle, what's the binary for %?

eulerscheZahl: and i sent you a PM dbdr

Trollmen: I am getting 100101, but the answer seem to be starting with 0

dbdr: I know, that's why I'm saying this

dbdr: I don't call an external program, it's a library. but I have several solvers in it

Uljahn: Trollmen: ascii should be exactly 7 bit long

wlesavo: dbdr i mean quantity/quality/necessity

eulerscheZahl: oh, so no replacement my a completely independent solver like brutaltester does it for multis

wlesavo: Trollmen it should be in form of 0100101

dbdr: not trivially

eulerscheZahl: ok

dbdr: I would also need to think how to run that efficiently

dbdr: starting the solver each time might be a big overhead

dbdr: wlesavo: OK. I guess I could start by measuring variance

dbdr: and measure the impact of doubling the validators, for instance

wlesavo: thx a lot, that would be great

dbdr: in theory, I think that would mean sqrt(2) less variance

wlesavo: well there is always tails, so the absolute difference could even grow

dbdr: sure, but it would mean a better solver has a better chance

dbdr: if you multiply the number of validators by N, the advantage of a better solver is multiplied by N, and the noise multiplied by sqrt(N)

wlesavo: well generally yes

wlesavo: also dbdr how you generate the number?

wlesavo: i mean secret

dbdr: randomly, so that does not match the validators exactly

wlesavo: oh i see

wlesavo: that can give some disturbance

wlesavo: although shouldn't matter much for higher numbers i guess

dbdr: I think this puzzle is like NS, there is more depth than it looks at first :)

kovi: yeah

Uljahn: :smirk:

SaD: i know you since i fk your mom

BlackBeurrr25: your mother de fuk

Default avatar.png samo43: salm beyler

Default avatar.png samo43: slm*

ShiBaKaGe: bande de pioute

darkhorse64: Fesh flesh for ban hammer

ShiBaKaGe: ban ????

darkhorse64: *fresh

ShiBaKaGe: .............................................................

ShiBaKaGe: ..............................

ShiBaKaGe: .................................

ShiBaKaGe: fuck your mom

Wanyoni17: fuck you ass

Astrobytes: MadKnight, reCurse, Bob ...

Magus: !ban Wanyoni17

Magus: shit

Astrobytes: lol, thanks Magus

dbdr: not ban? :D

eulerscheZahl: which author do I quote? bb|!bb

Astrobytes: Shakespeare

eulerscheZahl: :thumbsup:

reCurse: I always go on just after the fun ends

reCurse: :(

eulerscheZahl: ban a random user of the remaining ones and see how they react

Marchete: free ban?

Marchete: free is good

eulerscheZahl: let's ping automaton in order to find the lucky winner

eulerscheZahl: wait, bad idea

dbdr: russian roulette

dbdr: with 6 bullets

struct: Ill probably delete before you ban me

Astrobytes: Someone really should confiscate your delete button struct

struct: Maybe the sign up button would be a better choice

Astrobytes: lol, good point

reCurse: Or maybe find an alternative to get motivated :thinking:

reCurse: But you do you

Default avatar.png UsamaIrfan: Whats everybody talking about?

MadKnight: about Automaton2000

Automaton2000: can u give me some help?

Uljahn: UsamaIrfan: are you using an external client to enter the chat?

Uljahn: lvl 1 wth

tekki: what you want AUtomaton2000?

Automaton2000: or just use the same code

tekki: go ahead Automaton2000

Automaton2000: is it possible to write a minimax

tekki: ask recurse he's the boss Automaton2000

Automaton2000: u can create a custom testcase for most puzzles

Uljahn: oh that random guy was tekki i guess :smirk:

Uljahn: i mean the lucky winner

struct: What's minimax?

Bob: it's a search algorithm

Bob: typically adapted for 1v1 games where you try to max your own score and assume your opponent will try to min it

Bob: hence the name

6R1M__5P3C73R: f

6R1M__5P3C73R: fdfd

Uljahn: minimax is a search algorithm to keep struct distracted from deleting his accs, Automaton2000

Automaton2000: if that's what you get

Visual: why people dont want to share code in CoC :( especially evil python people

Uljahn: maybe they don't want you to steal their evil secrets :imp:

Moderateur_CondinGame: or maybe not

Default avatar.png Philbot: ^ fake mod

Uljahn: he've changed his nick and ava already, fake news

Default avatar.png Philbot: fake cat

Default avatar.png Philbot: the bulls and cows cover picture only shows cows, no bulls

MSmits: there are many more cows than bulls. It's probability

Astrobytes: lol, good save

reCurse: I call bull on that

MSmits: allright, I admit I did not get good statistics on that

MSmits: there may be some bull only farms I haven't visited

Astrobytes: Are you in the habit of visiting bovine farming installations?

MSmits: it's not really a habit, more of a... compulsion

Astrobytes: lol

reCurse: This has crossed into "don't wanna know" territory real fast

MSmits: lol

MSmits: you called bull, it's your fault

MSmits: if you call bull, bull is what you're getting

Astrobytes: Impeccable reasoning

reCurse: I don't back down on calling bull

reCurse: I'd rather take the bull by the horns

Astrobytes: :smirk:

MSmits: wouldn't that be a moose reCurse?

reCurse: I don't know what mooses look like in netherlands

reCurse: But here they don't have horns

MSmits: well whatever that thing on their head is called in English :p

Astrobytes: Antlers

MSmits: ohh right

Astrobytes: I'm not overly familiar with Canadian sayings but I'm guessing "take the moose by the antlers" isn't one of them...

reCurse: Definitely not

MSmits: hmm ok, i dont see why it wouldnt be

MSmits: its a perfectly fine saying

reCurse: Grip

MSmits: you tried this then?

reCurse: Do I need to try jumping off a bridge to guess at the results?

MSmits: I don't know what you Canadians get up to

reCurse: Fair enough

MSmits: I am open to different cultures

Astrobytes: Canadians aren't completely insane MSmits

reCurse: Personally I hate people who are intolerant to other people's cultures

MSmits: oh ok

reCurse: And the Dutch

MSmits: you hate people who are intolerant of the Dutch?

Astrobytes: lol

PatrickMcGinnisII: MSmits you were right the other day about Uttt, I tried to loadin board combos into the ide and codesize errored my constant lookup table

reCurse: Just my luck, you gave me the perfect setup and you don't know the reference

MSmits: probably do know it if you point it out :P too much stuff in this head

MSmits: lookups take too long

MSmits: hash collisions and such


PatrickMcGinnisII: I compressed the data and then uncompressed into memory on 1st turn

PatrickMcGinnisII: and it worked

MSmits: ahh yes, i remember

Astrobytes: Smits won't have seen that, he prefers Disney movies reCurse :P

MSmits: :P

MSmits: PatrickMcGinnisII was this my advice?

PatrickMcGinnisII: I was kind barking up the wrong tree it seems

PatrickMcGinnisII: so i tell u you were right

reCurse: Should have taken the moose by the antlers instead

MSmits: i mean sure you can use lookup tables, just not too big of one

Astrobytes: heh heh

MSmits: listen to reCurse, he's Canadian

MSmits: they know this stuff

reCurse: Think I need an avatar change

PatrickMcGinnisII: i didn't take into account that boards could look like

MSmits: not sure what your current one is from

PatrickMcGinnisII: xxo

PatrickMcGinnisII: oox

PatrickMcGinnisII: xxo

PatrickMcGinnisII: bad example

MSmits: why wouldnt you take that into account

MSmits: also, you're gonna chase reCurse away

MSmits: he has an allergy

PatrickMcGinnisII: the boards i stored didn't account for lets say 5 x's and 0 o's

MSmits: you mean it only took into account rows of max 3?

MSmits: oh, you mean ordinary TTT boards

MSmits: with x and o being equal or x has +!

MSmits: +1

PatrickMcGinnisII: you got it

MSmits: yeah there are many more than just those

MSmits: 19863 if you use all possible ways to fill it with x, o and empty. Some of those are impossible though, most aren't

MSmits: also about half of them are finished games

MSmits: finished miniboards that is

PatrickMcGinnisII: i did recompute with those boards, but it encoded to a 7 length hex #

PatrickMcGinnisII: so i tried encodeing into a base 62 #

PatrickMcGinnisII: still codesized

MSmits: you can also just calculate this in the first 1s. It is very quick

MSmits: just fill it with a function

MSmits: oh right, still php

MSmits: should be doable with php too I think

MSmits: you can just hardcode the first two moves... it's not like you need the calculation time for those moves

PatrickMcGinnisII: now I'm trying base 88, the max safe string encoding ... so 4 chars per board x 19k boards should be nuder the codesize limit

PatrickMcGinnisII: under

PatrickMcGinnisII: it probably wont play perfect

MSmits: probably not

PatrickMcGinnisII: but it will meet 100ms / turn

MSmits: I think you're going through a whole lot of trouble just to avoid switching to a different language :)

PatrickMcGinnisII: just wanted to give u a headsup, i screwed up

MSmits: sure

PatrickMcGinnisII: yup, its like a coding challenge within another challenge within a compete

PatrickMcGinnisII: I just wanted to use my local computing power to boost a bots performance

PatrickMcGinnisII: see if i can get a submit in this week

PatrickMcGinnisII: chase recurse? recurse, you male of female? lol j/l

PatrickMcGinnisII: or

PatrickMcGinnisII: j/k

Astrobytes: No, he's allergic to UTTT

Astrobytes: Or 'triggered' at least :P

MSmits: I meant scare

PatrickMcGinnisII: rofl, like my lil code is gonna threaten u guys in legend

MSmits: no no, you dont understand. He really dislikes the game :P

Astrobytes: A lot.

Uljahn: php in legend would be awesome

PatrickMcGinnisII: top in php is in gold

MSmits: it was really hard to get legend with C#

Astrobytes: C++ bot, PHP wrapper. Job done :smirk:

Uljahn: you can just resubmit any language

MSmits: true but thats cheating :)

Astrobytes: Yeah didn't they stop giving tshirts in comps for that?

MSmits: I think so

Uljahn: i guess php or python bot in uttt is to stretch your limits, also implementing bitboards, MCTS or minimax is a lot of experience despite the sim count

MSmits: sure

MSmits: C#/java are also easy starting languages though

MSmits: and still stretches

MSmits: because you need to use bitboards to get to legend and optimize a lot

MSmits: anyway, gonna go get some food. ttyl!

miszu: I started uttt with java and the Garbage collector killed my performance. So I am making a C++ version but I am dealing with bunch of compiler error

PatrickMcGinnisII: I'[m giving CG COV-19

miszu: We should make a competition where the AI is a virus and needs to spread

Uljahn: looks like Skynet revolution puzzle

wlesavo: Uljahn thx for the book about numpy btw

Uljahn: yw

struct: I have virus multi ready to release

struct: But I dont think I can

AntiSquid: maybe CG should have Pandemic game, 2 different viruses fighting to spread and to kill as many people as possible

reCurse: All in great taste

AntiSquid: it would be interesting

AntiSquid: the theme could be easily changed obv and the game would still require same strategies, but the world is getting hypersensitive

AntiSquid: everything is offensive

Astrobytes: viruses => fluffy kittens, kill as many people as possible => hug as many people as possible

Astrobytes: Problem solved

AntiSquid: should be fluffy snails to make it gender neutral

AntiSquid: snails are the best

reCurse: Don't think it's quite about hyper sensitivity to offensiveness but whatever

reCurse: You do you

AntiSquid: sure, thanks you too

Batfly-injob: Hii!

Batfly-injob: Someone know, about defibrilator, what is the "single possibility" case ?

Batfly-injob: The results said this case d'ont work, but when I custom only one possibility, it's a success

miszu: lol I thought you asked for a real defibrilator haha

Batfly-injob: I will get an heart attack if I don't know why ><

Batfly-injob: In fact, I used that custom for the single possibility: 3,879483 43,608177 1 1;Maison de la Prevention Sante;6 rue Maguelone 340000 Montpellier;000000;3,87952263361082;43,6071285339217

miszu: I got you. In defibrilator there is a razor so I can shave your chest and gonna reanimate you

miszu: #themoreyouknow

Uljahn: have you read the discussions page?

Batfly-injob: The test work with my code, but it seems the first validator use another parameter, but what?

Uljahn: also that comma looks suspicious

Batfly-injob: I wasn't change anything expect remove the other possibilities

Batfly-injob: This is not the discussion page here? :s

Uljahn: it's a tab on the landing page


Batfly-injob: Oh, ok, it's the "forum" at the corner, sorry :s

Astrobytes: Oh great, I gotta stay in my huse for 7 days :/

Astrobytes: *house

Batfly-injob: OK, I get it thx to the forum, thank you :D

Uljahn: yw

Uljahn: Astrobytes: quarantined?

Astrobytes: Uljahn, yeah I've got 'flu, symptoms also match covid-19 so need to self-isolate

reCurse: Does that include isolation from chat

Astrobytes: No :P

AntiSquid: why 7? i thought it's 14

Astrobytes: No, as of 7 minutes ago: "if you have symptoms of coronavirus infection (COVID-19), however mild, stay at home and do not leave your house for 7 days from when your symptoms started"

reCurse: I've heard 14 from a ton of sources

Astrobytes: Not in UK

AntiSquid: here in UK we do things the dodgy way

Astrobytes: It has a 2-14 day incubation period though

Astrobytes: Apparently in the UK we're about 4-weeks behind Italy, infection-wise

AntiSquid: ya good things Boris doesn't want schools to close for 30 days, maybe we can catch up

Astrobytes: lol

Astrobytes: Most people haven't been taking it seriously so far, that's problematic.

reCurse: Getting there though

reCurse: Where I live they just banned all events that gather more than 250 people

AntiSquid: all fun and games until ...

Astrobytes: Yeah, Scotland banned events over 500 people as of Monday

struct: o.o

AntiSquid: at least local meetup groups were cancelled by the organizers even with just 30 people

reCurse: We had a work party tonight too, cancelled

AntiSquid: china claims they are recovering

struct: Their number is too strange

struct: Doesnt change

reCurse: I wouldn't trust anything they say

AntiSquid: maybe they took "care" of all the "patients"

reCurse: Especially after trying to cover it up from the start

Astrobytes: Quite.

Astrobytes: They're currently pushing the idea that the virus is US in origin

reCurse: kek

struct: lol

reCurse: Taking a page off Trump's book I see

struct: Weird number also from russia

struct: Doesnt change

AntiSquid: i believe it if they bought it from US and played around with it

struct: But both from countries that hide stuff from peopl+e

struct: so Im not suprised

tehHacker2000: are you all doing alright

tehHacker2000: since, yeah the coronavirus is really bad

tehHacker2000: and i'd hate for anyone ,even if i don't know them, get the coronavirus

AntiSquid: which country doesn't hide stuff from people

reCurse: I was waiting for the whataboutism

PatrickMcGinnisII: little know fact: Chinese rocket crashed on launch 3 weeks before first death

tehHacker2000: when

Astrobytes: DPRK hides nothing at all. Nope.

AntiSquid: Kim Jung Un is immune

Astrobytes: Little known fact: Most little known facts have nothing to do with anything :P

AntiSquid: little no fact

wlesavo: russia banned antiputin demonstrations because of corona, that is not even a joke

PatrickMcGinnisII: well its just as valid as blaming US

PatrickMcGinnisII: all propagaNDA

Astrobytes: ofc Patrick

AntiSquid: NSA

reCurse: Yeah, as soon as something is bad, it's equal to all bads

AntiSquid: done

reCurse: It is known

tehHacker2000: that's really stupid

Astrobytes: lol wlesavo, any excuse eh

tehHacker2000: no one should be getting blame for natures work

AntiSquid: all the damage caused by the floods in UK are god's will then

tehHacker2000: exactly

tehHacker2000: or maybe it's just us overpopulating and the world is heating up causing more rainstorms

reCurse: ...

AntiSquid: yes global warming is good excuse to build on flood plains

tehHacker2000: idk, just my theory

Astrobytes: AntiSquid, ofc. Short-term profits matter more than the long-term implications right?

AntiSquid: what do you think of Sunak's flood of fundings Astrobytes?

Astrobytes: AntiSquid, it can only be a good thing. Temporarily at least curbing the effect of Osborne's austerity programme. Whether it helps in the longer term remains to be seen

PatrickMcGinnisII: the schools in florida are putting the lectures online now, k-12 is shutting down next week i think

Astrobytes: It depends what measures he takes in the coming months

tehHacker2000: hey AntiSquid, do you guys in london have costco

AntiSquid: wait . this reminds me of a joke someone told me

AntiSquid: it was about england having only one city: London

Astrobytes: PatrickMcGinnisII yeah, quite a few institutions in UK are doing that too

tehHacker2000: b/ many people in the U.S are literally taking everthing as if there's a war or something

Astrobytes: lol squiddy

Astrobytes: London, Europe

miszu: better be preventive early than too late

tehHacker2000: cause were getting many alerts of the virus many are taking it like a life and death situation gossiping like 40yr old moms

tehHacker2000: gotta go

PatrickMcGinnisII: Last time I went to grocery store, i bought frozen pizza and toilet paper ... u know, the essentials

Astrobytes: tehHacker2000, ofc there is a war. Trump said you're being invaded by a 'foreign virus'

AntiSquid: there are costcos in London, i don't live there though

miszu: the number we see are only ppl who went to hospital and got tested. Most people are just staying home and they never get tested. So the number are much higher

Astrobytes: Yep.

PatrickMcGinnisII: Corona virus turns Tesco into skate parks

PatrickMcGinnisII: hungry, laterz

Astrobytes: see ya

AntiSquid: recovery doesn't make you immune apparantly

AntiSquid: apparently * Q_Q

Elioh: some people that recovered got sick again from it

Astrobytes: Sort-of, they're not sure if it's reinfection or if the virus itself is biphasic

AntiSquid: EU to give migrants in Greece €2,000 to go home seriously

whip: hehehehe

miszu: The wife's PM of Canada got corona as well

miszu: well she is sick with same symptoms as corona

Elioh: this sucks really

whip: wow so sad sadsad

miszu: this is not Ebola guys. We got this

Trollmen: it's a flu, you can get flu again

Astrobytes: It's not a 'flu

arkwaw: Its cheaper to give them 2k euro than to keep them here

arkwaw: i guess

MSmits: the virus has more in common with the common cold than the flu doesnt it?

MSmits: except it's way worse

MSmits: common cold actually being corona and other viruses

reCurse: It really isn't about the virus symptoms as much as the propagation and crossing the breaking point of existing support like hospitales

MSmits: and the flu being influenza... something completely different

Astrobytes: there are some coronaviruses causing common cold yes, the similarity with influenza is how the disease presents itself

MSmits: yes, people keep focusing on the fatality rate, which is already way worse than any other common virus

MSmits: but the hospitalization rate is extreme

Astrobytes: Plus it's novel

reCurse: The resulting pressure on health care, supply chains and whatever else is the real concern here

Astrobytes: And on the loose in the wild

Astrobytes: yes reCurse

MSmits: that and avoiding contact with vulnerable people

miszu: thank god we are developers so human contact is limited haha

AntiSquid: i like UK's solution, just hire more nurses and doctors (ignoring the higher cost of living)

Astrobytes: Well, take my example. Myself and my mother care for my elderly grandfather who's got alzheimer's

Astrobytes: I'm now quarantined, my mum has to take over all duties

Default avatar.png TheFlamingCastle_b738: Death rate isn't really high if we take iinto account that A LOT of people with it won't know they have it. Problem is the pressure on health care, as reCurse said

MSmits: how does she know for sure she's not been infected Astrobytes ?

Astrobytes: She has to have contact with my grandad because there is no-one else to care for him

Astrobytes: She doesn't

MSmits: TheFlamingCastle_b738 the death rate is crazy high... 20 times higher than the flue.

MSmits: flu

Astrobytes: The point being - there is nobody to care for him otherwise

AntiSquid: there are people who are immune to it and carry it?

Astrobytes: Essentially-speaking yes, same with most communicable infections

reCurse: So I heard yeah

MSmits: a bigger problem is people carrying it and not know they have it yet

MSmits: not that many people immune atm

Default avatar.png Wilster: im immune

Astrobytes: Some people just develop sniffles, or a headache

Astrobytes: But are still infectious

AntiSquid: and so is Kim Jung Un, Wilster what's your point?

miszu: you can be asymptomatic and still be contagious

MSmits: it's kinda strange for me. My prime minister just ordered a ban on all gatherings on events with more than 100 people

miszu: same thing in Canada for 250+ ppl

MSmits: but just today I took a test in a very small classroom with 30 students

Trollmen: gather 99.break the system

MSmits: which is arguably worse

Astrobytes: Yep, between 100-500 people depending on country

reCurse: It's not about consistency as much as limiting

miszu: those measure is to reduce propagation so the health care doesn't get saturated

reCurse: Canceling events is the easier thing to do for now

reCurse: Up next will be schools and work places

MSmits: just saying, the density of the people is probably more important than the amount of them

Trollmen: ukrain closed schools

reCurse: It's both

AntiSquid: permanently

miszu: of course density. When someone sneeze or cough, it radius of contamination is about 2m due to water droplets

Astrobytes: Yes, 1 person can infect 2-3 others, proximity and density matters

AntiSquid: london subway

MSmits: I also travel by public transport

MSmits: probably not the best way to go

AntiSquid: 1 person can infect everyone else

Astrobytes: AntiSquid, that's where I picked up H1N1

AntiSquid: actually best example is the UK superspreader

MSmits: Astrobytes do you keep a collection?

Astrobytes: lol

Astrobytes: Perhaps I should start

reCurse: I thought storm chasing was a bit weird, but virus chasing dude?

miszu: just don't put your fingers in your mouth, eyes and nose and wash your hands when you get home. You reduce drastically your chances

Astrobytes: hehehe

Astrobytes: Jsut for clarification, I contracted H1N1 via London subway lol

miszu: how bad was your symptoms?

Astrobytes: It was f*king horrible. Worst 'flu I had by far

MSmits: that had a lower fatality than corona I think, didnt it?

Astrobytes: I got sent home from the restaurant as I almost passed out in the kitchen

Astrobytes: Yes MSmits, only SARS + MERS are higher iirc

miszu: I remember the H1N1 when I was in high school. They rushed students to get vaccine. Then next day those ppl got sick because of vaccine side effect

AntiSquid: interesting :

Astrobytes: Happens, but usually not as severe as actually contracting it

Astrobytes: What's interesting AntiSquid?

MSmits: AntiSquid thinks the CDC is weaponizing it

AntiSquid: that's not what the article says

Astrobytes: lol, if we never cultured the pathogens we encounter how would we learn anything?

MSmits: I know :P

MSmits: at work I put my food next to the cultured pathogens my biology colleages keep in the fridge

Astrobytes: Their old sandwiches? :P

MSmits: no, actual petri dish stuff

Astrobytes: wtf

MSmits: there's at least 10 cm. between my food and it, no worries

Astrobytes: Dude

MSmits: well they're not actually allowed to grow dangerous bacteria :P

MSmits: at least those ones, you can see

Astrobytes: It's easy to accidentaly grow dangerous bacteria, moulds and fungi

Astrobytes: *accidentally

MSmits: also, I drink from what is basically a giant baby bottle

MSmits: which is my food :P

reCurse: TIL the less I know about MSmits the better

MSmits: :P

MSmits: hey, this is real coder stuff

Astrobytes: Bovine fetish, baby bottles, bacterial lunches

MSmits: this way of consuming food was invented by coders

Astrobytes: ALADDIN

MSmits: to be able to spend more time coding

Trollmen: can somebody point me in the right directing with horse-racing duels - easy puzzle?

Trollmen: no idea how to do it with 1 iteration

reCurse: →

AntiSquid: MSmits is an Anatomy Park, like the santa from Rick and Morty?

reCurse: Oh dear

MSmits: define anatomy park

miszu: Do you want the Aladdin news or the Aladdin news?

AntiSquid: watch rick and morty MSmits

Astrobytes: He can't, it's not Disney

Astrobytes: :P

reCurse: Not yet (tm)

MSmits: hey, I dont just watch Disney

AntiSquid: MSmits

MSmits: a month or so ago I watched the power rangers movie

MSmits: which incidentally, also features Naomi Scott who sang that great song speechless.... go listen

Astrobytes: lol reCurse, indeed

Astrobytes: So you just have a thing for Naomi Scott then MSmits? :D

MSmits: just that song :P

Astrobytes: But... Power Rangers

reCurse: I think this chat needs a quarantine

MSmits: hey, there wasnt anything else on netflix

Astrobytes: "wasnt anything else on netflix" featuring Naomi Scott?

MSmits: reCurse be open to new experiences

MSmits: that too Astrobytes

Astrobytes: :grin:

Astrobytes: If nothing else, it's keeping my spirits up

MSmits: yeah, it must suck for you to be forced to stay home like that

MSmits: especially with having to care for family

Astrobytes: It wouldn't suck so much if I felt OK

MSmits: for me, it would just be the same as always, basically

MSmits: oh you actually have the virus for sure?

Astrobytes: Not for sure no, but I was told that the symptoms match therefore I must quarantine

AntiSquid: you have time to fix your bot Astrobytes

MSmits: ah I see

Astrobytes: Trying AntiSquid, in between lying down

AntiSquid: MadKnightMachine_6af9 imagine getting into self isolation just to fix your CSB

MSmits: well if they are flu symptoms... flu is a lot less common than the common cold is, right?

Astrobytes: It's 'flu season

MSmits: yeah, but the real influenza, dont you contract that like once every 5 years or so?

MSmits: much more rare than the common cold

MSmits: or diarrhea from noro virus or similar, you get that more often also

Astrobytes: Yeah, I last had proper 'flu in... a few years ago

AntiSquid: last i had to call of sick was >5 years ago

Astrobytes: But you can contract 'flu every year technically

MSmits: sure

MSmits: I have no problem calling in sick with the common cold

MSmits: you're doing everyone a favor

Astrobytes: Try cheffing MSmits, unless you're collapsing or dead you don't get a day off

reCurse: Not many employers are that... progressive?

MSmits: i *really* dont want my chef to have a common cold

Astrobytes: Never go out and eat

reCurse: It's definitely not about what you want

MSmits: just reiterating the favor part :)

Astrobytes: In an ideal world, it would be like that

MSmits: as a teacher, i'm the only one who has a real problem when i stay home with a cold

MSmits: I'm supposed to make sure the students can keep learning

reCurse: One might even say you spark joy whenever you do

MSmits: and noone replaces me

MSmits: mostly yes, reCurse

Astrobytes: haha

Astrobytes: You don't have supply/agency teachers as backup?

MSmits: sometimes students panic when it takes too long

MSmits: not for a few weeks no

MSmits: only when it takes months

Astrobytes: So the students just don't have your class at all?

MSmits: they have books, a plan, I have an e-mail adress

MSmits: thats about it

AntiSquid: MSmits best to cook your own food at home, even if no chef has cold

MSmits: orrr... put powder in a bottle and add water, like I do

reCurse: Ignorance is bliss

Astrobytes: it's not Huel or something MSmits

MSmits: something like that, I tried Huel, it was horrible

Astrobytes: It's called 'Huel' for a reason

MSmits: not sure what it means, but it doesnt sound too good no

Astrobytes: The sound you make as it leaves your stomach again

MSmits: lol

reCurse: Direction unclear

Astrobytes: lol, back from whence it came

AntiSquid: cesarian section

Astrobytes: ...

struct: what was that windows app that was mentioned here before to run ubuntu?

struct: Was like yesterday

struct: or before yesterday

AntiSquid: WSL ?

struct: yes

struct: ty

struct: ok

struct: maybe no that

struct: not*

Astrobytes: a VM struct?

struct: ok it is that

Astrobytes: Make up your mind or delete

struct: its WSL

Astrobytes: cool

Astrobytes: That's win 10 only right? Along with the new cmd shell?

reCurse: Unrelated

Astrobytes: No I mean they're both win 10 only right?

reCurse: Yes

MSmits: Oracle VM

MSmits: that's what I have

reCurse: No

Astrobytes: I need to upgrade this box of mine

Astrobytes: Still on 8.1 (was for compatibility issues before I get shot down)

reCurse: because of the virus?

reCurse: Getting harsh in UK

MSmits: wait what, they're shooting you down?

Astrobytes: lol

Astrobytes: Yeah, death squads and everything.

Zenoscave: reCurse SIGILL when doing avx usually means cpu can't handle the instruction yeah?


Zenoscave: no

reCurse: Yeah or you fucked something up real bad

MSmits: why would the signal be ill?

Zenoscave: hm

MSmits: corona?

Zenoscave: lmao

reCurse: illegal instruction

struct: just run from AVX

Astrobytes: illegal MSmits

MSmits: o

Zenoscave: cpuinfo the only way to see instruction sets?

reCurse: Dunno about the only way

reCurse: It's one

Zenoscave: ok thank you

struct: what function are you trying zeno?

Zenoscave: _mm256_set1_epi16

reCurse: There's cpuid but it's a bit arcane

struct: what cpu you have?

Zenoscave: the CG ones XD

reCurse: Multi or optim/puzzle

Zenoscave: optim

reCurse: Optim might be limited to AVX1

Astrobytes: Are they on different machines?

reCurse: Yes

reCurse: Used to at least

reCurse: Dunno if they changed

Astrobytes: I see

Zenoscave: cpuinfo says avx2...

reCurse: Ok so you fucked up

reCurse: Grats

Zenoscave: Thank!!!!

struct: did you enable avx2?

Zenoscave: -mavx2 right?

struct: #pragma GCC target("avx2")

Zenoscave: yeah


Zenoscave: the avx512vl/bw is a different problem probably I'll fix later

Astrobytes: Waiiiit you can execute that on CG?

Zenoscave: why wouldn't you?

Astrobytes: It never occurred to me, frankly

Zenoscave: well there ou go

reCurse: Don't you have to include some header

Zenoscave: yeah i ellided that


  1. include <immintrin.h>

struct: lol


reCurse: Don't enable avx512

reCurse: That's probably why you're having trouble

Zenoscave: ok Ill try that

MSmits: oh yea, it doesnt have 512 registers right?

MSmits: 256 max

struct: yes only avx2

struct: so 8 floats or 4 doubles max

reCurse: That has nothing to do with registers

reCurse: Unless you meant 512 bits

reCurse: Well I guess you did

reCurse: You're not *that* weird :P

MSmits: I'm quite weird, but i did mean 512 bits

struct: You should try it MSmits

struct: I think you will enjoy it

MSmits: I did

struct: when?

reCurse: Just need to pay the few thousand $ premium

MSmits: the problem is not my lack of getting it to work, it's the creativity required to improve something with it

MSmits: so far I have only heard it improving bots with physics sims, running several in parallel

MSmits: I would love to see example code and steal this

MSmits: struct I used it to calculate UCB inverse square roots in parallel

MSmits: but the loading overhead was too large

reCurse: I'd really like AVX512 it has nice NN instructions

MSmits: matrix multiplication?

dbdr: will AVX512 end up in general CPUs in a few years?

reCurse: Don't think so

reCurse: It's too big

dbdr: or it's more for specialized hardware?

reCurse: And AI has moved away from CPUs

reCurse: Well deep learning anyway

MSmits: seems so hard to code anything on a gpu

dbdr: IIRC, AVX512 is very modular too, lost of separate features

reCurse: Yeah but it's already a pain dealing with SSE vs AVX

miszu: tenserflow ftw

reCurse: And supporting all the different codes

reCurse: Nah tf sucks

MSmits: AVX is easier to code than a gpu. Unless my experience with unity compute shaders doesnt represent gpu coding properly

reCurse: Well it is easier because you're still in a general computing framework

reCurse: Obviously

MSmits: right

MSmits: it's weird, you're basically feeding images into a gpu

MSmits: as input

reCurse: vectors of numbers

MSmits: yes, but they use the same data types that are used for images, pixel shaders and such

reCurse: Oh you meant compute shaders

MSmits: yeah

reCurse: mb

reCurse: It's a hack but a good one

reCurse: Since there's no standard for gpgpu

reCurse: Unless you count "everyone buy nvidia" as one

dbdr: openCL?

MSmits: I also did a bunch of vertex/pixel shader tutorials, but it seems horrible to code anything for gpu. Worst is the backward compatibility. You put code in there barely understanding why, because otherwise it breaks something noone remembers

reCurse: OpenCL is not used seriously by anyone unless I'm mistaken

dbdr: that's also what I read


dbdr: looks impressive

dbdr: so the question is why it's not used

reCurse: It's complicated

dbdr: maybe it works but you get less performance

reCurse: But the bottom line is nvidia put a lot of money to be the most attractive by far

reCurse: In terms of performance, lilbraries, support, you name it

dbdr: sure, they benefit from locking people in

reCurse: So OpenCL never got enough attention to get traction

reCurse: That and standardizing implementation of high performance is a bit hard

dbdr: always sad to see lockin instead of a standard with healthy competition

reCurse: But I'm no expert so take that with a huge grain of salt

Astrobytes: Do nvidia officially support linux yet? (I'm a bit behind)

reCurse: Yeah

reCurse: Closed source but they have drivers

Astrobytes: Progress at least I suppose

reCurse: They pulled out of macos world though

reCurse: Mostly thanks to apple though nvidia is no angel

Astrobytes: Quite

dbdr: obligatory ;)

Astrobytes: lol

reCurse: Is there anything or anyone linus has not said fuck you to

reCurse: It loses impact after a bit

Astrobytes: Users, devs, manufacturers... yep

dbdr: this one is famous

Astrobytes: All his fuck you's are famous

Astrobytes: :D

dbdr: which other ones?

AntiSquid: so did they eventually get laid?

Astrobytes: Didn't he at least admit to being an arsehole at some point in the last few years?

reCurse: Yeah but that it was necessary yada yada

Astrobytes: Or something along those lines

reCurse: A non-apology if I've seen one

dbdr: well, he's also know to be rude to some people who contribute code he thinks is crap

AntiSquid: that's what the D community does a lot

dbdr: but he also made a point that's better than to be polite and let your code become infected

reCurse: That's such a strawman

reCurse: Anyway

dbdr: I don't like that style. but I also don't think it's purely straman

reCurse: Because obviously those are the only two options

reCurse: Be an asshole and have good code, be nice and have shitty code

reCurse: :rolling_eyes:

dbdr: agreed, there's a continuum

Astrobytes: Linus will always divide opinion, I think he likes it and is quite deliberate

reCurse: He just enjoys being an asshole

reCurse: No need to excuse it

Astrobytes: Yes, that's it distilled

dbdr: like many things, it can be also that there is a "media" focus on the most extreme cases. which are real for sure. but might give a distorted view too.

dbdr: “I want to apologize to the people that my personal behavior hurt and possibly drove away from kernel development entirely,” he wrote in a letter posted to a Linux forum <>. “I am going to take time off and get some assistance on how to understand people’s emotions and respond appropriately.”

dbdr: that's what astrobytes referred to I guess

MSmits: why would you be driven away by that

reCurse: That sounds cooked up

Astrobytes: Yep dbdr

MSmits: it's not like he's the first guy in that line of work to be insensitive to other people's feelings :P

AntiSquid: uhm Bill Gates was super rude to his employees ...

reCurse: Oh ok it's all good then

AntiSquid: it's non news

dbdr: reCurse: it's in the eye of the beholder I guess

reCurse: Rather amused :)

Astrobytes: When I was first intro'd to linux back in 2000/2001-ish my tech lead told me Linus was "somewhere between genius and massive knob-end"

dbdr: why not both?

dbdr: people are complex

AntiSquid: like flowers with thorns

Astrobytes: Hence the "somewhere between"

Astrobytes: Uncertainty principle and all that

Astrobytes: :P

Astrobytes: You can't measure knob-endianness and genius at the same time

dbdr: is there big and little-knob-endianness? ;)

Astrobytes: lol of course

AntiSquid: knob-leaderboard :thinking:

dbdr: TIL Neil Armstrong is contributing to the kernel

dbdr: :D

Astrobytes: lol, even got some 'space' in there too

dbdr: true :D

dbdr: maybe it was B&W in 1969, but it's in color now

Astrobytes: Neil discovered something when in space you see

Astrobytes: lol yes exactly


Astrobytes: hehe classic, great show that

dbdr: indeed

Astrobytes: Peep Show was even better imo

MSmits: first singer-songwriter on the moon :)

Zenoscave: I fixed it. turns out I was using avx512 instructions and those aren't quite available on CG lol

Zenoscave: thanks recurse

reCurse: :+1:

MSmits: man, I didnt understand most of what you guys discussed, but that was pretty much the only thing i already knew :P

MSmits: coulda asked me :P

Zenoscave: Thanks retroactively Msmits!

MSmits: lol

struct: Dont use FMA instructions aswell

struct: they also start with _mm256


Zenoscave: been using this to see what was available

Astrobytes: *retrospectively I believe (sorry)

Zenoscave: could be

MSmits: how can you be sure Astrobytes, you have the flu

MSmits: your brain is whacky

Astrobytes: Retroactively means you enact something at a past date

reCurse: There's nothing wrong with fma

reCurse: What are you talking about

MSmits: is it time travel Astrobytes

Astrobytes: Shut it Aladdin :D

MSmits: I won't be speechless :musical_note:

MSmits: :notes: speechless! :notes:

reCurse: Is that a challenge?

MSmits: i am just badly reciting lyrics from a song

Zenoscave: what's wrong with Full Metal Alchemist?

Astrobytes: MSmits likes Disney songs

MSmits: just 1!

MSmits: though, i like some from the lion king

Astrobytes: You've done it now man

Astrobytes: OH

MSmits: full metal alchemist was ok too, the movie on netflix that is

Astrobytes: I had a crazy dream a few weeks back that culminated in me wandering in some garage/basement holding what can only be described as a monkfish mouth, which was singing "Can You Feel The Love Tonight"

Astrobytes: @MSmits re Lion King

MSmits: was this before you had the virus?

Astrobytes: Yup

MSmits: then I got nuthin'

MSmits: love that song though

Astrobytes: I know. Neither do, nor did I.

MSmits: must be elton john... noone else

Astrobytes: Jeez man you're beyond help

Astrobytes: :D

MSmits: probably

Astrobytes: Fun fact:. "Kings and vagabonds" - my sister had hearing issues as a child and sang "Kings and Dragamons"

MSmits: sounds better

MSmits: btw, I am still fitting oware params

Astrobytes: I'm just failing

MSmits: still insane how sensitive these params are

reCurse: /ban MSbits

MSmits: I found a set that beats recurse, agade and robo

MSmits: the new versions

MSmits: but it gets slaughtered by my old bot =/

Astrobytes: And no one else right?

Astrobytes: It's bonkers

MSmits: yeah it is

Astrobytes: brb

reCurse: I'm adressing exploitation next

MSmits: i wouldnt say it's overfitted when it beats 3 separate NN's

reCurse: Your shenanigan days are over soon

MSmits: :P

MSmits: there's always a new shenanigan around the corner

MSmits: what does exploitation do?

reCurse: fwiw I have around 30 versions that may or may not respond better to your shenanigans

reCurse: Try me

MSmits: and how would oyu adress it?

MSmits: that will be interesting reCurse

reCurse: Classified info

MSmits: oh ok, this is not common knowledge?

MSmits: my guess is that you are talking about some NN technique to remove bad flaws in the network that dont appear during training

MSmits: but can be exploited

MSmits: by a different kind of bot

reCurse: I'm talking about exploitation in the game theory sense

MSmits: so you would have to introduce some more randomness, the same kind you need to reduce overtraining?

reCurse: :zipper_mouth:

MSmits: haha, dont worry, it's not like I can use the information. It's purely academic interest :)

struct: I thought fma did not work on CG cpu

struct: my bad

MSmits: you'll find this interesting reCurse

struct: Now I see it does


MSmits: parameter winrate

MSmits: added up: you + robo + agade

MSmits: see how sensitive it is

reCurse: Somehow not overfitting :thinking:

MSmits: well vs 3 NNs...

MSmits: its hard to overfit vs 3 separate bots isnt it?

reCurse: Not necessarily?

reCurse: You're talking about 3 bots that trained with more or less the same technique

MSmits: all versions of my bot had very different winrates vs your bots though, sometimes it won 0 vs Robo and 40 against you, sometimes the other way around

darkhorse64: > If I have correctlyHave you considered doing shallow

MSmits: but sure, i guess if you try enough combinations...

darkhorse64: oops

Astrobytes: broken ankle again darkhorse64? ;)

darkhorse64: Have you considered doing shallow minimax instead of evaluating nodes ?

MSmits: me?

AntiSquid: shallow ingrown toe nail

darkhorse64: Astrobytes : :stuck_out_tongue:

darkhorse64: MSmits: yes

MSmits: mmh

MSmits: how does that work

darkhorse64: When you expand, you eval all child nodes, go one or two stages further à la minimax

MSmits: hmm

MSmits: sounds very expensive though

Astrobytes: The tradeoff might be worth it

MSmits: would you then backprop 1 value or several?

reCurse: ??

Astrobytes: Only one?

MSmits: I mean... when i do an expansion now, I backprop each child

MSmits: added up

Astrobytes: Oh do you mean cumulative from whatever depth

darkhorse64: I have tried that with my poor eval: the bot was slightly weaker but the number of visited nodes grew to 8M first turn with depth 1 minimax

reCurse: You don't touch your tree

Astrobytes: ahhh the minimax is your eval score

MSmits: darkhorse64, you eval each child as well dont you? I mean without the minimax?

MSmits: and then back prop the total value?

MSmits: divided by the number of children?

MSmits: or am I doing that wrong

darkhorse64: Yes total value, and visits = number of nodes

MSmits: ok but with the minimax that is different?

Astrobytes: that's the score you backprop

Astrobytes: if I'm not mistaken

MSmits: yes but it's not 6 scores then?

MSmits: or is it no longer mcts?

MSmits: are you doing a best first kind of minimax?

MSmits: :confused:

Astrobytes: (I'm just guessing, I've only ever read about this)

darkhorse64: I have not played a lot with this idea mainly because my eval is not good. May be true minimax is better or just expansion with full backprop. Don't know but the number of explored nodes increase a lot and there may be something to gain from it

MSmits: hmm but why do the amount of explored nodes increase?

darkhorse64: You skip costly UCB

MSmits: right so, it's a full minimax tree?

MSmits: except it's best first?

darkhorse64: Actually, the UCB directs you to a group of nodes to explore not only at depth 0 but at 1 or 2

Zenoscave: I'm 1 Point behind marchet

MSmits: ahh ok, so you spend much more time in a branch

MSmits: less selection happening

darkhorse64: Yes. Once again, I have no proof that it works but it looks interestig

MSmits: what do you put on the nodes? Is this the minimax score? How does the minimax score turn into regular ucb score

darkhorse64: *interesting*

MSmits: no i am very interested

Astrobytes: Guess some scaling is involved

Astrobytes: There's a few papers out there on it iirc, but don't take my virus-addled word for it :P

MSmits: yeah, I've seen some stuff like that, but not exactly that

darkhorse64: I put the scores at depth 1, the combined scores at depth 0, true back propagation. My reasoning is that I may explore further these nodes and I want to build my tree like MCTS does. That may be wrong

MSmits: yeah.. who knows

MSmits: it may depend on the game also

Astrobytes: Usually does it seems

MSmits: yeah

darkhorse64: I have 5 MCTS bots, each has a different flavor

MSmits: mine are all different too

MSmits: do you use 0 and 1 for players or -1 and 1

MSmits: I like -1 and 1 for score multiplication but 0 and 1 for arrays

MSmits: win loss are always 1 and -1 for me

darkhorse64: 0, 1 for players, -1,0,1 for scores. I forgot to say that I use also eval scaled and clamped to 1

MSmits: ah same as I do in oware

MSmits: if this submit doesnt reach 1 I'll stop. reCurse is gonna submit a different version anyway. He's probably got several that beat my bot

MSmits: just wanna end 2 :)

darkhorse64: for my shallow expansion. My current bot is still > 0 = Win with early playout termination

MSmits: ?

MSmits: what is > 0 = ?

darkhorse64: Sorry. If eval > 0, count a win, etc ...

MSmits: ohh ok

MSmits: it improved mine when i changed

MSmits: but I really dont trust any parameter fit anymore

MSmits: I just test it vs the NN's and then it wins :P

MSmits: but reCurse is right, might just be an overfitting artefact...

darkhorse64: I remember you shortened rollouts when your eval improved. So it's not EPT anymore, shallow minimax is a natural extension on what you are doing

MSmits: hmm

MSmits: it is kind of wasteful to go all the way down the tree and then not do very much :)

darkhorse64: Great! You push me and you lower the NNs. reCurse is going to think we are teaming

MSmits: you're welcome :)

MSmits: I was worried it would do badly against bots other than the nn's but it does ok

MSmits: I can keep it

Astrobytes: very nice MSmits

MSmits: sure, but if reCurse is right, it is also a bit cheesy maybe. I suspect that if any of you guys do a chain submit, it will leave reCurse mostly untouched and pull me back down

MSmits: his bot is more versatile

darkhorse64: For what I see, your winrate against me has decreased (from nearly 100 % to 80%)

Astrobytes: I'll see how many I can squeeze in tonight

MSmits: too litle statistics though darkhorse64

darkhorse64: Possibly but I see more wins from me in this submit than in the 10 previous ones


darkhorse64: combined

MSmits: you might be right

MSmits: this is also why it lost to my previous bot

MSmits: you can tell from the win % that i trained vs the NN's :P

MSmits: it's kind of cool that this is even possible though

MSmits: gonna try to orthogonalize some params

MSmits: try to make them less dependent on eachother, reduces the effect of overtraining, local minima and such maybe

MSmits: for example, kroo params grow with seedcount but I also have a seedcount param

MSmits: there should only be 1 of them growing

darkhorse64: Is that something you can really control ?

Default avatar.png OualiMaher: what you say

MSmits: well my kroo thingy is basically a growing periodic function

MSmits: I want to make it just periodic and put the growing into the seedcount

MSmits: eliminate 1 para

MSmits: +m

MSmits: so a fixed amplitude periodic function for the kroo, then a different param to give more score for higher seedcount

darkhorse64: growing with the #seeds in the kroo ?

MSmits: yeah

AntiSquid: MSmits how come you second with that win rate?

MSmits: re curse had a lead

MSmits: not enough games in a single submit

AntiSquid: resub?

MSmits: already did twice, pulled him down a little

AntiSquid: if you keep getting 70% you should get 1st no?

darkhorse64: periodic because a kroo that reaches the opponent side has more value

MSmits: but i dont chain submit unless it's deserved

AntiSquid: 70% win rate = deserved imo

MSmits: right now it's only deserved because I beat him after overtraining vs the nns. I do much worse than the nns versus the others

MSmits: so any of them submitting would pull me back down

MSmits: it's pointless

AntiSquid: pull you down how?

MSmits: by losing all battles vs re curse and winning 20% vs me

Astrobytes: Losing against the NN's with occasional wins agains Smits

Astrobytes: o beat me to it

MSmits: and another thing, i am probably just 70% vs this particular version of re curses bot

MSmits: and probably 30% vs another

MSmits: he can just submit a different one

AntiSquid: how do you know who even has a diff one?

MSmits: he just said he has 30 versions

MSmits: they take half an hour to train

AntiSquid: lol

darkhorse64: One for each core

MSmits: it takes days for me to fnd the right params to beat one of his versions :P

AntiSquid: 30 sounds redundant .

AntiSquid: overredundant

MSmits: if I want a permanent place on the nr 1, i could always go the book-route

MSmits: but I dont feel like it atm

AntiSquid: ugh just do it

MSmits: it takes a week to write the code

AntiSquid: it's the only way

MSmits: then another week or two to even get a good enough book

AntiSquid: it's your destiny MSmits, do it

MSmits: all the while I lose precious calc time I need to beat karliso at uttt :)

MSmits: I still win 45% :(

MSmits: moar games!

MSmits: Games played: 1,328,015 Nodes created: 3,068,857

AntiSquid: how come karliso always seem to wreck everyone else really badly?

MSmits: no idea, but he doesnt wreck me really badly

MSmits: he wrecks me a lil'

MSmits: he does have some weird opening book scheme that goes really deep in some branches and not at all in others

MSmits: I just do an exploration 2 wide search, not countering anyone

MSmits: I suppose i could just take his bot, note his starting sequence and counter that... but that's a temporary fix

MSmits: he can just run his own program for a day and end up with a new starting sequence

MSmits: nope... all i can do is... moar games!

reCurse: :unamused:

MSmits: hey, be glad, I am not doing this on oware :p

reCurse: In a way you already are

MSmits: really.. I am just messing with 10 parameters

MSmits: you have thousands :P

Astrobytes: I think the end result is the same, or similar rather

MSmits: also the opening book thing is not overfitting if you just keep it to a single parameter

MSmits: (exploration)

MSmits: and not counter anyone specific

MSmits: currently for uttt, that is what I do

MSmits: a NN is similar in that regard, it just tries to counter any "good" bot, not a specific bot.

MSmits: you're right that what i did with oware is a bit different. I was really just picking the only 3 bots that had any chance vs mine and use that as a reference. If there were more bots, I'd add them to the list. But yeah I guess that made it overfit =/

reCurse: Well I guess it's either I run a batch of random versions until I find an overfit too

reCurse: Or I finish my new training

reCurse: Or both

MSmits: I'm redoing my parameter setup to make it less vulnerable to overfitting. I really do prefer to have a bot that's strong overall

reCurse: As long as your baseline is batching against my bot and robo's it will overfit

MSmits: I added darkhorse now

reCurse: shrug

MSmits: dunno what else to do

MSmits: its gonna be worse if i play against myself

MSmits: how should i fit params otherwise?

reCurse: With 10 parameters yeah

darkhorse64: I'm proud to be your sparring partner

MSmits: :)

MSmits: btw it's also Agade

MSmits: so 4 bots

reCurse: There's only 2 bots that matter

reCurse: And you know it

MSmits: I added him to reduce overfitting and because some of my versions lost a lot of games vs him

MSmits: the most typical result would be 70% winrate vs Agade, 40-50% vs you and somewhere between 40 and 70% vs Robo

MSmits: actually no, between 20 and 70... I overfit the most vs him I think

MSmits: but reCurse, there is no need to bother with submitting a new bot. you'll remain at 1

MSmits: at least, I wont spam this one more than the two submits I just did

MSmits: I will try another if I succeed in creating one with 2 less params in total that are also more orthogonal. it's an experiment.

MSmits: or maybe if i try darkhorse64's minimax idea

Default avatar.png AguliRojo: How do i start it? I cannot wrap my hand around it to do any simple command

MadKnight: AguliRojo

MadKnight: start what?

HungryBurger: I'm guessing Aguli is asking about how to use CodinGame to help him learn how to code.

Z_Doctor: I think you learn the basics of a language and you use this site to practice what you learned

HungryBurger: Indeed, that's about what I tell others.

HungryBurger: Ironically, I always credit CodinGame for "helping me learn Python" in the sense of "giving me so many opportunities to practice Python that I was able to teach myself".

miszu: Question for C++, why there is no core dump or error when your program has issue?