datdood: why are there bots on this site?
MadKnight: Automaton2000 why? explain us
Automaton2000: if i did it before
MadKnight: they were before there were bots datdood so it's ok
MadKnight: Automaton2000 says that
Automaton2000: i had a lot of languages
Emmaplayz: bla bla bla
datdood: ?
datdood: that made no sense
datdood: why are there bots?
typingm: Hey all. Coming back after being away for a while. In CoC, if I play with JavaScript and use the "print" function, the syntax highlighting crosses out the word "print," which I haven't seen before. Any idea what might be going on there? I thought print was added as a convenience for CoC code golfing so JavaScripters don't have to write out console.log?
typingm: I should add, print still works, it's just crossed out.
VizGhar: typingm you see something like this? If you don't get response here in chat, try to report it using forum. It's pretty active there too https://www.codingame.com/forum/t/disabling-pycodestyle/188260
typingm: Interesting, thanks. I'll take a look.
StrideNYC: This AI bot thing is so dope!
StrideNYC: I'm on the first one. Just unlocked boost :o
Uljahn: ye, very addictive :)
slvt_c0d3r: LF> coding gf
StrideNYC: what lol
slvt_c0d3r: dont worry about it kid
S3w3r_R4t: wut? i heard my name :3
StrideNYC: You got it, old man ;)
jacek: good morning
Mirou26: HELLO
AntiSquid: morning
VizGhar: Is there any bot game with more then 4 players? I'm really considering it as possibility right now
eulerscheZahl: 4 is the max for existing games. CG allows up to 8
VizGhar: Original of my game states 2-8 players, and I can fit them all on screen. I'll try it
eulerscheZahl: you risk some randomness in ranking that way. personally I prefer 2 player games
eulerscheZahl: but sure, go ahead
VizGhar: Can't break it while WIP :)
AI_says_hi: Hey guys I have a question: I want to try to use the genetic algorithm in Ghost in the Cell. To train it, should I create an abstract clone of the game locally and train there or is there an other way to do that?
struct: AI_says_hi have you checked post mortems?
AI_says_hi: struct yes the GitC one but he didn't use GA
AI_says_hi: struct are there some that describe it?
struct: some players used
struct: https://www.codingame.com/forum/t/ghost-in-the-cell-feedback-strategy/2634/5
AI_says_hi: okay imma go read thanks
AI_says_hi: :slight_smile::thumbsup:
lopidav: >You reached the limit of plays for a period of time
lopidav: what is this
jacek: addict detector
lopidav: but I was there for like 10 minutes
VizGhar: :D jacek you are my superhero
BOBKA: An error occurred (#314): "Submitted code is too big".
WTF? What is the limit?
jacek: lopidav and how many times you submitted
jacek: BOBKA 100k characters
lopidav: submitted once. Trying to test maybe once every 10s at my fastest
lopidav: it's working now
jacek: :thumbsup:
struct: :pensive:
struct: Finally found the bug :cry:
jacek: you fixed it and its worse?
struct: No, just fixed it
struct: dont know how
struct: Thats a problem
mzbear: maybe you didn't fix it. maybe you just rearranged things so that it doesn't bite you right now ;)
struct: Im pretty sure its fixed
struct: before it wouldnt work 2/10 times
struct: now its working 10/10 times, I know its a low sample
struct: but seems to be fine
mzbear: VizGhar: tsuro with 8 players would mean 4 moves per player until the board is full. that's a bit low
mzbear: hmm. actually, it might not be too low. i dont know. i'd have to think about the game a bit more
starmaq: hmm why are all the test cases in 208
starmaq: wait
starmaq: nvm
Avenslova: Hey guys
struct: hello
mzbear: i have a feeling that in the 8 player tsuro the nature of the game turns into trying to guess which player is holding which piece
mzbear: i have no idea how to make a bot for that
struct: I guess it was worth Reused up to depth: 4 states: 39039 time: 1
darkhorse64: It all depends if we know what each player has in hands, With many players, it will be hard to find a move that allows to survive until next turn
eulerscheZahl: JBM: "I personally don’t look at the WIP anymore, precisely because they’re too much of everything anyway"
also JBM: keeps troll vs castle as WIP for over a decade
jacek: he hasnt decided of final mechanics of the game yet
jacek: maybe 3 players version would be better
eulerscheZahl: he's hoping for more valuable feedback from the community
Noobness: can I have a question? how popular are the "bot programming" games with significant random factor (e.g. card games)?
eulerscheZahl: unpopular
Noobness: thought so, thanks
jacek: huh?
jacek: just there arent many
eulerscheZahl: locam got some hate for the draft and random order in which you get to play the cards
eulerscheZahl: random map generation, then full info of the game state (or fog in a reasonable way)
that's the popular kind of game here
jacek: yeah, no one likes random games like onitama
eulerscheZahl: it's a perfect information game
eulerscheZahl: no hidden cards that you can reveal during the game
struct: missing fog
jacek: r
Noobness: got it, thanks.. I was thinking about creating really cool card game, but.. it's a card game, so I'll think some more :)
lopidav: I was thinking about putting my tabletop game ideas here so I can balance out degenerate strategies. Will I still be able to sell the game if I do that or the license would forbid that?
struct: sell the game where=
struct: You want to use CG to balance game / strategies?
eulerscheZahl: by uploading you agree to CC2 license
lopidav: struct, yea, create it as a puzzle/game and let people make solutions/bots.
eulerscheZahl: we should warn you that community games get relatively little attention
eulerscheZahl: e.g. vindinium: 227 players since february 2019
eulerscheZahl: is one of the more popular games
lopidav: that's a lot. I think 10 somewhat active programmers is a good amount to playtest like that
lopidav: cc2 let's you share/sell etc without permission as long as there is a credit given?
Astrobytes: also, be forewarned: it's a tough crowd ;)
lopidav: *without asking for a permission
eulerscheZahl: you as a creator can sell it after publishing here
eulerscheZahl: not sure if we could do so while giving credit
eulerscheZahl: we can share for sure
lopidav: Astrobytes in which way?
eulerscheZahl: we find bugs and then complain about them. even if very minor
lopidav: >Adapt — remix, transform, and build upon the material
for any purpose, even commercially.
eulerscheZahl: ah, ok (didn't read the license in a while)
jacek: who reads license :o
Astrobytes: Legal teams jacek
struct: I didnt even know there was a license until now
eulerscheZahl: i know that i'm fine when I want to use an MIT licensed code
lopidav: CoC puzzles are kinda sold, aren't they?
struct: someday Yavalath creator comes knock at my door
jacek: how will he know its you
Astrobytes: :smirk:
eulerscheZahl: that's why you deleted your account struct?
Astrobytes: I think he'd probably be OK with it considering what it's used for
struct: exactly
Astrobytes: And you're not selling it
struct: He is ok, he knows about it
struct: aCat knows him and talked with him about it
eulerscheZahl: even got a private message from one user saying that he'll buy the board game now
eulerscheZahl: onitama
Astrobytes: Oh really? Nice
struct: yes
struct: But I published the game before knowing this
Astrobytes: haha, free advertising eh euler
Astrobytes: That's just your inner pirate struct
eulerscheZahl: and ornicar knows about Vindinium
jacek: a certain game 'board' is really cheap - just some :notebook: and :pencil:
Astrobytes: Don't be so arrrrd on yourself :P
struct: Im sure most of the people will be happy their board game is being freely advertised
eulerscheZahl: he's the one behind lichess btw
Astrobytes: yeah that's right. You asked permission first right?
eulerscheZahl: no, MIT license
Astrobytes: ah OK
eulerscheZahl: but unihedron shared a screenshot of a discord message (other server) where he was told about the CG port
Astrobytes: struct: and used for bot programming too
Astrobytes: euler: and he was cool with it I assume
eulerscheZahl: totally
Astrobytes: struct: did you fix The Bug yet?
struct: yes
struct: I added - 1 and it works now
Astrobytes: -1 to what?
struct: int nextFirstId = pool[firstId].firstChildIndex;
// This lastId - 1 fixed it??????????
int nextLastId = pool[lastId - 1].lastChildIndex;
eulerscheZahl: nextLastId
that name
Astrobytes: so my off by one was kinda right in a way
utlumurat: hello all could you advice me any source about beam search
Astrobytes: wait for firstNextLastId
struct: euler the name is not the worse about my code
struct: you should see the function I shared here the other day
struct: void Agent::think(Table* lookup, const int8(&pieces)[8][2], int8(&check)[HEIGHT * WIDTH][2], int8& checkCounter, int8(&cells)[32][2], int8(&visited)[WIDTH][HEIGHT]);
struct: was it this one?
Astrobytes: utlumurat: https://www.codingame.com/playgrounds/11358/breadth-first-search-and-beam-search-comparison
Astrobytes: yes that's the one struct
utlumurat: thank you Astrobytes
struct: That is one of many astro
struct: http://chat.codingame.com/pastebin/df90297c-f54d-46a7-83ae-6a0a99593915
Astrobytes: lol. As long as you can read it
eulerscheZahl: note: don't ask struct for help regarding clean code
eulerscheZahl: that used to be ThunderbirdOne's task :(
Emmaplayz: bla bla bla
Astrobytes: ThunderbirdOne still pops in here now and then euler
eulerscheZahl: maybe during my office hours?
Astrobytes: yeah, come to think of it I think so
Astrobytes: He's just busy with work and life iirc
eulerscheZahl: and smits comes when i'm asleep
eulerscheZahl: so smits = tooth fairy
Astrobytes: that reasoning
Astrobytes: does he leave bitboards under your pillow?
eulerscheZahl: :D
MSmits: hey, i am lurking
MSmits: i expect a tooth tonight
MSmits: better pick a fight with your neighbor
Astrobytes: :rofl:
eulerscheZahl: he keeps ordering packages and isn't at home when they arrive
Astrobytes: Definitely worthy of violent confrontation.
MSmits: yeah
MSmits: he's probably violating covid rules as well
Astrobytes: Spray paint "covidiot" on his door and break his windows. He should give you a good right hook for that at least.
Astrobytes: Disclaimer: Don't.
MSmits: lol
LastRick: That's no way to dislodge a tooth. Didn't none of y'all watch Santa Clause 2?
Astrobytes: The Tim Allen one?
LastRick: yes
Astrobytes: Hm, I only recall seeing the first one.
LastRick: the middle, oft overlooked one has a lot of Tooth Fairy in it for some reason
Astrobytes: we already established that MSmits is the tooth fairy
darkhorse64: MSmits: I could not get the bias thing for win/teccles/freemoves in my select to work, so I made it really dirty: bypass search for "teccles" strategy and play it straight. I moved from the 19th to 12th (1.5 ELO more). Not too bad for 10 lines
Astrobytes: I thought that was what people were doing with the teccles heuristic anyway
advq: Hello, Can I get this week puzzle link; thanks!
eulerscheZahl: https://www.codingame.com/multiplayer/optimization/2048
advq: thanks man; I deleted from notifications haha
darkhorse64: I was thinking that biasing search would be enough. Actually, it just like I have an opening book not very deep
eulerscheZahl: while submitting the default code is enough for the quest, you are supposed to optimize your score at that puzzle
darkhorse64: Don't. I want to score more points with my one liner
Astrobytes: there probably is a way to do it via biasing but whether it would be better, I'm not sure
Astrobytes: darkhorse64: I pm'd you a nice combination previously
darkhorse64: It's in production (as in farming)
darkhorse64: Actually, it's a kind of optimisation: which arrangement of the four letters will score the most
darkhorse64: I guess euler is bad reading me
darkhorse64: *mad*
eulerscheZahl: not at all
darkhorse64: Of course, scoring < 0.1% of the best mark is not really an achievement
darkhorse64: Already +50 people for the puzzle; dbdr is harvesting
Skynse: println!("Hello everyone");
darkhorse64: Only python code is accepted
darkhorse64: :relaxed:
eulerscheZahl: but the highest ranked among the new players is at #39
Westicles: You should try it, pretty fun
Westicles: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/327912401_Comparison_of_Expectimax_and_Monte_Carlo_algorithms_in_Solving_the_online_2048_game/link/5bacdd4092851ca9ed2a29ce/download
darkhorse64: I have seen also n-tuple based solutions
eulerscheZahl: while the number of default code submissions increased from 8 to 34
eulerscheZahl: *35
lastrick i see what you are doing
LastRick: Probably silly Q about 2048: What's the significance of the test names?
eulerscheZahl: random seed used
eulerscheZahl: (starting from empty board)
eulerscheZahl: so what you get as an input is after 2 random numbers were generated
LastRick: ok. I have to confess, I know nothing about this game. So for me, it was a perfectly reasonable Q
Emmaplayz: bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bala bal
eulerscheZahl: even if you played the game day and night, you wouldn't know those numbers
eulerscheZahl: fair warning Emmaplayz
LastRick: oh ok
Emmaplayz: what
eulerscheZahl: stop writing "bla bla bla", was your 2nd time already
Astrobytes: stop bla bla'ing or you'll be kicked
Emmaplayz: why
eulerscheZahl: yes, that
Emmaplayz: your just mean
eulerscheZahl: my just mean what?
Astrobytes: No, you're just spamming.
Emmaplayz: i did it beacuse im bored
eulerscheZahl: then the chat isn't the right place for you
Emmaplayz: what
Emmaplayz: how old are
Emmaplayz: you
JBM: eulerscheZahl: I'm not nagging you to come and moderate it, note ;p
FatPuppy: The website says you can challenge a friend.. I can't see where or does it not support a private 2 player challenge?
Emmaplayz: how old are youeulerscheZahl
eulerscheZahl: the troll game?
i want to look into your freecell contribution
struct: clash of code supports it
eulerscheZahl: that's irrelevant Emmaplayz
Emmaplayz: how do you ban
LastRick: what makes a game of 2048 end? in other words, if I just input "U", shouldn't it end when the board is filled?
eulerscheZahl: 600 turns
eulerscheZahl: CG limitations
eulerscheZahl: you can print multiple actions like ULR
eulerscheZahl: which is why the map generator is public so you know how spawns work
LastRick: it says U is invalid, is that because the pieces are already at the top?
Westicles: Hint: You can get 50M without using D (insert D joke as you see fit)
eulerscheZahl: yes LastRick. try another direction ;)
LastRick: thanks. is that in the instructions? I didn't see it. I just assume it would keep filling
eulerscheZahl: you have to make a valid push first
eulerscheZahl: might be that i missed mentioning it
eulerscheZahl: and so far no one complained as the game is well known
Westicles: yeah, just play it a few times, easier than thinking
LastRick: never assume the user has played it, especially me
eulerscheZahl: https://play2048.co/
fix it
LastRick: :)
LastRick: url blocked
eulerscheZahl: where are you? at work?
LastRick: work, home it's all the same these days :)
eulerscheZahl: true
Westicles: People don't play games any more, they just watch streams of it
LastRick: ^ so true
LastRick: people just sitting around for hours watching others play Smash, Runescape, chess. I would've never predicted Twitch. Never.
Westicles: There is another pastime popular when I was a teen going the same way
Astrobytes: not just sitting around: donating money
eulerscheZahl: meanwhile i haven't even heard of many of the now popular games
LastRick: Astro: millions. To have other watch you pay Overwatch
Astrobytes: Yeah. It's incredible.
LastRick: How am I supposed to convince some kid to study Thermo and get "a good paying" engineer job when there's this out there as another option?
Astrobytes: Right. Or becoming an "influencer"...
Astrobytes: Don't get me started.
LastRick: yep, that's all they think about now.
twitlydoof: you convince them through probability
LastRick: That moment when the chat turned into a bunch of old men, complaining about whippersnappers
Astrobytes: :older_man:
Astrobytes: Valid points regardless.
Westicles: They'll come out with a decent nootropic in the next few years and it will fix them all
CheerJia: Hello
Astrobytes: Yeah, I can see that coming Westicles
Uljahn: what is survivorship bias, Automaton2000
Automaton2000: or when you are done
jacek: AutomatonNN how old are mods
AutomatonNN: what do you mean?
Emmaplayz: nerds
Emmaplayz: :nerd:
Astrobytes: Yes?
eulerscheZahl: sorry I lost patience
Astrobytes: I almost did it earlier without a warning if I'm completely honest.
Astrobytes: And I have the patience of a saint.
LastRick: Ok, Euler, I think I'm getting the hang of it. I improved my bot 100x by inputting something other than U every time
eulerscheZahl: great
Astrobytes: now get 1st :)
eulerscheZahl: random replay of my bot: https://www.codingame.com/share-replay/517604960
eulerscheZahl: keep in mind others are much better than me
LastRick: Are you hiding some moves in the replay?
eulerscheZahl: no. combining several in a single frame
LastRick: thats what i meant. it seems like it jumps ahead
eulerscheZahl: if i generate a new frame for each move, the replay gets extremely laggy and will most likely crash your tab :(
LastRick: ok
eulerscheZahl: watch it and don't jump between frames via arrow keys
eulerscheZahl: top players get a replay duration of several hours
LastRick: ah i see what you mean. its only when you use the arrow keys that it jumps
LastRick: it seems like the general idea is the maximize the open space on the board by either combining or moving pieces to the edge
eulerscheZahl: yeah, keep the largest in the corner
eulerscheZahl: and then form some kind of snake
LastRick: yep
LastRick: like some weird extension of tron
LastRick: later gtg for a run. finally warmed up enough i wont instantly freeze
eulerscheZahl: how warm/cold is it?
eulerscheZahl: in Celsius please
LastRick: hah
LastRick: 9. sorry had to do the math :)
eulerscheZahl: not that cold at all
Dartisan: Hi, had you got the news: https://phys.org/news/2020-12-artificial-intelligence-schrdinger-equation.html
Dartisan: Thought on CodinGame when reading: Quantum Monte Carlo
Astrobytes: wave function <shudder>
Astrobytes: PTSD from materials chemistry
Astrobytes: Cool research though
Uljahn: ye, that's cool when NN gives you right results most of the time, but when it's wrong you're screwed not being able to debug or explain such a behavior
Dartisan: Yes, I like to see in which speed these domains growth currently.
RyanGilbert: Are few people online currently?
RyanGilbert: Just wondering if I should stream or not
Emmaplayz: hi
Emmaplayz: yes
Emmaplayz: i can talk
Emmaplayz: :rolling_eyes:
RyanGilbert: You're that toxic person right
RyanGilbert: >XD
ProgrammerDog: hi guys
draconis19: morning
Jyriane: hey
Jyriane: The first letter should be capitalized, the second lower, the third again capitalized,... and so on.
bugsr2bad: hello
Jyriane: :upside_down:
Czihi: What is this clash of code question XDDD
Czihi: Draw polynomial in 9x9 matrix xD
Czihi: That's kinda sick lol
Czihi: Everyone just insta submitted to be faster in getting 0% LOL
eulerscheZahl: https://www.codingame.com/contribute/view/588831b7842fe8bd570c1c303c6c2b691c89
this one?
Czihi: Exactly this one xD
Czihi: I mean, its interesting
Czihi: But judging by usual clash of code questions
Czihi: That are mainly like do something on array
Czihi: Its kinda sick heh
eulerscheZahl: i agree, doesn't look appropriate for a clash
Jyriane: :joy:
i-dont-know: aa
eulerscheZahl: 7 hours from the first to last comment for that contribution
eulerscheZahl: seems that approval was a bit rushed
Astrobytes: looks like it
PeterD26codinmaster: :grinning:
eulerscheZahl: and the equation is valid python syntax
eulerscheZahl: heavily favoring that language over others
Astrobytes: lol, so it is
eulerscheZahl: if you give a bad rating to those clashes, they'll get removed even after approval
RustyPony_f572: pikachu xd
Astrobytes: classroom time again is it?
Jyriane: :relieved:
jacek: pony eh
Piokemon: where i can join to clash?
draconis19: go to the #clash channel
LastRick: Euler how could tell that was seven hours on the submission, (I believe you) but I dont see that in the timestamps
Emmaplayz: how do you code?
draconis19: typing
draconis19: :blush:
Emmaplayz: haha
draconis19: laugh now, cuz im just getting started on this site.
draconis19: :smiling_imp:
ZarthaxX: xd
Emmaplayz: you mean XD\
Emmaplayz: youse caps
eulerscheZahl: LastRick exact time shows on mouseover
Astrobytes: yeah ZarthaxX, ECKS-DEE
ZarthaxX: LOL
LastRick: half an hour between all 3 approvals
Westicles: shameful, all just for some XP
Piokemon: how to get up in ranking?
Piokemon: clash of code?
TsakBoolhak: i guess completing clashs ^^
eulerscheZahl: not just completing. winning!
TsakBoolhak: the best place you have the best it is, i guess
TsakBoolhak: better it is*
TsakBoolhak: how, so let's say you're 2/8 your rank doesnt go up?
LastRick: yes, winning doesnt necessarily mean you'll go up
LastRick: this is my favorite social media. can i get this chat on an app? :)
draconis19: yes you can,
Astrobytes: mmm I think Jabber works, not sure what else
draconis19: just download discord
LastRick: Of course you can. I was half kidding bc of the goofy stuff that seems to happen on here
VizGhar: > The CodinGame chat uses XMPP, which means you can use an external XMPP client, such as Pidgin or Gajim.
Astrobytes: ah gotcha
NoiselessBrocolli_c9f0: super
NoiselessBrocolli_c9f0: :grinning:
ian173: How do I convince clash im not a robot
Astrobytes: Clash less
ian173: These captchas getting annoying
LastRick: I convince it by losing more
VizGhar: Aren't you one of those, that immediately leaves clash, just to get to Achievement? :)
VizGhar: += ASAP
LastRick: i'm the guy that looks at the clash and sees a novel and I'm like i aint got all day to be reading stuff
Westicles: That's what I did. Clicked through 50 to get mod rights
NoiselessBrocolli_c9f0: :100:
draconis19: what other channels are there?
Westicles: #thenaughtylady
Astrobytes: this web chat isn't linked to the discord
Astrobytes: lol
draconis19: oh
sudo-u[Artemis]: :)
sudo-u[Artemis]: it was fun
draconis19: u can finally chat when ur lvl 3
draconis19: right Astrobytes?
LastRick: sounds right
Astrobytes: yep
jacek: right AutomatonNN?
jacek: AutomatonNN where are you
AutomatonNN: more than that
Astrobytes: But you can join the discord just by clicking the link at the top
LastRick: Uh oh
LastRick: had me worried for a sec
jacek: or by pissing of the celestia
draconis19: i have an discord
MACKEYTH: Oh, wow. CoC is a whole different beast with Python
draconis19: I joined the discord I'm draconis190
VizGhar: try ruby :)
Astrobytes: nice one draconis19
draconis19: really im on your discord server
draconis19: and nice pic on discord Astrobytes
Astrobytes: same cat as my pic on here but in kitten form
Emmaplayz: ok
Emmaplayz: who cares
draconis19: cute!!
Astrobytes: still hanging around here I see Emmaplayz
Astrobytes: jacek:
https://www.codingame.com/contribute/view/596072cf63b511115793f16db1169835cdc9
draconis19: what does CG stand for?
eulerscheZahl: CodinGame
draconis19: so u have a clan?
Astrobytes: no, the [CG] indicates staff members
draconis19: oh
draconis19: in that case, ima start a private clash
draconis19: and if you want to join my clash, go to the #clash channel!
jacek: oO
Velcoro: (I'm sorry that it sounds like a humble brag question) I have 71/72 silver achievements and couldn't figure out which is the one missing.. or is it bugged?
struct: I think its from a removed puzzle
mzbear: if the achievement list doesn't have remarks on any of the entries, i'd say it's a bug regardless of whether the last achievement can be obtained or not
Velcoro: ah I see, thank you
MSmits: damn
MSmits: my D&B is going well
MSmits: I just finished a heuristic bot, just handle the endgame with some sensible heuristics. Easy top 10
RoboStac: velcoro - check the mars lander ep 1 achievement
RoboStac: theres a silver level to it you don't have
struct: robo is right
Velcoro: oh, I see, cool, thanks!
AIDRI: Is the Codingame team going to add the Julia language one day ?
MSmits: romeo and julia?
MSmits: The shakespear language>
MSmits: ?
AIDRI: ahah
AIDRI: no, this one https://julialang.org/
AIDRI: that's a very good langage
MSmits: I was serious though
MSmits: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shakespeare_Programming_Language
AIDRI: xD
mzbear: if the site starts adding esoteric languages, i want to see INTERCAL
MSmits: hey mzbear. I made 4th D&B
MSmits: no search, no end game solver
Astrobytes: lol gj
MSmits: yeah, i remember when dbdr was nr 1 and they discussed all that minimax stuff
MSmits: his bot is now 9
MSmits: so minimax is not the way to go here, at least not the way it was done before
mzbear: MSmits, i didn't finish my heuristics or I'd be a bit higher myself. My bot currently always takes a square if it can, even if that leads to enemy getting an entire chain in return
Astrobytes: you used your research in your heuristic bot though?
struct: I only know chains from STC
MSmits: i used only the basic heuristics you will find in any paper about D&B, nothing advanced. I have a few more I could add, but I am not going to bother. The solver should take care o fit
MSmits: its a bit difficult to fit in
MSmits: my solver only calculates the value of the board, it has to actually produce a move
mzbear: i'm currently looking at Bandas, i love the simplicity of the rules in this one
MSmits: yeah bandas is cool
MSmits: plain mcts works best
Astrobytes: speaking of dbd r, didn't see him around for a bit
MSmits: i saw him less than a week ago
MSmits: talking about some optim
MSmits: forgot which
MSmits: btw: My D&B bot does random moves till end game
MSmits: just to add to insult
MSmits: it just avoids giving away boxes
MSmits: and takes boxes that are given away
MSmits: so random about half the game
Astrobytes: ah cool.
lol, random then greedy
MSmits: yeah exactly
Astrobytes: love it
Astrobytes: did you check out reCurs e chess yet?
MSmits: oh, is it live>
MSmits: ?
Astrobytes: it's in WIP now yeah
MSmits: ohh ok
MSmits: well queens gambit got me back into chess, so this has become a bit more interesting to me as well, otherwise i would have probably ignored it like the go game
Astrobytes: I've not written anything for it yet but it's rather good
MSmits: i'll check it out
MSmits: hope its not too easy to just copy stockfish into it
MSmits: at least the generalized parts
Astrobytes: I doubt that
jacek: queen's gambit eh? https://i.redd.it/r5nif5jgje361.jpg
MSmits: good
Astrobytes: Queen's Gambit? You've been studying chess openings?
MSmits: awesome jacek :)
MSmits: no the series, but yeah openings too
DomiKo: jacek how you always have a meme for anything?
Astrobytes: I've never heard of the series
MSmits: i did some games on chess.com. over 1200 rating now after not playing for 30 yrs
jacek: its simple - i have no life
MSmits: you should really watch it
DomiKo: ohhh
darkhorse64: It's really a high quality contrib but I believe Chess960 should be a multi on its own. Once you have reached league 2, you are playing the crazy house variant. There is no turning back
jacek: oh there are 2 different leagues
Astrobytes: It's to avoid booking darkhorse64
jacek: yeah, its like go 9x9 13x13 19x19
struct: one is 960
struct: other is crazy house 960
darkhorse64: There is no booking at Chess960
Astrobytes: Oh wait, I thought you meant normal chess + 960
piedro: test
Metanoob: hey! just dropping a line for people who like chess. I recommend 5D chess it's on steam but you can prob find it cheaper somewhere else. It's chess with time travel basically
Astrobytes: gotcha now darkhorse64
piedro: Hello I have a question, how do you pass from wood to other leagues ?
piedro: from wood to bronze
piedro: ?
Metanoob: @piedro once you beat the boss of your league in the ranking you are getting to the next league
Astrobytes: He's considering separate contributions for each darkhorse64
jacek: you need to be above boss after you submit
Metanoob: yeah not beating, my bad, beating it's ranking
Metanoob: its*
MSmits: can someone link the contribution?
Astrobytes: oh hey Metanoob
piedro: @Metanoob I am ranked 1/46112 somehow now but still in the Wood one
MSmits: the page is lagging fo rme
Astrobytes: Chess:
https://www.codingame.com/ide/demo/865494807d115f7493e0b7fa465bc5d2780647
MSmits: probably my meta mcts hogging cpu :P
jacek: crazyhouse960 aka antimsmits chess
Metanoob: hey Astrobytes! how are you?
MSmits: :)
Astrobytes: alll good, and you?
Astrobytes: wrong link, sorry:
https://www.codingame.com/contribute/view/596072cf63b511115793f16db1169835cdc9
MSmits: 960 means the bottom row?
Metanoob: same thank you :) on holidays atm so more time to kill
MSmits: i suspect bishops still have separate colors
MSmits: oh right, it says in description
Metanoob: oh piedro, I think it may take some time depending on when you got that rank... If it has been more than a few hours I don't think I know what would cause that
struct: yeah
Astrobytes: yeah, more time to code :)
struct: also the king must start between two towers
struct: iirc
struct: rook*
MSmits: doesnt this actually make it 480 possibilities>
MSmits: symmetry>
MSmits: ?
struct: its 959 + standard
reCurse: Well at least you're not a math teacher :D
MSmits: I mean left-right
MSmits: or is that already incorporated
Metanoob: haha yes @Astrobytes
reCurse: How would the symmetry work with one queen?
MSmits: what i mean is
MSmits: you can mirror x the board
MSmits: and you get the same setup
MSmits: except mirrored = uses the same opening book movs
MSmits: so i would need to create a book for 480 starts
jacek: "Randomizing the main pieces had long been known as shuffle chess, but Fischer random chess introduces new rules for the initial random setup, "preserving the dynamic nature of the game by retaining bishops of opposite colours for each player and the right to castle for both sides".[5] The result is 960 unique possible starting positions."
Astrobytes: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fischer_random_chess
MSmits: jacek yes, but this does not incorporate horizontal mirror symnmetry I believe
jacek: x_x
darkhorse64: MSmits needs UTF32 to store all these books
darkhorse64: :relaxed:
MSmits: well consider that I use less thab 1500 moves for Yavalath and i have room for 50-80k
MSmits: It's still doable, but would take too long
darkhorse64: 960 meta MCTS
MSmits: nope 480
jacek: why 480
MSmits: maybe I am not being clear enough sorry, let me try again
MSmits: if i take all pieces on A and place them on H
MSmits: B on G
jacek: imagine standard chess, a4 isnt the same as h4
darkhorse64: Books ready for retirement
MSmits: C on F
MSmits: D on E
MSmits: i mirrored the pieces in the horizontal direction
MSmits: this is also a 960 setup
MSmits: a different one
MSmits: so these two can use the same book
jacek: are you really gonna book chess960
MSmits: in standard chess it isnt jacek
MSmits: but thats because of the king and queen
MSmits: now you can switch them
MSmits: if you take standard chess and switch king and queen, the game is exactly the same
reCurse: I am pretty sure you misunderstand
MSmits: just all moves are mirrored
reCurse: The symmetry doesn't work because of castling
MSmits: hmm how is that
jacek: ahh in 960 castling always end as standard chess
MSmits: just to be clear, I am *not* going to book this
MSmits: not even if i can
MSmits: too much work
MSmits: I like the game though, i will give it a try at some point
MSmits: btw, the different starts do share transpositions
Astrobytes: check the wiki page I linked MSmits
Astrobytes: hopefully explains some things
MSmits: hmm i see, so it has different castling left and right
MSmits: regardless of queen and kings position
MSmits: so if you mirror the game, you cant mirror all the moves
MSmits: 960 then :)
MSmits: anyone have a replay from the game?
jacek: :tada:
jacek: https://www.codingame.com/replay/517667268
Astrobytes: the day you don't question something will be a sad day indeed MSmits ;)
MSmits: share something jacek
MSmits: err
MSmits: share replay
MSmits: true Astrobytes
MSmits: *not authorized*
jacek: go to the contribution and last battles
MSmits: cant, no bot
jacek: submit something
MSmits: maybe full leaderboard
reCurse: Can't share replays for WIP?
jacek: printing random will make random move
reCurse: Sucks
MSmits: wow reCurse, you even made it beginner friendly
MSmits: it just does moves
reCurse: It even checkmates once in a blue moon.
MSmits: very cool, gj
jacek: woah, even threefold repetition detection
MSmits: mmh this will have endgame books though
reCurse: Good luck fitting those
jacek: not the second league
MSmits: small ones :)
reCurse: Do small tablebases even exist?
MSmits: whats different in second league?
MSmits: I would just generate them myself
reCurse: Crazyhouse
reCurse: aka no endgame
MSmits: ohh
MSmits: no endgame books then
reCurse: Looks like I'll be publishing both so
Astrobytes: It's AntiSmits Chess
MSmits: had to look up what crazyhouse was
jacek: all you have left is only middle books
MSmits: reCurse dont do them both at once, new multis are popular for a while before people move on. If you leave one for later, you get a second wave
reCurse: Hmm.
reCurse: They don't even get notifications, would it matter?
MSmits: people know on chat. But it's your choice obviously. I've just noticed this is how it goes
Astrobytes: I think interested parties would do both regardless
MSmits: of course
MSmits: maybe it doesnt matter, i dont know
MSmits: might be trivial to adapt
MSmits: (the bot)
reCurse: I made it so it should be straightforward to submit on both.
Astrobytes: and we'll have somewhere to point chess-y people too
Astrobytes: *to
MSmits: yeah, there's been a lot of talk about chess on CG
MSmits: might even draw some new players
Astrobytes: just the usual lack of exposure issue
hexando: first place in coder strike. I want kids from myself
struct: end game table bases are too big
struct: but maybe you can do something like it
reCurse: Personally I'd rather leave that space for a NN, if I ever get to it
jacek: 50 ms?
MSmits: struct I have 2 million positions in bandas, 50 million or so in oware I think
MSmits: you can generate them in the 1st second
MSmits: not sure how expensive chess endgame books are to generate
struct: Well you want to generate for all possible states
reCurse: They are usually downloaded rather than generated
reCurse: Might give a hint
MSmits: yes, but it depends very heavily on the number of pieces
MSmits: a 7 piece db is like 30 times bigger than a 6 piece
struct: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endgame_tablebase#Computer_chess
MSmits: i am just pulling the 30 number out of my ***
MSmits: but its a big number
MSmits: so small db might be possible in 1 second
MSmits: maybe 3 pieces
struct: I think 3 pieces is the only realistic one
Astrobytes: smits, if you somehow manage to book this I'll give you 0.5€
MSmits: yeah, but that still helps
MSmits: Astrobytes we're talking engame books
reCurse: That confident incentive
MSmits: i wont do opening for sure
MSmits: i have 3 piece checkers one
MSmits: havent put it into my bot
MSmits: locally i have a 6 piece checkers one
Astrobytes: well, best of luck with it
MSmits: not for a while. I'll submit the random bot though :)
MSmits: so cool that you dont even need to code anything
MSmits: this is gonna have thousands of players
Astrobytes: btw if 0.5€ is like 1200 GBP or something next year I reserve the right to reduce the amount accordingly :P
MSmits: lol
reCurse: Cautious pessimism, I like
jacek: try 0.5btc
Astrobytes: No.
jacek: lets ask CG to install this https://python-chess.readthedocs.io/en/latest/
MSmits: chess moves confuse me
MSmits: i mean the notation
MSmits: sometimes they only use the destination, because only one piece can go there
reCurse: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Algebraic_notation_%28chess%29#Disambiguating_moves
MSmits: if you need a whole page to explain the notation, it's too complicated :P
reCurse: Says... the physics teacher.
MSmits: bah, maxwells equation fit on 2 lines
MSmits: ok so the standard model lagrangian is a page
reCurse: Just be glad it's not the descriptive notation
MSmits: but if the entire workings of the universe takes the same amount of space as your games' notation explanation, something is wrong :P
Astrobytes: eww maxwells
Astrobytes: PTSD again
MSmits: ah you had to do that for chemistry?
Astrobytes: yeah it was a thing
MSmits: didnt know chemists learned so much physics
MSmits: i know they do quantum
Astrobytes: It's quite important, we don't go as deep as you guys though
MSmits: I see
Astrobytes: well, physical chemists do
Astrobytes: biologists tend not to
MSmits: well chemistry is basically just an offshoot of phyiscs anyway
Astrobytes: yep
Astrobytes: and a cool one at that
MSmits: yeah
MSmits: the physicists of 200 years ago were also chemists
MSmits: and mathematicians
jacek: :scream:
Astrobytes: well yeah, there wasn't much of a disciplinary separation at that point (still isn't if we're honest about it)
MSmits: mmh a lot more now though. In my university, Computer science, math and physics do similar classes in the first year
MSmits: but after that it splits
MSmits: physicists still do some pure math classes, but not very many
MSmits: and i dont think mathematicians do any physics
MSmits: after the first year that is
Astrobytes: I had the same crap at highschool, I failed maths due to a bad teacher, yet I was able to do higher physics, chemistry and biology with ease.
MSmits: thats annoying
MSmits: i didnt have a high math grade either
MSmits: its not that i didnt get it
MSmits: it just wasnt interesting because it wasnt applied
Astrobytes: Yes, I really enjoyed maths. I had to do some catchup on it afterwards.
Astrobytes: Oh yeah, I totally get that.
MSmits: later on i was doing pure math writing scripts for a 3D game, linear algebra and such and i liked it then
MSmits: matrices and all that
MSmits: there was a point to it
MSmits: I had to shoot space ships that were moving at a distance of 2 km
Astrobytes: Yup. When you find a purpose it's so much better. Not sure how it's taught nowadays, perhaps they have relevant examples now
MSmits: probably it is a lot better now
MSmits: but math and physics teacher have to deal with a lot of poor attitude in students.
MSmits: as in "I cant do it anyway, so why try"
Astrobytes: Yes, comes with the subject. Happens with any scientific or tech-based subject I find.
MSmits: they convince themselves they cant, so they dont have to work through the frustration of failing often
Astrobytes: Yep.
MSmits: parents dont help either
Astrobytes: And they've most likely been told they're crap at x, y or z anyway
Astrobytes: haha yes, see above
MSmits: a girl will tell her mother, mother says, yeah i couldnt do it either
Astrobytes: So, so true.
DaMonk: My favorite math mantras is: "Even if you think it will fail, try your idea".
MSmits: sometimes failure is funny
MSmits: like when it ends saying 2 = 1
Astrobytes: hehe indeed
Astrobytes: I remember doing calculus, I was in the hospital waiting room visiting a relative, and scribbling down some practice. Burst out laughing because my end result was essentially what I started with but wrong.
Astrobytes: It hadn't really clicked at that point
MSmits: and thats when the other patients were wondering if this was the right waiting room
Astrobytes: Probably :D
Astrobytes: but yeah, failure is great when you're learning, as DaMonk mentioned, it's a great tool. It just has a bad rep
jacek: its like making a bug that makes your bot stronger
MSmits: that does the opposite
MSmits: it prevents you from learning because fixing the mistake makes it worse :P
Astrobytes: Yes. Fixing the bug that made your bot stronger and keeping it stronger is a little more useful.
MSmits: did you have this happen to you Astrobytes?
MSmits: I think it's the absolute worst
MSmits: happened maybe twice to me
MSmits: you know it's a bug and you want to fix it, but you cant submit
Astrobytes: Yes. That's literally the story of my Oware bot.
MSmits: heh, even now my oware bot has some weird unexplainable eval features
Astrobytes: It's a weird game :shrug:
MSmits: like some lookup arrays with weird param values. I tried to turn it into a sensible function, but nothing helped
jacek: mine's eval is quite unexplainable
MSmits: yes but thats by design :)
Astrobytes: heh true
MSmits: http://cgstats.magusgeek.com/app/multi-dots-and-boxes/msmits jrke going to be annoyed :P
MSmits: just lucky though, bad statistics
jacek: meh look at crazy remi
MSmits: yeah
MSmits: gonna need more to have a chance there
MSmits: got some ideas
Astrobytes: well, jrk e *did* want you to submit, so he brought that on himself :D
MSmits: well he wanted to see my solver, it would be cool if it predicts the endgame score halfway through the game
MSmits: have to get that working too, hope it actually works, didnt do too much verification
Astrobytes: do all you can without it first I'd say
Astrobytes: wow, Crazy Remi has a crazy lead
MSmits: hmm i dunno. I have 2 ideas and they both requrie a lot of code
MSmits: will end up with a 3k line bot
Astrobytes: So be it.
MSmits: the difference between crazi remi and the rest is really that he prepares for the endgame
MSmits: as opposed to just playing the endgame out efficiently
MSmits: he plays the first half and the second half, wheras everyone else just plays the second
MSmits: you can tell by the way he is giving away so many boxes in the first half
MSmits: he does this to make sure he has control in the end
MSmits: it doesnt matter if you're some points behind. All that matters is that you control who gets the big chains
jacek: sounds like othello, the less the better
Astrobytes: Given the nature of the game, that makes complete sense
MSmits: it's more like nim
MSmits: whomever is the last to make a non-loony move wins
MSmits: there's some chain counting rule you can use
MSmits: there have to be and odd number of long chains for p1 or even for p2, or the other way around, i forgot
RyanGilbert: is twitch being annoying again
RyanGilbert: my stream isnt showing up
Astrobytes: I've not delved deep enough to understand the whole thing but yes I got that far. The even/odd thing is related to board size no?
Astrobytes: RyanGilbert: it would appear so :/
RyanGilbert: working now
MSmits: oh yeah, i think its related to board size
MSmits: i never got too far into that part, because i didnt need it for the solver
struct: it takes around 15 min to show up
RyanGilbert: anybody want to watch?
RyanGilbert: twitch.tv/yeetpug21
RyanGilbert: private clashes
Velcoro: link to clash?
2020qwerty: https://www.codingame.com/clashofcode/clash/1514423de8ea551cf777f57925d57b7657078a8
RyanGilbert: thats not mine btw
RyanGilbert: join my stream on twitch
Astrobytes: you can post the direct link in #clash
Astrobytes: 2020qwerty: see above statement
Astrobytes: Velcoro, you got the link now?
RyanGilbert: he joined
Astrobytes: awesome
RyanGilbert: :)
Astrobytes: enjoy
Velcoro: got it, Astrobytes, thanks
OliverReider: hi
RyanGilbert: Sorry to those in my stream for the end on short notice
RyanGilbert: I am streaming again now
Cappefra: lol half of cbs's gold league doesn't even compile
Cappefra: csb*
MSmits: old bots
MSmits: compiler changes and all that
Cappefra: mainly cause the gold league introduces the second pod so the inputs changes completely
MSmits: oh right i forgot
MSmits: thats true ofc
Cappefra: making legend shouldn't be TOO hard on that contest I guess
MSmits: well, thats decided by the quality of the top bots
MSmits: if you're not going to write a search, legend might be difficult to achieve
MSmits: though i have to admit, i never tried this without search
MSmits: maybe you can do it with just heuristics
Cappefra: right, I should have mentioned I meant that cause I saw there's 870 people in legend :D
MSmits: mmh that's a small percentage of the total number of csb bots :)
Cappefra: that's what I think... if you have a decent physics simulation I think you can actually go with just heuristics
Cappefra: I'll have a go at that and see
MSmits: yeah, dont waste too much time on that if it doesnt work
MSmits: basically, at some point you'll need a search
MSmits: and if you've never written a search before, csb is not the right place to start
MSmits: imho
Cappefra: yeah, it could be a good chance to learn genetic algorithms
MSmits: GA works
MSmits: there's a GA starter
MSmits: if you use that, it might be easier to do
Cappefra: what kind of search do you mean? I've written a bunch of bfs and beamsearchs... not that it would help here tho
MSmits: beamsearch is a real search, but relatively simple
MSmits: I mean minimax for example
MSmits: adversarial
MSmits: GA can be adversarial, but its a bit complicated
MSmits: thats why the GA starter hekos
MSmits: helps
Cappefra: have only heard of minimax but haven't tried implementing it
MSmits: the search is pretty simple, not much code, but its annoying to have to deal with a huge simulation when learning it
MSmits: also you need to discretize moves
MSmits: like only consider +18 degrees, 0 degrees and -18 degrees
Cappefra: especially cause it must be hell to debug without a debugging environment, am I wrong?
MSmits: hmm yeah, the physics sim is hard to debug. But the GA starter already has it
MSmits: https://github.com/inoryy/csb-ai-starter
MSmits: you need to adapt it
MSmits: it doesnt work right out of the box
MSmits: afaik
MSmits: i never tried, i wrote my own search
MSmits: btw if you don't know inoryy, he is our resident Deep Mind employee :)
Cappefra: oh :O that's cool
Cappefra: I was thinking of going c++ this time but I always end up being lazy and choosing c# :/
MSmits: c++ in CSB will triple your simcount
MSmits: compared to C#
MSmits: if you're just looking to get into legend, this doesnt matter
Cappefra: btw as a fun fact: a stupid bot that just compiles and isn't event able to calculate the angle between two vectors (cause it was given until gold) gets you to ~ 1900/5900 gold
Cappefra: anywyas! Thanks for your help, I better go to bed since I'm negatively crossing the 6-hours-sleep mark
MSmits: yeah go sleep, gn :)
struct: MSmits today i fixed the bug
struct: Of reusing the states
struct: It was off by 1 :/
MSmits: before or after the fix?
struct: before
MSmits: ah ok, congrats
MSmits: always nice when a nasty bug is fixed
struct: Thanks
MSmits: I hope i'll be able to put my solver into D&B tomorrow
struct: Now Im learning imgui so I can code a local arena
MSmits: I should easily be able to calculate the value to decide to keep control of the board or not, but picking the right chains to open is messy. I have to break open my negamax function
MSmits: oh nice
MSmits: i do this with windows forms only
MSmits: do you just want results or also graphic stuff?
struct: graphics
MSmits: ahh ok, i never went that far
struct: like sliders to edit params and such
MSmits: oh ok, i do use buttons and such
MSmits: gui stuff
MSmits: i meant more like, circles and lines denoting parts of the game
MSmits: like recurse does with his programs
MSmits: so you can do strategic analysis of your games
MSmits: as opposed to just win/draw/loss/score
struct: https://i.imgur.com/Q4eQHGm.png
struct: This was just for test
struct: board is randomized
MSmits: yeah thats what i meant
MSmits: that goes further than what i do
struct: ImGui is what re curse used I think
MSmits: really?
struct: Never asked, but the gui looks similar
MSmits: he should have a lot of software to choose from, could be anything
struct: Well ubisoft uses imgui
struct: So I guess he has some experience on it
MSmits: ah then you're probably right :)
tibithegreat: yep, Imgui is pretty cool
MSmits: the only visual stuff i coded that actually produced finished products are little programs in python turtle :)
MSmits: like a TTT game and such
MSmits: oh and i guess some modding for 3D game
MSmits: but next week i'll be coding yavalath in unity !
struct: Never used unity
struct: Is it simple?
MSmits: yeah
MSmits: and free mostly
tibithegreat: as far as game engines it's pretty easy to use
tibithegreat: not great on performance tho
MSmits: if you make less than 100k off your product you dont pay anything
struct: Nice, for UE I think its 1Mill
MSmits: tibithegreat you use C# so you can do anything that C# allows you to do
struct: Unreal engine
tibithegreat: MSmits yeah not a lot of triple-A games written in C#
MSmits: You can call DLL's
MSmits: code part of it in C++
tibithegreat: but at this point it's no longer easy to use :)
MSmits: true, but that's always the tradeoff :0
tibithegreat: at some point you're investing too much into making unity be something that it isn't
tibithegreat: it's great for indie games and low-budget
MSmits: depending on your project, yeah
tibithegreat: and mobile
MSmits: no doubt
tibithegreat: but afaik no AAA companies use it
tibithegreat: except for small projects
MSmits: well i dont know enough about unity to properly defend it's ability to produce AAA content, but you're right, for small stuff it's perfectg
MSmits: not too small though
mr.x: some moderator online?
struct: Tomorrow I must restart my search on how I will be able to run my smashthecode compiled inside c++
MSmits: tiny projects should be python probably
struct: yes mr.x
tibithegreat: there is also some of the work mike acton has been doing there
tibithegreat: to make it more data-oriented coding
MSmits: whats that tibithegreat?
tibithegreat: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rX0ItVEVjHc&ab_channel=CppCon
tibithegreat: it's a guy that used to work for insomniac
tibithegreat: he had a cool talk a few years ago at cppcon but most people kinda mocked him there
tibithegreat: but then unity hired him and he's been focusing on improving the performance there
tibithegreat: and bringing these idea of "data oriented design" there
tibithegreat: it boils down to: don't write your code so it's easy for you to understand, write so that it's easy for your machine to understand it and run it
mzbear: Unity is good for quick prototyping and getting started fast, which is why it works for small teams. For larger games, they usually need to rewrite pretty much everything that Unity provides
MSmits: ahh ok
tibithegreat: mzbear did you work with unity in the last years?
mzbear: not recently. i'm actually boycotting them
tibithegreat: after the job system was introduced
mzbear: they have betrayed my trust twice
tibithegreat: I used to work in unity like 5 years ago when I was still doing indie
mzbear: the first time they betrayed me, they kept sending me spam and when i unsubscribed they later sent more, and mail headers suggested they had a separate mailing list for people who had unsubscribed from their spam
tibithegreat: lol
mzbear: the second time, i was going through privacy settings, and clicked a link to check privacy settings for some new profile thing ... and that link automatically created account on their linkedin style site
mzbear: and that account couldn't be removed and it couldn't be hidden, without having the entire unity account deleted
MSmits: nasty
mzbear: the assholes published my real life place of residence associated to my real name, because i clicked to view privacy settings
tibithegreat: hmm, maybe the bussiness of a commercial game engine for indie studios isn't as profitable as one might think
tibithegreat: these sound like desperate user retention actions
mzbear: ever since then, i haven't touched unity, and i'm still upset at them
mzbear: yeah, obviously i wasn't their customer, so they wanted to turn me into their product instead
MSmits: i wonder if these are deliberate attempts, or just fails/mistakes
tibithegreat: could be
tibithegreat: human stupidity is more often that not the reason for a lot of stuff we attribute to malice
MSmits: obviously their goal is not to piss off all the devs using it
mzbear: doesn't seem like a mistake to me, they just don't respect people who aren't bringing them money
tibithegreat: I don't think most devs check privacy settings that often
tibithegreat: or unsubscribe from stuff
tibithegreat: I just let it go to spam and never care about it
MSmits: I got an e-mail from quora earlier today
MSmits: I wanted to unsubscribe
MSmits: below the mail, instead of unsubscribe it just said: "this is a legal mail sent to our users"
MSmits: I could be pissed off at this, but i feel this is stupidity also
mzbear: well, they spammed me with newbie stuff repeatedly because i selected that i was beginner with unity. they spammed quite a lot iirc, enough to annoy me after 3 or 4 mails
struct: Well sometimes is stupidity, other times is on purpouse
struct: Did you read terms of service of Yavalath MSmits?
struct: its in the statement
MSmits: nope
MSmits: why
struct: Im joking
MSmits: oh hok
MSmits: btw, board games have no copyright unless you use names
MSmits: if i want to sell my yavalath I need to name it differently
MSmits: hence the lavalath :P
struct: They can only copyright the name?
MSmits: well other than that, it is only the hexboard and the game mechanicas
MSmits: you cant copyright those
MSmits: at least not in the US, there was some court ruling
MSmits: thats why there are so many versions of the board gane monopoly
MSmits: game
mzbear: in addition to name, shapes can also be copyrighted, but only if there's enough originality. a hexagon obviously doesn't qualify
MSmits: yeah
struct: im safe, for now
MSmits: personally i would not enjoy stealing it. If i were to sell anything, i would add something to it
MSmits: but for my game design assignment i dont really care
MSmits: i just want to pass
struct: Yeah, im not selling anything
struct: Im just promoting their game
MSmits: right
struct: I dont think AI coding will steal potential buyers
MSmits: it wont
MSmits: I might buy it
Emmaplayz: what is the most easyest code
MSmits: at some point
mzbear: well, using the same name might be an issue from a trademark point of view
MSmits: he asked permission
struct: no, I did not
struct: But he was ok with it
MSmits: he asked forgiveness
struct: I told hm 3 4 was also solved
struct: him*
MSmits: he didnt know !?
struct: IIRC he only knew about 4 4
mzbear: they have to either give you permission, or tell you to stop using it. otherwise the trademark has a risk of becoming a generic
MSmits: cool :)
struct: Good thing its made by unnamed codingamer
MSmits: yeah, will they fix that?
mzbear: once the trademark is considered generic, anyone can sell the game with the original name, as long as no original content (such as rulebook in verbatim) is copied
struct: They created a bug for it, but its not urgent
struct: I can still update the game, euler tested it
MSmits: ah cool
MSmits: anyway i gotta go, gn guys
struct: time for me aswell
struct: gn everyone
MSmits: gn
LastRick: night
Stigma: is anyone lagging as well ?
Czihi: af
Czihi: cant even test code in clash xP
Stigma: goes nice with my fast mode clash of code :C
Stigma: i think the bot literally won.
Stigma: is bitwolf a bot ?
Czihi: Literally
Czihi: there are like 10 people
Czihi: That i see here
Stigma: oh god
Czihi: No matter when i log in
Czihi: Bitwolf, that guy with spirited away avatar
Czihi: And some more
Stigma: yh
Czihi: Idk if they are bots or what but wtf xD
Czihi: AlkhilJohn aswell tbh
LastRick: oh its that time of night for updates
Stigma: they are
Stigma: XD
Stigma: my years old python 2 Gitc is still rocking silver
LastRick: best way to tell if they are a bot is level 7, but look at their profile. It will usually say it is a bot
Stigma: jeeeez lag is still going ;_;
Czihi: yeah
Czihi: time to stop clashing xP
Czihi: I just realised
Czihi: I play only with bots anyway
Stigma: ive been getting some players
Czihi: So its a bit less exciting xD
Stigma: XD
Stigma: i havent played in a long while and when i want to this happens
LastRick: just remember its always this time of night (or day) depending on where you live
Stigma: really?
Stigma: i used to play at this times
Stigma: these*
LastRick: for the last few weeks yes
Stigma: feels bad
LastRick: yes, wonder if its permanent
SwagColoredKitteh: y'all qts
Illedan: Anyone else starting to code in the online IDE just to test something, while later having regrets to not set it up properly? -.-
Emmaplayz: what the hardest game
SwagColoredKitteh: @Illedan oh hai long time no see
SwagColoredKitteh: o i guess the @ isnt needed, gosh havent been here for a while
Skynse: level 31 goddess
SwagColoredKitteh: Emmaplayz depends on who you ask
Emmaplayz: SwagColoredKitteh whats the hardest game
Skynse: I'd say the mars cat and mouse one
Skynse: the cat and mouse one**
Skynse: my trig failed me
SwagColoredKitteh: hard question uhh, i don't know?
Emmaplayz: k
Illedan: hi swag
SwagColoredKitteh: how're you?
IfIHadATail: when you say game what are you referring to? like to do you mean a game you play against someone else or like a solo practice puzzle?
Illedan: Modelling chess for a search bot is kinda pain :thinking:
Illedan: Fine, trying the new puzzle from reCurse
Illedan: And you?
Emmaplayz: like a solo practice puzzle?
Illedan: https://www.codingame.com/ide/demo/865494807d115f7493e0b7fa465bc5d2780647
mzbear: made a bandas bot to run BFS for decisive moves only ... i run 1.6M sims to see decisive wins from 8 ply away. i don't really want to slap MCTS on this though
Emmaplayz: that was easy
Emmaplayz: whos younger then 16
Emmaplayz: and a girl
IfIHadATail: I'm 37 and guy does that count?
IfIHadATail: a guy*
Emmaplayz: no
Emmaplayz: teenager
IfIHadATail: close though
Emmaplayz: i need a teen
Emmaplayz: anybody
Emmaplayz: pls im bord
Emmaplayz: doent need to be a girl any more but still
Emmaplayz: im bord
Emmaplayz: !!!!!!!!
Emmaplayz: ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
mzbear: this is a wrong place to search for someone to entertain you :)
Emmaplayz: so what
Emmaplayz: what would you do about it
IfIHadATail: so go to twitch and bother them or something why do it here?
Emmaplayz: your 30 something play bingo
Emmaplayz: 37
mzbear: no need to be rude
Emmaplayz: how old are you
Skynse: This isn't the place for video games, it's for interactive programming
Skynse: And don't look down on people older than you, they are wiser
IfIHadATail: dont feed the trolls
Skynse: oops
Emmaplayz: 𝕊ℍ𝕌𝕋 𝕌ℙ
Emmaplayz: i dont care
Emmaplayz: im not a troll
Emmaplayz: 𝖀𝕲𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳𝕳
Emmaplayz: Skynse how old are you
Emmaplayz: tell me now
Emmaplayz: i have a joke
Emmaplayz: tell me
Illedan: Please don't spam
LastRick: They've been warned all day about it
Skynse: ban em already
Skynse: wait, aw man I wish I could delete my messages now
Skynse: yeah that would be lit
Skynse: Come to think of it this is kinda sus
Emmaplayz: why sus
Skynse: like, you just came all of a sudden asking for everyone's age, but didn't specify a reason for that
Skynse: You could just tell the joke here
Wontonimo: jump into a clash of code everyone!
IfIHadATail: hard for me to clash at work unfortunately
IfIHadATail: :P
Skynse: this clash was oo easy
Skynse: too*
Skynse: gotta head to bead now
Skynse: bed*
Skynse: what's going on with my spelling lol
IfIHadATail: well you still have to do it better than the others
Skynse: This one was a fastest mode
Skynse: on*
Emmaplayz: shut up im not sus
Emmaplayz: play amoung us
Emmaplayz: youl know whats sus then
Emmaplayz: am i sus
Emmaplayz: its not like i work for the goverment
Emmaplayz: :laughing:
Emmaplayz: hahhahahahhahahahaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
Emmaplayz: :thumbsdown_tone4: not sus
Emmaplayz: :thumbsup_tone5: black lives matter
Emmaplayz: :man_tone5: black lives matter black lives matter
Emmaplayz: IfIHadATail = blablabla
Emmaplayz: hohohoho in Emma words means hoho time to go
Emmaplayz: IfIHadATail
Nukelets: umm
Nukelets: can you like
Nukelets: not be cringe please
Emmaplayz: WHAT
Emmaplayz: im not cringe my twin is
Emmaplayz: shes so cringe she has only 2 friends
Emmaplayz: http://chat.codingame.com/pastebin/6857c0a8-0df5-40e6-9ace-284ffdf9795a
Emmaplayz: http://chat.codingame.com/pastebin/891d4e1e-9f1a-4461-aedc-03d5c0297cfd
Emmaplayz: dont trust me i get detenshion
Emmaplayz: well i do work for the goverment to
Emmaplayz: but who cares hahahahaha
mzbear: wtf is this bullshit, my BFS is actually winning against my MCTS
Emmaplayz: hiiiiiiii
Emmaplayz: theirs an 8 year old one this game shut up
Emmaplayz: MadKnight is only 8
Emmaplayz: look at my profile
Emmaplayz: read all about me
Emmaplayz: pls
Emmaplayz: my dad died
mzbear: are you really that desperate for attention?
Emmaplayz: no its true
Emmaplayz: your a dog anyway
Emmaplayz: haha
Emmaplayz: im also adopted
Emmaplayz: kinda
Emmaplayz: i have a steapmom
Emmaplayz: and 2 siblings
Emmaplayz: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1--Qu-gDsbNUBEvGAttFdHPSK6BG6QVrSyVW8yvULiAM/edit#heading=h.plvnh67ojq8m
Emmaplayz: go their
Emmaplayz: anybody talk
StrideNYC: This AI bot thing is so dope!
