Chat:World/2020-10-29

HistoriCode97: Bonjour les confinés

LeIT: start him

LeIT: start game ?

HistoriCode97: Meh

Trap-chan: good morning my little fellows :D

WidePlayer: sup

Aya_Noaman: hey

BRETTRIVERBOAT: hi

pascscha: Hello, BRETTRIVERBOAt

ToshiTuringMachine: hi

pascscha: Hello, ToshiTuringMachine

SydM107: Is there a quick way to somehow refresh the IDE? Sometimes it erroneously identifies errors and will no longer parse

ThunderbirdOne: submit the code and do a hard refresh on the page?

AttilaStein: Are there any ressources on this site wehre you can learn about the concepts and syntax needed for a puzzle in a specific programming language?

Light-Bringer: Hey I m new here I have a question, the input have to stay the same or can be change to manipulate them?

Light-Bringer: Ex the Bank Robber puzzle the input for the Vaults is a integer but would be easy to just make it an object

player_one: You can change the inputs. The system doesn't know anything about your code. Just what you output to stdout is important.

Light-Bringer: okok

Light-Bringer: thanks :)

Light-Bringer: I m in C btw so no stdout for me

Light-Bringer: :P

player_one: Umm... C has stdout. look into the args to sprintf()

player_one: printf() is to stdout by default.

Light-Bringer: true

Light-Bringer: it was light banter

Light-Bringer: :

Light-Bringer: :(

player_one: sorry fprintf, not sprintf.

player_one: typo.

Light-Bringer: wait you dont even have to actually

Light-Bringer: lel

Light-Bringer: can we talk about the puzzles in here or not?

Light-Bringer: not sure about the rules

ThunderbirdOne: you can, i think it's just mostly frowed upon to give straight solutions

Light-Bringer: fair :)

pascscha: Are there solutions to old code-golf tasks? I cannot make my solution any shorter, yet there are some almost half its size in the same language on the leaderboard^^

pascscha: I mean code golf tasks from the past that don't accept any new submissions

jacek: clash?

Sander-T: hi

jacek: ohai

player_one: What code golf tasks from the past don't accept solutions?

player_one: ^don't accept new submission?

Ola-Kitan: good

Ola-Kitan: anyone on temperature?

pascscha: I don't know if there are any that don't accept solutions, but I get the option to "Publish On Codingame", so I figured the published solutions must be available somewhere

Astrobytes: They're not, that button does nothing. I think it's there for the Optimization games too.

pascscha: Oh ok, is there any more general way to learn about the tricks these top submissions might use?

Astrobytes: There are a few threads in the forum for language-specific golfing yeah. Also https://codegolf.stackexchange.com, and there's a few other sites around with tips

ThunderbirdOne: question, can i use the new ValueTuples in C# on CG ?

ThunderbirdOne: well... 'new'

Aya_Noaman: guys I want to make a contribution but I don't know how to draw a grid map that looks like this if printed:

Aya_Noaman: ####_####

Aya_Noaman: ####__###

Aya_Noaman: #####_##

Aya_Noaman: something like this

Aya_Noaman: help?

Astrobytes: ThunderbirdOne: I think so, C# 8.0 (.NET Core Runtime 3.1.3)

ThunderbirdOne: yeah, it works

ThunderbirdOne: for some reason i typed

ThunderbirdOne: function (int x, int y) Name() { ... }

ThunderbirdOne: no idea why i typed function and not just private static

Astrobytes: lol, switching langs a lot recently? :)

ThunderbirdOne: not at all actually :P

Astrobytes: lol, no excuses then

ThunderbirdOne: yeah, no clue

Aya_Noaman: hey anyone know an answer to my question up there

Astrobytes: Aya_Noaman: Have patience, was getting a link for you. https://www.codingame.com/playgrounds/40701/contribute---help/stub-generator-syntax

Aya_Noaman: ooh ok sorry

Aya_Noaman: and thanks alot

Drakkhonian: dude

Drakkhonian: https://www.codingame.com/ide/puzzle/a-childs-play

Drakkhonian: test 3, wtf is that number of moves LOL

Drakkhonian: test 4 and 5 too

Drakkhonian: ok, time to think of a more efficient solution

wlesavo: hey, are validators for CodinGame Sponsored Contest is the same as test cases or there is a difference? and if they are different then are they known?

la_sacree_gueule: hello everyone

Yoann.V: Cette sacree gueule go le ban

TripleBuses: hello my friend

la_sacree_gueule: who is this fcking french ?

TripleBuses: boguette

Skynse: ngl captcha is annoying

RohanasaurusRex: yeah but at least sometimes you just have to check the box

RohanasaurusRex: but yea its still pretty annoying lol

Skynse: The ones without images are fine

Pawanel: help me

Pawanel: with descent

ThunderbirdOne: have you tried asking nicely? using please etc?

pascscha: Sorry, I'm asking about coding golf again. How are these insanely low coding golf byte counts even possible? For temperatures, some people managed to do it in 54 chars with Python3, that's how much I need to read in the data. These scores seem impossibly low to me.

Uljahn: pascscha: what's your current score?

pascscha: 98

Uljahn: im at 68 in py3, no cheats just min() with lambda

wlesavo: also reading of inputs could probably be done better

pascscha: Ok, lambda shaved off my code to 78, thanks for that tip. The top of the leaderbaord still seems outlandishly short, I have a lot of respect for these guys.

pascscha: Usually if you can't make it any shorter, the problem is that you should approach the problem from a completely different way. It might be that a given way of solving it is optimized as good as possible, with no shorter way of doing it, but with another approach many more characters can be shaved off. Thank you for your help, I am new to this community and you seem quite welcoming.

Astrobytes: It's a great community :)

Monstrux: Hey guys, I have a question. Im struggling with the Puzzle of the week: A Game of Go. i dont have the technical knowledge in javascript to find an easy way to organise the data(matrix of dots, Ws and Bs)

Monstrux: any1 can give me some pointers? I tryed nested arrays, but I'm struggling to print them now

rohitkumar212: https://www.codingame.com/clashofcode/clash/1440412361eb5b5861067e61c21ac756d0e5b37

rohitkumar212: join

rohitkumar212: private

SPDene: use #clash for CoC invites please

Monstrux: gl in clash. Any1 can help me with my question guys? :D

Majeck: SURE

Majeck: *Sure

Majeck: What's the question?

Monstrux: Im struggling with the Puzzle of the week: A Game of Go. i dont have the technical knowledge in javascript to find an easy way to organise the data(matrix of dots, Ws and Bs) any1 can give me some pointers? I tryed nested arrays, but I'm struggling to print them now

Majeck: DM

AlPaca: is there a way to reset a language's default implementation that's presented when you open a problem for the first time?

AlPaca: for a puzzle/problem, that is

ZarthaxX: you have a reset button in the ide, top right

AlPaca: ahhhh! great, thanks

ZarthaxX: yw

Th1nhNg0: nom nom nom

eulerscheZahl: hey ZarthaxX lockdown is back in Germany too

kovi: so can we expect another unofficial challenge, before the fall-official one?

eulerscheZahl: the official one is in 2 weeks, so no

eulerscheZahl: i suggested a game in August. CG seemed interested but said they won't do it before the Fall challenge

eulerscheZahl: not decided if it will happen after or not at all

eulerscheZahl: the topcoder marathon looks interesting

IGNNE: Hey, I have a stupid question. I'm trying to go up the leagues in the "Coders Strike Back" game, but it somehow doesn't let me go to the next level

eulerscheZahl: are you above the boss on the leaderboard?

IGNNE: I'm beating the boss (and I'm #1 at the leaderboard ;) ) but there's no continue button

eulerscheZahl: did your submit reach 100% yet?

IGNNE: How do I check? I'm pretty new, sorry if this is a noob question

wlesavo: euler, do you know if maps for validators in CG sponsored contest are the same for validators?

eulerscheZahl: nope, you are at 66%

dbf: "not decided if it will happen after or not at all" - you have not decided, or CG team has not decided yet? :)

eulerscheZahl: wait until it finishes

ZarthaxX: eulerscheZahl yes i heard and thought of you when you told me it was coming :P

eulerscheZahl: no wlesavo, ask dbdr about it

ZarthaxX: im talking about lockdown

IGNNE: Ah, thanks::thumbsup:

wlesavo: thx will do

eulerscheZahl: i'm waiting for the GO from CodinGame. they have to approve the game first

eulerscheZahl: no more soccer and working 100% remotely again - but i'm still better off than you i think

dbdr: wlesavo: honestly, I don't remember, I looked at Sponsored quite a long time ago

dbdr: maybe someone else remembers?

wlesavo: hm

eulerscheZahl: Neumann said it's the same iirc

eulerscheZahl: congrats IGNNE, you are promoted now

wlesavo: oh thx

dbdr: I think at the time it was possible to view validators replays, but now it's blocked?

eulerscheZahl: correct

eulerscheZahl: which sucks

dbdr: yeah, especially that it changes, creates unfairness

dbdr: I know I didn't completely reverse that optim, I guess a few people have?

dbdr: as in 100% deterministic prediction

eulerscheZahl: schubc invested some time

eulerscheZahl: generated 15k testcases and passes all of them

dbdr: wow

eulerscheZahl: as in: predicting the next step for AIs

wlesavo: nice

eulerscheZahl: not sure if he completely reversed the bonus score

dbdr: ah, 15k steps? I thought games

eulerscheZahl: turns

wlesavo: is there supper pellets?

eulerscheZahl: psst

dbdr: I *think* the score is not that hard, but I might misremember

dbdr: no spoilers

eulerscheZahl: i don't know what the game is about

dbdr: :D

wlesavo: anyway, thx, i ll try to recreate maps now =)

eulerscheZahl: you wanted to solve space maze before :P

dbdr: you might be able to extract info from tests, and use an assertion, to see if it crashes during validation

dbdr: to confirm

kovi: 3-5k is fair score

wlesavo: yeah, i gave it a couple of tries and failed misserably, so ill try again later :slight_smile:

wlesavo: dbdr yeah, thas my plan

eulerscheZahl: by bot has no prior knowledge about the maps

eulerscheZahl: and realizes too late that there is no 2nd exit

wlesavo: well yeah, it looks like 3-5k achievable without map knowledge, but i want a proper sim

dbdr: mine does, it detects the map from the first steps

dbdr: a few look almost the same

eulerscheZahl: i'm not surprised that you added that knowledge

dbdr: :angel:

eulerscheZahl: https://www.topcoder.com/challenges/71581555-b87a-4930-b37e-d78357073479?tab=details

eulerscheZahl: secret validators after the contest, no hardcoding

dbdr: payment of $0 :D

eulerscheZahl: https://www.topcoder.com/challenges/8440570d-d16b-43df-be4e-a720577626d5

eulerscheZahl: if you play for the money

wlesavo: 0 for first and second place, if you score lower you gonna owe money to the organisers :slight_smile:

dbdr: geolocation based on sound; interesting!

dbdr: wlesavo lol

eulerscheZahl: in Soviet Russia you pay for the contest

dbdr: I read a short story about a reverse lottery

dbdr: instead of everyone paying a little, and one person winning a lot

dbdr: everyone wins a little

dbdr: every one person who is killed / made a slave, something like that

dbdr: *except one person who is killed/enslaved

dbdr: I think it's by Jorge Luis Borges

ZarthaxX: eulerscheZahl yes you will always be beter than here :D

Majeck: I love Jorge Luis Borges' works

Majeck: He's a really good writer

ZarthaxX: we have people here occupying other's terrain

eulerscheZahl: so someone stole your pool?

ZarthaxX: and now the government as an incentive to stop them from doing this they will pay them

dbdr: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Lottery_in_Babylon

ZarthaxX: approximately 1600 dollars in 6 months

ZarthaxX: so the deal right now is go occupy a terrain and you will get paid for that :D

eulerscheZahl: Argentinian dollars?

ZarthaxX: better salary than an actual job

ZarthaxX: i converted it to dollars

eulerscheZahl: ah

ZarthaxX: its 300k pesos here

ZarthaxX: we almost got a 200:1 conversion :D

ZarthaxX: and no, no one stole our pool lol

ZarthaxX: im talking about terrains like in the farm

ZarthaxX: for now at least

Majeck: Why does "if None:" in python register as True?

Majeck: Not complaining, it allowed me to remove 2 chars in a code golf

Majeck: Just want to know why

dbdr: wow, c4l is seriously random

dbdr: finished #45 in gold, resub and I'm #1, close to bose at 40% :)

dbdr: *boss

Illedan: That game is the definition of A > B > C > A :P

dbdr: yes? in what way?

dbdr: I thought it was the randomness of samples

dbdr: Illedan in gold, tsss ;)

Illedan: One of my early contests

Illedan: I was young

Illedan: And so very n00b

dbdr: multi is still open

Illedan: Not going to open that vound

dbdr: :D

Illedan: Working on my BS

dbdr: you're #23, with some spam submit yo might promote

dbdr: or maybe my bot is especially sensitive to samples

Illedan: Let me check

dbdr: I'm doing the "return undiagnosed samples" strat :)

Illedan: Efficient one

Illedan: Mine is just bruteforce, and a stupid one

Illedan: HOLY, the code I wrote :scream:

Illedan: Abandon shit

dbdr: bruteforce N next turns?

Illedan: There is no such thing as "next" in my bot

Illedan: Current.

dbdr: bruteforce depth 1?

Illedan: Yup

dbdr: how can that work??

dbdr: you need sime planning...

dbdr: *some

Illedan: I have 106 IFs in this code -.- Who writes this shit

Illedan: (╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻

Gabbek: Hello everyone :)

dbdr: :D MeanMax was my first contest, and only heuristic one

dbdr: but now I will be legend with heuristics in c4l

Gabbek: dbdr I'm really curious what's your approach in https://www.codingame.com/multiplayer/bot-programming/coders-of-the-realm . Would you like to talk about it a bit?

dbdr: 50 ifs Illedan

Illedan: Rookie numbers

dbdr: it's the quality, not the quantity ;)

dbdr: Gabbek, it's been a while, let me check...

dbdr: what do you do?

Zenoscave: dbdr what's the return undiagnosed strat

dbdr: e.g. if you have 4 xp + mols in each category, you can return a sample without knowing what it needs

dbdr: since 4 is the max for rank 1

Zenoscave: huh

Zenoscave: good to know

dbdr: Marchete mentions it in the forum

Gabbek: dbdr I only use the next two tiles and some heurestics when it comes to placing my next tiles; couldn't manage more with python ( talking about coders of the realm here, to avoid confusion :D )

ChastyXD: how to create private coding games??

Illedan: Clash ChastyXD?

Illedan: Bottom of the clash page

ChastyXD: Great I have seen that

Illedan: https://www.codingame.com/multiplayer/clashofcode => Start a private clash

ChastyXD: Thank u so much

dbdr: Gabbek, it looks like I'm doing a brute force search

jacek: looks like? so you dont know?

Gabbek: dbdr for how many tiles? 2/3/4 or more? :)

dbdr: quick read of the code I wrote 6 months ago, or more?

dbdr: eprintln!("My next tiles: {:?}", tiles);

       tiles.truncate(2);

dbdr: so it looks like I only consider the next 2 tiles

dbdr: I don't remember the exact rules, we know more than that in advance?

Gabbek: only in case of 1vs1 variant

Gabbek: so about 30% of all matches

dbdr: isn't that a separate game?

eulerscheZahl: 125 if's in my code4life (including comments). did I win?

dbdr: but that's a MC, no?

eulerscheZahl: and why can't I use CTRL+Enter anymore to add a newline?

ChastyXD: I have an idea

Gabbek: nope, the separate game is 1vs1 with all tiles available, while here it's just half of the tiles in case of 1vs1

eulerscheZahl: yes, monte carlo

eulerscheZahl: i mean SHIFT+ENTER

eulerscheZahl: where is my newline? :(

Gabbek: hello testing SHIFT+ENTER it works nice

Gabbek: seems to work eulerscheZahl

dbdr:

eulerscheZahl: used to work for me but broke recently

dbdr: in chat?

eulerscheZahl: yes

eulerscheZahl: let me try in private mode

dbdr: 1 2 3

eulerscheZahl: 1 2 3

eulerscheZahl: hm, some addon screwing up

dbdr: polizei

jacek: AutomatonNN will he succeed?

AutomatonNN: why did you say that ?

dbdr: arf you messed up my joke :D

Illedan: Give me that rank dbdr :D

Illedan: Still a little too far

Illedan: I see a bug

Scarfield: grenadier

Illedan: time to find the wrong IF

dbdr: Illedan: I succesfully tricked you to lose your rank?

eulerscheZahl: 1 2

eulerscheZahl: ah, vimium it is

Illedan: Lose?

Illedan: I was 24th? :P

Illedan: Now I ended 5th

dbdr: oh

dbdr: well

eulerscheZahl: i miss vimperator :cry:

Illedan: I changed a magic number though

Gabbek: :D

eulerscheZahl: the winrate number

dbdr: vimium here

dbdr: so you use vim mode in browser but not vim? original :D

eulerscheZahl: :D

eulerscheZahl: i'm too lazy to click links with my mouse

eulerscheZahl: but CG has poor support

dbdr: what happens if someone submits after being marked for promotion?

eulerscheZahl: the old chat allowed to switch chatrooms with vimium. the new doesn't

dbdr: the submit ends suddently?

Illedan: yes

dbdr: Illedan, is your rank stable? you need to resub

dbdr: you might promote

dbdr: ah, will mise the train in 2 minutes

dbdr: *miss

Illedan: :scream:

Illedan: Hold it!

dbdr: Hoddor!

dbdr: bing! :blush:

dbdr: Gabbek, are you limited by speed?

Gabbek: whoa, so many messages at once! Let me read quickly

Gabbek: dbdr mostly in 1vs1 variant - but in the 4 players one I could use a bit of extra time for sure; that's why I've started learning some C#

Gabbek: I was planning to incorporate remaining tiles pool somehow into my bot my after some quick tries I've gave up on it for now :D it sounds quite useful for sure

Gabbek: but after*

dbdr: Illedan, +0.05 :D

eulerscheZahl: going for #1 globally, dbdr?

dbdr: you won't let me ;)

JBM: fight!

Gabbek: hehe, the best kind of fight :P

dbdr: just taking my time, doing one multis when I feel like it, no rush

dbdr: *old multis

Gabbek: there's so many! I'm having issues on deciding which one I wanna start, hmm

eulerscheZahl: it's up to royale if you are allowed to take a lead

eulerscheZahl: he's playing onitama for several days already

dbdr: you guys stay close for a long time now, no?

eulerscheZahl: yes

dbdr: Royale has weird swings, +1000 on some days

eulerscheZahl: he's 1st when he doesn't resubmit at 4am

dbdr: but I guess he has big minuses too, since he's not running away

dbdr: lol

dbdr: 4am is a weird time to submit in europe

eulerscheZahl: i know

eulerscheZahl: maybe it's 3am... you got the idea

dbdr: Royale is a bot?

Gabbek: eulerscheZahl I see yours https://www.codingame.com/training/expert/space-maze ; scary success rate, how much harder it is compared to sokoban? :) Even the slightest comparison will be helpful, trying to plan out my weekend a bit :D

jrke: hope royale plays dots and boxes as fast as possible ;)

eulerscheZahl: sokoban is a child's birthday

dbdr: why jrke?

Illedan: (╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻

Illedan: Not enough :(

Illedan: 0.16

Illedan: -.-

Gabbek: eulerscheZahl so that means it will take me a year or so, noted :D

eulerscheZahl: sokoban can be done with BFS alone. space maze needs some heuristic on top, what to expand next

jrke: cause my latest code in D&B is pending i will finish it only when someone makes me push down in that

dbdr: oh, you were at 90% when you were above

dbdr: are you #1 jrke?

dbdr: last time I checked it was crazyremi

Gabbek: you guys are working hard :)

jrke: nope i am not 1st i am 2nd

dbdr: ah, above me then? :)

eulerscheZahl: by 0.01

dbdr: lol

Illedan: ezpz? :P

jrke: till dbdr resubmit i am 2nd

jrke: else 3rd cause someone pushed me above him by.01

dbdr: done

eulerscheZahl: :D

jrke: btw where is Ms research bot on D&B? still painting rooms?

jrke: lol i will be 3rd soon

dbdr: lost to jacek :/

Gabbek: off to read some stuff, have fun!

dbdr: so many more people on d&b

jrke: i think i will go back to D&B after fall challenge

dbdr: we need a new league

jrke: dbdr cause it became PotW once

dbdr: that's good

jrke: yup many CPs to me

dbdr: Illedan beating me too

dbdr: yay, 100% against CR :D

dbdr: 50%

jrke: 1/1 is not 100% you say dbdr ;)

dbdr: 1/1 is 100%, 1/2 is 50%

jrke: in that case i am having 100% winrate against you 1/1 ;)

jrke: sorry 3/3

dbdr: yep

dbdr: still 100% ;)

jrke: oke hoping good luck for furher resubmits (if you are going to do)i am off gn

dbdr: gn

starmaq: what challenge are you guys doing

dbdr: https://www.codingame.com/multiplayer/bot-programming/dots-and-boxes

starmaq: thanks

starmaq: wow

starmaq: the amount of pressure that this generates

Scarfield: Need some coffee? :p

starmaq: sure hehe

Scarfield: "Édouard Lucas, who called it "la pipopipette" which you will agree is a very pleasant name" Just started reading the statement xD

dbdr: pressure?

eulerscheZahl: peer pressure and next week he'll start smoking

dbdr: - what are you doing? - A - hey, you're pressuring me into doing A!

AleMalendra: test

jacek: and im 6th just by being pushed by other people

MSmits: hey guys

Scarfield: oi

MSmits: working on a traveling salesman thingy: https://trinket.io/python/8a3db0ac8f?toggleCode=true

MSmits: t to make a new problem, r for random, i for best of 1000, h for hillclimbing

jacek: thats just some dots

MSmits: gonna add SA next and some code rewriting

MSmits: yes, travelling salesman :)

MSmits: try clicking r, i or h

MSmits: pressing

jacek: noice

MSmits: hillclimbing is super effective for this problem apparently

MSmits: except when N > 30

MSmits: I guess that's when you need SA or something

Scarfield: cool :)

jacek: each dots visited only once?

MSmits: thats the rule

MSmits: and it's cyclic

eulerscheZahl: there's a pretty good heuristic also: Christofides

MSmits: so you end where you start

jacek: lines overlapping looks like some dots are visited more than once

MSmits: yeah i know jacek, it's not easy to eliminate that

eulerscheZahl: proven do be at most 1.5x the best

MSmits: thanks euler, will check out that heuristic

MSmits: i did have a greedy heuristic

MSmits: but it's bad

jacek: Up until 2020, this was the best approximation ratio that has been proven for the traveling salesman problem

jacek: maybe 2020 isnt bad after all

MSmits: what happened in 2020

eulerscheZahl: i need a full southpark season to understand that

jacek: https://arxiv.org/abs/2007.01409

MSmits: ok that heuristic looks wayyyy too complicated for my class :P

MSmits: but good to know it exists

eulerscheZahl: no matching? :D

MSmits: matching?

eulerscheZahl: minimum-weight perfect matching

MSmits: no idea what that is

ZarthaxX: you are killing him :P

MSmits: btw, my definition of a neigbor solution in this problem is just swapping the order of two dots

MSmits: works wonders with hillclimbing

MSmits: i can do this with SA too, but I have no idea how to GA this. How do you combine two solutions?

eulerscheZahl: you can also take a chain of consecutive points and reverse the order

MSmits: to make babies and stuf

MSmits: eulerscheZahl ahh yeah

eulerscheZahl: the removes some crossing lines

MSmits: makes sense

MSmits: difficult to do this over the end of the array

MSmits: messy i mean, to code

ZarthaxX: combining solutions sounds weird

MSmits: i mean

eulerscheZahl: you mean lopping around while reversing?

MSmits: procreation

ZarthaxX: incompatbility in the paths

ZarthaxX: you mean crossover

MSmits: yes eulerscheZahl

Scarfield: for GA

eulerscheZahl: you don't have to. it's the same as reverting all other nodes

MSmits: yeha crossover sorry

ZarthaxX: im talking about ga yes

MSmits: never done a GA

ZarthaxX: it seems weird for this

MSmits: eulerscheZahl ok, i should think about it more then

Scarfield: yea

MSmits: i will probably not do a GA then

eulerscheZahl: you can split the path in 2 sections. it doesn't matter if you revert one or the other half

ZarthaxX: SA is good too anyway

MSmits: random / greedy / hillclimbing/ SA seems more than enough for a class

ZarthaxX: yes

MSmits: eulerscheZahl makes sense

ZarthaxX: there is smth called tabu search too

MSmits: is it called tabu because people feel uncomfortable discussing it?

ZarthaxX: it's interesting, but maybe too complex to implement, idk

ZarthaxX: no lmao

ZarthaxX: it tries to rmemeber explored solutions

ZarthaxX: and other things

ZarthaxX: to avoid looping over the same place agan

ZarthaxX: again*

MSmits: ahh i see

ZarthaxX: but again, maybe out of scope

Scarfield: i guess you could GA it. Have horisontal right as zero, then rotate around, sort the other unvisited points in order of apperance, have each gene represent the number chosen in the order, and so on

MSmits: seems more something i should look at for an optim arena, not for a class

MSmits: i know a lot more about adversarial algorithms used in arenas than that optim stuff

ZarthaxX: yes, it may escape your class objectives

MSmits: Scarfield the problem is mainly, crossover

MSmits: if a gene is an order of points

MSmits: how do you crossover?

MSmits: mutating is easy

jacek: ask your mum

jacek: :v

MSmits: lol

Scarfield: wouldnt be a problem here: AAAA X BBBB -> AABB and BBAA AAAA X BBBB -> ABBB and BAAA

rwilson: MSmits - did you consider varying the line colors to avoid the issue jacek mentioned? .. like this maybe: https://trinket.io/python/ce6626ae6c

MSmits: damn

MSmits: that's fast rwilson

MSmits: you just looked at my code and changed that

jacek: is he your student?

MSmits: well done

MSmits: i wish

rwilson: ;) good starting material = easy work

MSmits: thanks :)

MSmits: something like this is better yeah

MSmits: maybe I would change the colors less dramatically

MSmits: but the idea is sound

Scarfield: since the genes will just represent which unvisted point to go to from the current point

rwilson: but.. it's a quick hack ;) even if it's only a couple lines, i'd do it a little nicer normally.

MSmits: yeah

MSmits: i know

MSmits: Scarfield let me think about it a sec

Scarfield: NO! :p

MSmits: what is the A and the B?

MSmits: my orders are more like this 0234576198

MSmits: all unique indices

MSmits: i swap them to generate neighbors

IsThisWhereMyNameGoes: Aaaaave maríiiiiiia

Scarfield: better example: 1st 5th 2nd 1st X 3rd 4th 8th 2nd 1st 5th 8th 2nd & 3rd 4th 2nd 1st

Scarfield: 1st will be the first dot from the current counter clockwise from vertical right for example

Scarfield: and so on

MSmits: hmm

jacek: or be more modern and for traveling salesman problem use neural network, big data and blockchain

MSmits: i'm getting to NNs as well jacek, just not that advanced :P

MSmits: I want to maybe Q-learn hexapawn

jacek: hexapawn is like mini breakthrough

MSmits: yeah

MSmits: Scarfield what if the solution is all over the place?

MSmits: you can't have a clockwise or anti-clockwise situation then

MSmits: i am a bit confused about what they do with the matchboxes in hexapawn. It's unplugged q-learning i think, but I don't understand how they choose between moving forward or taking an opponent piece

MSmits: they use beads to select a pawn

jacek: matchboxes? beads? w00t

MSmits: yeah basically they use a bunch of matchboxes to create an ai

Scarfield: how do you mean all over the place?

MSmits: you play games repeatedly and every time it loses you remove the bead that made the losing move

MSmits: so it learns

MSmits: Scarfield lots of crossing lines

MSmits: jacek: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sw7UAZNgGg8&vl=no

MSmits: start at 2 min or so

MSmits: skip introductory and advertising crap

jacek: wtf

Scarfield: i dont think that would be a problem, as you go through the genome, you check which dots havent been visited yet, and go to the specified number of the current gene. Im not saying it would work well, just thinking aloud that it can be done :)

MSmits: ahh ok Scarfield, i might look at that as an extra assignment

Scarfield: the issue is to represent the genes in a way that can be crossed over, ie not a series of unique indentifiers

Scarfield: you would have to choose a starting point though for this approach to make any sense

jacek: MSmits does he mean this? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matchbox_Educable_Noughts_and_Crosses_Engine

MSmits: oh yeah

MSmits: but thats not what the video is about

MSmits: thats just background info

MSmits: Scarfield yeah thats what i thought, that my way of representing a gene is not helpful

MSmits: ohh i understand it now, the colors are actions, not pawns

MSmits: so if a pawn can do 2 actions, both will have a bead

MSmits: different colored bead I mean

jacek: so this matchbox thing is q-table?

ZarthaxX: that game concept is amazing

Scarfield: https://prnt.sc/v9mr7z MSmits a super pretty illustration of what i mean

jacek: its ugly

Scarfield: :'(

Scarfield: should have added a pony :thinking:

ZarthaxX: yes you should

MSmits: jacek yeah Q table mostly

MSmits: seems to me

MSmits: the guy speaks of genetic algorithm but thats misleading, it's definitely not GA

MSmits: got it Scarfield :)

MSmits: no ponies required

Scarfield: https://prnt.sc/v9n0ds

Scarfield: fixed

Scarfield: yea it has nothing to do with GA but the idea is cool!

MSmits: i try to have at least 1 unplugged activity for every subject

MSmits: TSP is easy, just let them find a good solution on paper and make a contest of it

jacek: Scarfield twilight OP, nerf plx

MSmits: oh right, i forgot jacek is a mlp expert

MSmits: he made his own pony and called it derjak

MSmits: dejack

MSmits: cross those over for me Scarfield gettin tired of my typos

Scarfield: glad you liked it :p wasnt there something about fans getting ponies added to the show?

MSmits: ohh, jacek please tell me you participated

ZarthaxX: TSP easy in what sense?

jacek: i believe some bronies were included as backgroung ponies in the show

MSmits: easy to make material

MSmits: just print it and let them puzzle it out

MSmits: the matchbox thing seems really complicated

ZarthaxX: ah

ZarthaxX: true

MSmits: bronies?

MSmits: bronies before honies?

Scarfield: xD

jacek: gah how uneducated you are

MSmits: I admit it

jacek: and i see youre back to mcts in oware

MSmits: ah yeah, i gave your algo a good try, it could get almost the same rank, but was still significantly weaker. I think I would need a stronger eval to make it work

MSmits: the problem is that you could go 10 deep, with an inaccurate eval and completely overwrite the whole branch

KamalCh: Hi there

MSmits: wheras ept is fuzzy and one bad eval wont mess things up too badly

KamalCh: I'm new to this game

MSmits: what game?

KamalCh: Coding game

jacek: :o

MSmits: yeah but it's not one game

MSmits: it's many games

simon-tiger: Hi there! :wave:

KamalCh: well it is sort of a big huge game with multiple little puzzles!

MSmits: puzzles is one thing

KamalCh: I'm actually stuck on the first one with the horses

MSmits: is that the first one?

jacek: dual races?

jacek: horses? ponies?

KamalCh: yeah

MSmits: this one is yours jacek, obviously

KamalCh: did a list with all horses

KamalCh: but still something seems wrong in my code OO

KamalCh: even tho I'm just comparing abs values in the lis

simon-tiger: What is the puzzle you're doing?

simon-tiger: Can you post a link?

MSmits: which language KamalCh?

KamalCh: Horse-racing Duals

KamalCh: Python!

MSmits: i mean link the puzzle

KamalCh: https://www.codingame.com/ide/puzzle/horse-racing-duals

MSmits: oh lol mine is in bash

KamalCh: is alright I mean I did a list then "sort" the list

MSmits: me too, thats what you're supposed to do

KamalCh: then compared i and i+1 in the list

KamalCh: and took the smalled value

MSmits: thats exactly right

KamalCh: but I believe something is wrong with my code -.-

simon-tiger: Huh?

jacek: you have error?

MSmits: it's ok to link your code here, for an introductory puzzle like that

MSmits: not ingeneral, but for this puzzle its ok

MSmits: if you link it, we can fix it

KamalCh: http://chat.codingame.com/pastebin/c9aec37d-b6a8-4512-82cc-8ee1c3bbe07b

simon-tiger: It's ok to share code unless it's an ongoing contest

simon-tiger: Ah...You forgot the i += 1

MSmits: yeah

KamalCh: NOOB

KamalCh: -.-'

MSmits: i never changes :)

simon-tiger: Also, I would use a for loop, not a while loop

MSmits: i would use for i in range(n-1)

simon-tiger: yeah, that's what I would use

MSmits: thats safer because the i++ happens automatically then

jacek: and the elements of harmony

MSmits: is this a ponly thing jacek?

KamalCh: haha thanks so much

MSmits: pony

jacek: maybe

MSmits: thought so

MSmits: is this you jacek:

MSmits: https://metro.co.uk/2014/05/03/now-we-have-seen-everything-bronies-the-grown-men-obsessed-with-my-little-pony-4716666/

KamalCh: that's me learning trying a while

KamalCh: never again

MSmits: whiles are useful

MSmits: just not here

jacek: G3 ponies? eww

MSmits: is this a class of pony?

MSmits: G3 is a stellar classification

KamalCh: Lol wait what was that

MSmits: KamalCh jacek is obsessed about ponies

MSmits: so we need to discuss it every once in a while

MSmits: otherwise he's gonna go to a CG alternative and we lose him

KamalCh: that'S alright a pony a day keeps teh doctor away

MSmits: you got it

Scarfield: jacek is our little troll

jacek: and new game has been approved

Scarfield: there are MLP games?

MSmits: blocking?

MSmits: by tric trac?

Scarfield: oh lol

jacek: so far im 1st

Scarfield: and last

Scarfield: mwuhaha

jacek: usual guys of board games

Scarfield: seems like a cool game though, didnt see it in contributions

MSmits: i'm not sure if i'll like this one

MSmits: will be a long time before I try it I think

MSmits: do you think it should go below paper soccer on my list jacek?

MSmits: paper soccer is like 4th

jacek: everything should be below paper soccer

MSmits: problem is, games i am addicted to keep drawing me back in

MSmits: like uttt

darkhorse64: In this game ("penguins" is another example), you need to implement a n player algorithm. It cannot be a rehash of the usual MCTS code

MSmits: smitsimax is my go to algorithm for > 2p, but it doesnt work for sequential games. Only for simultaneous =/

MSmits: well i suppose it would work for sequential somewhat, but the error it makes will be greater

trictrac: you can use paranoid or max^n

MSmits: biggest problem is that the allowed moves depend on opponent actions

MSmits: yeah thats what i read before, like with tron, trictrac

MSmits: congrats on acceptance of multi btw

darkhorse64: There's also an mcts for n players

MSmits: yeah, but is it any good?

trictrac: thank you this is my first contribution, i will work now on hanabi

MSmits: hanabi is a board game?

trictrac: no cooperative game (like code a la mode)

MSmits: interesting

darkhorse64: You need to implement this flavor to know

trictrac: 4 players --> so 4 games of 3 players and sum for the score

trictrac: the best you cooperate with others the best score you have

MSmits: I see

darkhorse64: trictrac: you failed to beat your boss

MSmits: lol

trictrac: the boss is a kind of max^n depth 2, I have a version time limited but I wait someone in bois 1 before launching this bot

trictrac: for the moment, my bot is an oriented random

darkhorse64: Hmm, I may need to add a few more ifs to my code then

jacek: ifmax

jacek: and im above worstfield

dapOnEmHaters: HAHHAHAH

dapOnEmHaters: i just did Thor

dapOnEmHaters: Feel so good

Skynse: How do you guys use the chat system lol?

dapOnEmHaters: u type here

Skynse: as in

Skynse: the chat rooms get jumbled up in clashofcode

Skynse: so Im not sure which one is the current coc chat

somtingwong987: yeet

GeorgeKrastev: Can I play 1v1 with a friend in a game other clash of code ?

SPDene: yes: scroll down to the bottom of https://www.codingame.com/multiplayer/clashofcode and "start a private clash", then give the link to your friend

GeorgeKrastev: I meant other than clash of code

ChastyXD: Hi

ChastyXD: I want to test the live coding stream

ChastyXD: I have a channel

ChastyXD: I put there Codingame

ChastyXD: but I'm not appearing at the streams page on Codingame

ChastyXD: Do I need to do sth else

Allis: Might be case-sensitive, such that it needs to be "CodinGame" exactly?

Allis: If not that, then it might be the case that you need to be added to the list of streamers before showing up on the Live page.

Allis: @ChastyXD In which case it might be best to ask for support in the Discord.

ChastyXD: Hello Allis

ChastyXD: I have tried that many times

ChastyXD: but I dont appear there

Allis: ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

kstoqnov: https://www.codingame.com/blog/teach-others-code-streaming/

Jdools05: Hey world chat, I'm relatively new to this site. Is it ok to ask for advice to go about a task? I'm stumped right now but am unsure on how the community views asking for help. Thanks!

ChastyXD: https://www.twitch.tv/chastywi

Tsepeto: guyss

Tsepeto: whaat is entityId in ghost in the cell?

Tsepeto: i don't think it is explained

rwilson: Tsepeto - it's just a unique # that refers to that 'THING' . so on each turn you can know which thing WAS which thing last time, if you happen to care about that.. think of it kinda like a 'name' .. Joe is at x,y this turn ... next time Joe is at A,B

Tsepeto: we talking about factories

Tsepeto: so if a factory has id 1 in one round

Tsepeto: and another one has the same id the next one

Tsepeto: we are talking about the same factory?

CodingCarter: yep, because ids must be unique

Tsepeto: i see, thanks boys

Tsepeto: another question, for ghost in the cell which is not clear

Tsepeto: so in the initialization input you get factory1, factory2 and the distance between them

Tsepeto: factory# is the same as its id?

Tsepeto: it's not explained in the problem

DaNinja: thats right

Jdools05: Hey, does anyone know any techniques to optimize looping through large datasets to speed up the code?

rwilson: Jdools05 - for stuff on CodingGame? if so, that's mostly going to be by analysis, not so much about a particular techique per se. ( example: looking for prime number from 1 to 10 billion -> instead of testing each number for primeness, you KNOW you can skip at least every other, since they'd be divisible by 2 )

Jdools05: yeah i should have made myself more clear, sorry. I'm stuck on Stock Exchange Losses. I have working code that I feel is short, but on the Large Dataset test case, it times out... I don't know what specifically to look for without looping through all the points

rwilson: Jdools05 - for that one it's almost certainly how you're checking for the loss. my tip for timeouts is to pick some key areas in your code to do some debug output of timing information - i.e. poor man's performance profiler.. just to make sure you're targeting the slow parts if you can't spot it clearly from the code alone.

LastRick: jdools05: my guess is you are comparing each value in the index versus any other value in the index that comes later? That's so many checks for the large dataset. There is a smarter way to do it without have to check N vs N-1 so to speak

Jdools05: Thanks, LastRick, I got it all figured out now! :thumbsup:

Mr.Snow: hey guys im new and stuck with temperatures puzzle, i know what to do but im not getting any progress on how to do, my code is returning wrong numbers, i hope you could show me a soloution so i can understand where im wrong.

Mr.Snow: its for c#

Mr.Snow: here's my code https://pasteboard.co/JxYrAhs.png

DaNinja: where are you checking which one is closer to zero?

kevinwalker: *