Kokoz: what is codeforces?
Davide666: what is programming?
Kokoz: I am still trying to figure that out
ableflyer: what is computer
Om1234: tumlog sab makkar ho
Om1234: makkar
Om1234: aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
Davide666: What is Mouse?
TORIBON: What is System.Text?
Davide666: what is try again?
Davide666: fucking error!
Davide666: I LOVE Error (^^)
TORIBON: What is Love?
Davide666: :nerd:
Oklabeer: is C great ?
jacek: then C++ is greater
borrel: @TORIBON the fire of hell and haven combined
MiyamuraIzumi: What is C?
MiyamuraIzumi: a character?
TORIBON: It's a part of dees
MiyamuraIzumi: which multi is fun to practis on mcts?
jacek: uttt?
MiyamuraIzumi: is it complicate to practis mcts?
MiyamuraIzumi: I want a simple one
MSmits: connect 4 is maybe better these days, because you can tell your bot is making good moves or not
MiyamuraIzumi: I am still quite new
MSmits: it is complicated if you have never done mcts before
MSmits: it's kind of a hurdle, to get your first mcts working, because it has several parts
MiyamuraIzumi: yeah I've never done mcts
MSmits: best to google some examples
MiyamuraIzumi: on CG which game is for newbie on mcts like me?
MSmits: I'll find some examples, sec
MiyamuraIzumi: thanks
MSmits: https://www.codingame.com/multiplayer/bot-programming/tic-tac-toe
MiyamuraIzumi: should be multi
MSmits: https://www.codingame.com/multiplayer/bot-programming/connect-4
MSmits: https://www.codingame.com/multiplayer/bot-programming/bandas
MSmits: bandas simulation could be a bit complicated, not sure
MiyamuraIzumi: which one is for newbie like me?
MSmits: but these are games where plain mcts works well
MSmits: uttt or c4 is easiest i think, but neither will be easy
MiyamuraIzumi: thanks
MiyamuraIzumi: I will choose one of them for start
MSmits: uttt has an easy wood league with 3x3 normal ttt
MSmits: but you quickly get out of that
MSmits: I suggest writing a simulation first and testing it
MSmits: before getting into mcts
MSmits: so, make a move generator that find all possible moves and test what happens in your simulation when you apply a move
MSmits: maybe use debug print to print the move list and print the state after applying a move. That sort of thing
MSmits: you dont want to have simulation bugs and mcts bugs at the same time
MiyamuraIzumi: thanks
MSmits: nnp
MSmits: -n
MiyamuraIzumi: ?
MSmits: no problem
MSmits: with one too many n's
MiyamuraIzumi: ah
artymis: hii
Rip86: hi
darkhorse64: just for fun, I tried a Monte Carlo bot for C4 -> #60. Maybe not strong enough for a boss
struct: maybe the current bot with 2ms
struct: could be top 20
struct: :p
struct: But I would not want to share this bot code
struct: So theres that downside
darkhorse64: Same so it must be a different code base. There's euler's C# sample code to adapt.
darkhorse64: euler is #46.
MSmits: btw. Got another level for my oware endgames
MSmits: End games done. Time: 4414 minutes. Seeds: 34
MSmits: 2 more before I stop
darkhorse64: There is now Marchete CGZero to play with
MSmits: he shared his oware thingy?
jacek: CGZero?
darkhorse64: sec
jacek: https://github.com/marchete/CGZero
jacek: oh my
darkhorse64: https://www.codingame.com/forum/t/alphazero-like-implementation-for-oware-abapa-game/191477
MSmits: it's untrained i think
MSmits: and has no nn structure
darkhorse64: An exercise left for the readers
MSmits: thats good, prevents copy pasting
MSmits: I'm gonna use the inferrer for sure
MSmits: but i already could with mokka
struct: already training
MSmits: lol struct
MSmits: I think I may write some tech.io stuff while on vacation.
MSmits: after school is done
MSmits: uttt guide for sure
MSmits: what else is interesting?
struct: I could share the c4 thing but I feel like its a bit too much
struct: Maybe just the scalar version of it would be fine
MSmits: hmm
darkhorse64: writing a new boardgame multi ?
MSmits: yeah it's difficult, the game is so simple that if you share something, you nearly share all :)
MSmits: me darkhorse64?
MSmits: I've never done that, it's not really my thing
struct: I dont even feel like sharing how I update the move mask, because it gave me a slight boost in performance
MSmits: then don't struct. The stuff that is most worth sharing are things that are generalizable
MSmits: not some little trick used in one boardgames
MSmits: like general bitboard tricks
MSmits: or simd
MSmits: stuff that happens in a lot of games
darkhorse64: No, I have two ideas in mind but I'd like to get Legend to SC2021. My BS is working but it's rather weak
jacek: bullshit?
MSmits: ye his bs is not strong like yours jacek :P
darkhorse64: it is yes :sweat:
MSmits: oh beamsearch, i had to think somehow
MSmits: people use mcts with more succes i think though
MSmits: or some variant of it
MSmits: maybe you should do that
darkhorse64: I saw a post from dimasta. I should read all PMs once again
MSmits: yeah, this game had a lot of different approaches
MSmits: as contests go, it was a good one I think
darkhorse64: I fail miserably during the contest and I still feel far from a successful bot. The sim looks OK
MSmits: i did a sim verifier by predicting all opponent moves and the resulting gamestates
MSmits: thats how i found bugs
MSmits: most common bug is simulating what happens when two seeds go to the same spot
MSmits: did you try pruning some stuff?
MSmits: like a fixed order for improving trees during a turn
MSmits: otherwise branching is too great
jacek: branching in trees eh
darkhorse64: Yes, for seeding mostly, I still have to code complete/grow/seed order
darkhorse64: gotta go
punter147: hello people, i am stuck in gold leage in uttt. Any suggestion on improving my solution? I am working now on increasing the number of simulations using bitboard technique.
jacek: mcts?
punter147: jacek yes i am using mcts.
jacek: try: mcts solver, smarter rollouts (avoid losing and make winning moves if possible), fine-tune exploration, add bonus for winning small boards, teccles heuristic opening (make a move that would go back to the current board)
jacek: but if you dont have bitboards now, do it. itll probably give you 10x more simulations
punter147: oh i see. thanks jacek. i will go ahead with bitboards then...
punter147: thanks for the tips on smarter rollout, will try it out, what is teccles heuristic opening tho?
jacek: if you can, make move that would end up in the same board
jacek: i.e. you are on left upper corner, then make move 0 0
jacek: i.e. look here for 20+ first frames https://www.codingame.com/share-replay/563163886
punter147: oh i see. thanks for the clarification jacek. will certainly try this out.
punter147: i found a website that might help newbies get started in uttt. i dont know how it compares to legend bots here on CG but it is a very strong AI. https://www.theofekfoundation.org/games/UltimateTicTacToe/
punter147: super useful to test your AI
punter147: access the setting on the top bar and you can enable AI weights as well. i shows the move that AI thinks is the best given the state of the board.
jacek: nice. though rules on CG are little different
jacek: if no one wins by 3-in-row, then player with most won small boards wins
MSmits: this other game is probably solved as a draw
MSmits: because p2 can succesfully block all 3 in a row attempts
MSmits: but it's much harder to also get an equal number of won boards
jacek: https://minimax.dev/docs/ultimate/
punter147: jacek you are correct. i found it useful to give a general direction of correctness of my ai tho. Do you have any methods to figure out whether the algorithm is actually intelligent? its a randomized algorithm right, so very difficult to say anything until the end of the game. Or am i missing something?
MSmits: do you mean a way to test your mcts?
MSmits: see if it gets better with more rollouts
MSmits: limit calculation time
MSmits: or write a minimax bot as a benchmark
MSmits: with some sensible evaluation function
MSmits: it's not entirely correct to say that mcts is a randomized algorithm
MSmits: it has a random component to it
MSmits: but the result is not random
MSmits: it converges on the best moves if given enough time
MSmits: for example, an mcts bot will always tell you to start in the middle
MSmits: if you give it maybe a few milliseconds
punter147: MSmits yes; I see thanks for the advice. Yeah as you said then the AI must get better given more rollouts per turn.
MSmits: right
punter147: I see this currently with my uttt bot, the AI gets better with more moves(around 60k i saw best performance) squeezing 60k is a huge challenge lol.
MSmits: yes it is
MSmits: wait did you mean 60k moves or 60k full playouts?
MSmits: how do you define a move?
punter147: a move in my case is select the most promising node, then simulate till completion from that node, and then backpropagate.
punter147: rn i can squeeze only 200 rounds on CG. i have many issues tho. for example i do not reuse the tree, i create a new tree each turn. and my MMU is very juvenile as well.
MSmits: reusing the tree is not all that important. It helps a little bit, but it's low priority
MSmits: don't know what MMU is
MSmits: Merry Meth User?
punter147: MMU->memory manager sorry for not explaining, by reading experts posts i realised i need to use pre allocated nodes.
MSmits: ohh ok
MSmits: yeah, but thats pretty easy
MSmits: just make a giant array
MSmits: on a node, you have an index of the position of the first child in that array
MSmits: and a number for how many children
MSmits: then it's easy to loop over the children in the array
MSmits: can also use pointer ofc, but pointers are bigger :)
punter147: but how do i track deallocations as fragmentation is a real problem for me to manage?
MSmits: you dont deallocate
MSmits: they're just there
MSmits: if it's full, you reset, which means you go back to index 0
MSmits: whenever you make new children you set the node properties to the correct values, you dont need to do anything when you're done using them
MSmits: so deallocation is not necessary
MSmits: if you dont reuse the tree, it should not even be possible to use the full node pool
MSmits: with tree reuse it's possible to use all of them, but that'll happen by turn 20-30 or so and that just means you reset all nodes once. Or you risk it and dont reset at all
MSmits: in that case, you keep reusing, but some older nodes will be at higher indices and the new nodes start at 0. If they mix, you're screwed, but that doesnt happen in uttt
MSmits: just make sure your pool has 20 million or so nodes and you'll be ok
MSmits: to be clear, when i say reset, i just mean your current index is set to 0 and your root is the only node in your tree. You just start that turn expanding from root
MSmits: no need to do anything to the full pool
MSmits: (if you dont reuse tree, every new turn is a reset)
punter147: oh i see. i did not think of allocating nodes from front. rn i allocate it from back. and i maintain pointer to last used node to help in using first unused node. thanks for the advice MSmits.
MSmits: not sure what you mean by front and back
MSmits: let me just share my node and node array
MSmits: const int NODE_MAX = 35000000;
MSmits: http://chat.codingame.com/pastebin/d33411e1-4bb9-4514-9c1e-34909d6b8710
MSmits: Node nodes[NODE_MAX];
MSmits: so... just a giant array of 35 million nodes. Memory reserved at start, no need to worry about it
MSmits: as you can see, none of the node properties are set, they are just whatever is in memory
MSmits: when i use them, I set them
MSmits: and when I use them again, I just set them again
MSmits: (dont worry about some of the weird properties, such as having boardindex, moveindex and boardstate, my bot is weird)
punter147: oh i see MSmits thanks for the code snippet. it will be very helpful for me in the future. I will try to implement the ideas you mentioned thanks again MSmits.
MSmits: np
punter147: no worries every bot is special :smile:
MSmits: true
punter147: i will get back to improving uttt bot then. have a nice day MSmits
MSmits: you too
PanGami: :smile:
Menium: has some one a tip for me ^^
Menium: i see that output is +1 everytime
struct: tip for what?
Menium: sry i thought this was in game chat
geekyarthurs: whats up
geekyarthurs: everyone
geekyarthurs: i=input;j=int;l=j(i())
for v in range(l):print(bin(j(i()))[2:])
geekyarthurs: shorten this code
Husoski: @geekyarthurs if you're not using the value of v in that for loop, don't use range(). Use `for v in '*
Husoski: for v in '98
Husoski: for v in 'x'*I()
Husoski: Pardon the oopses. I guessed that you meant range(I()) instead of range(I).
Husoski: Nevermind. That I was lowercase ell. It's still shorter to loop over a length-l string with l*'*' than to type out range(l)
BugKiller_328: when I copy and paste the code from here
BugKiller_328: https://clemg.github.io/pythongolfer/
BugKiller_328: to minify
BugKiller_328: I got an warning like 'detected unusal line terminators'
BugKiller_328: and running is failed with error like 'Syntax Error: unexpected EOF while parsing at ,string> ......
BugKiller_328: any idea ?
KiwiTae: BugKiller_328 whats the golfed code lol
BugKiller_328: tried copy & paste several several times and it worked.
BugKiller_328: but sometimes, I'm getting error like above..
BugKiller_328: one question
BugKiller_328: Is there a way to participate the 'clash of code' for the reverse mode ?
BugKiller_328: I checked my quest and it asked to to win in 'reverse mode'
BugKiller_328: I've participated 20+ times for 'Clash of code' but It was 'shortest code' or 'fast mode'
zsltg: I think it is random, you can only choose it in private mode, but that doesn't count towards your quest as far as I know
BugKiller_328: hmm.. then I need to try again & again and again ?
BugKiller_328: even I solved 20+ problems but I didn't meet the reverse mode yet
BugKiller_328: :(
KiwiTae: BugKiller_328 for the error it prob comes from encoding in utf16, only works if bytes count%4==0 so if you get errors add spaces
mangiacap: im trying to make guitar hero again but program it with personalized songs
zsltg: BugKiller_328 it took me some time too, eventually you'll get it :slight_smile:
KiwiTae: in coders of the caribbean when you fire or drop mines do you slow down or keep momentum?
Probeg: Россия чемпион
SamvelMuqelyan: Пашинян варчапет
DevilJamJar: Someone just got 100% in Clash of Code for raising IndentationError tf
sasuke.programmer: exactly
jacek: oO
sasuke.programmer: can someone explain?
Murat_Eroglu: @DevikJamJar scroll right
Murat_Eroglu: @DevilJamJar scroll right
DevilJamJar: Oh wow lmao
DevilJamJar: didn't even know that minus was valid syntax
Murat_Eroglu: it is not valid
Lucario_41: How do I make an integer = X
Lucario_41: or X=1
Lucario_41: int(x=0) ?
Lucario_41: This is Python 3
NeAlyssa: what do u mean
NeAlyssa: in python u just write
x = 0
NeAlyssa: or if it is input
x = int(input())
BobLob: Could someone tell me why the following line generates a bus error in C? -> for( int x = 0; x < 1101741226; x++ ) printf( "%i\n", x );
BobLob: The bus error is specifically thrown on the prinft(), though I can't think of any reason why it's happening.
BlaiseEbuth: %d
BlaiseEbuth: oh i is an alias
jacek: int initialization in for in C?
BobLob: Yeah, i is integer. I think I found the issue by removing a large block of storage from the program. I don't know why it was throwing a bus error on the printf instead of the storage block, but removing that block removed the error, so I just changed to another algorithm.
BobLob: Yeah, you can both create and initialize inside of for() in C
jacek: oh my
BlaiseEbuth: Memory errors are rarely thrown where they realy are...
BlaiseEbuth: More fun like this.
PatrickMcGinnisII: stdout isn't big enough i guess
BobLob: I was wondering if something like that might be happening, so I started decreasing that large number by half to see when the error occurred. I actually got down to x<2000ish and still got the error, which is what prompted me to look elsewhere. There was no error on the creation of the large array, so /shrug.
FyrstikkoTheCoder: in coders strike back, i just have got into bronze league, but my pod always stop after colliding with the other pod! Help! btw im writing in javascript
BlaiseEbuth: Safety first. Don't collide and you can keep driving.
FyrstikkoTheCoder: ok.
Nekko551XD: people i noticed one thing puzzle the greatest number doesn't have proper solution for one case that isn't tested it should be added just to make it bit more difficult case is if we have positive input 2 or more numbers and a dot then for biggest number from lets say "9 0 0 0 1 0 ."would give 91000 instead of 90000.1
KiwiTae: FyrstikkoTheCoder its prob easy to debug ~ just check where your code crashes
PatrickMcGinnisII: BobLob I would try like 500, I know you aren't exceeding the line limit per print statement ... but that would rule out the buffer overflow if the buffer is only 1k. I do agree that the segfault is prolly somewhere else
AllYourTrees: whats the best way to get the position of the nth bit set in a bitmap?
struct: ctz
struct: https://gcc.gnu.org/onlinedocs/gcc/Other-Builtins.html
struct: ah nth bit set
struct: so its pdep
AllYourTrees: yeah what i'm doing now is clearing lowest bit n times then using ctz
struct: https://software.intel.com/sites/landingpage/IntrinsicsGuide/#text=pdep&expand=4152
struct: _pdep_u64((1ULL << rand(__builtin_popcountll(mask))), mask);
AllYourTrees: ty for sharing wow how do you find this stuff
struct: Well I coded it recently
struct: and I think i have used it before
struct: I cant recall how I found it
AllYourTrees: now the question is can i use it in rust :)
struct: seems like rust has it
AllYourTrees: yep got it working ty struct!
QuickMathzs: heeeeeelloooooo
masknksnvsndvo: what's the best text editor ?
MiyamuraIzumi: something weird going?
MiyamuraIzumi: my CSB bot go into Rank 26 without doing anything
MiyamuraIzumi: yesterday is 55?
Kohsmos: who are higher than you went silver league I think
Kohsmos: oh silver or more higher
MiyamuraIzumi: I am in legend
Kohsmos: sorry
Kohsmos: haha..
MiyamuraIzumi: which is the higher?
Kohsmos: or.. they modified and tested again?
MiyamuraIzumi: must be someone resubmit and win higher rank people but lost to me
Kohsmos: i think so
Plantchant: hi
Plantchant: lick
Plantchant: lick
Kokoz: what is codeforces?
